he is so convincing.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-28-2004
he is so convincing.
4
Wed, 04-07-2004 - 12:47am
It's me again.

I talked to my H tonight again (we haven't really talked in a week, besides being civil to each other). We talked about all sorts of issues, like how he is controlling, makes all the decisions, etc.

He won't agree to go to counseling with me, he says what is the counselor going to do besides get us to talk and we're doing that. He says no money, no time, etc.

The thing is, he always sounds so logical when we're talking, but after, when I sti back and think about what he said, I get mad and upset.

The physical violence was brought up again (he mostly throws things, not at us, but also has grabbed me and the kids roughly on occasion, yells violently sometimes, and looks as though he will hit, and has punched me in the arm a few times, but has never beaten us).

Well, here is what bothers me. He did admit that what he has done is wrong. BUT, he still is trying to get me to own up to my side of it. He says if I didn't badger him to death and let it build up until he blows his top, that this wouldn't happen. He said I have to do my part to help, too. He thinks it's like 50% my fault and 50% his.

A few times he has picked up my dd and pushed her against the wall. Well, he says he is 80% responsible for that, and I am 20% responsible, because he only does it when she yells at the other kids and she sounds just like me. He says I don't discipline the kids enough (which I don't, I know) and so that part of that is my fault.

I told him that it doesn't matter WHAT I do or say, that he shouldn't treat us like that, and he said that it absolutely matters. He said "What if there was a kid in the playground who was teasing this other kid really bad, and wouldn't let up, and the other kid punched him? It's both their faults".

I don't know how much I "badger" him. It's when we're in an argument and I'm trying to get my point across, and he wants to drop the subject. Well, I will keep bringing it up and it does make him mad. He's saying if I just don't do that, he won't get to that point and everything will be fine.

I don't know, do I try to change myself and how I fight to "help" him to control his anger? Or should he just be expected to control it anyway, no matter how we fight?

Thanks.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Wed, 04-07-2004 - 5:48am

He's basically telling you that if you would shut up, be the good submissive little wifey, and let him be the boss and have all the say, then he wouldn't abuse you.

When someone shows you who they are, believe them.

- Maya Angelou

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-18-2003
Wed, 04-07-2004 - 8:34am
Twins~

Oh, I *know* all about the 'sounding logical' side to this. My h has done this for YEARS. We've been married for 15 years and for the majority of the those 15 years--life went the way my h wanted it to go because of his "logic". He planned out everything--and being younger and less wise then him, it seemed to make sense...EVEN IF I didn't like it, it was "too logical" to deny. My h has never physically hit me...but man, there are times I wish he would've....people would have seen those bruises or scars.

My h was also fond of saying that our problems were a "two way street" and it works both ways. Just the other day, I asked my h how I eliminated his self esteem, his self worth, his spirit? I asked him WHAT decisions did I FORCE him into? These things he has DONE to ME....but yet, he couldn't answer my questions...because NONE of that happened to him. Its not 50-50. More like 95-5.....95 is your h's, 5 is yours.

My h tried to tell me he's been functioning in a "daze" a dreamlike state, and he is just waking up now to everything. My h is telling me how he sees how he was abusing me, and keeps apologizing and saying how sorry he is. He said he was in so much pain and had so much anger (not towards me...but I'm not sure from where????) I said to him "but, h, I've been in pain too. I've had anger, too. I have NEVER treated you that way; being in pain and anger NEVER justifies your treatment of me".

My h tactic these days is different than any other time...he is now repentant. He is even coming home so I can go to my DV support groups...he no longer DENIES that he abused me. BUT, I can't seem to overcome the past 15 years. I told him, and keep telling him, that these are the consequences of treating me the way he has for 15 years...if you kick a dog long enough, eventually it bares its teeth. I have been telling him to, that IF he really loves me, he will just let me go...and let him change for him and for the kids, but he needs to take me out of the equation. But the behavior is getting to me and making me doubt myself. I'd rather have the anger or denial....its easier to work with (in a strange way).

And about the "badgering" part....forget it. My h used the same line. In fact, there was NO WAY to ever bring up problems the right way. I was either badgering or bitchy, so sometimes I just layed off...but he NEVER brought up the problems, so they always got swept under the wrong. Its part of the reason that things were never resolved between us...because they were never dealt with. Men frequently fall back to the "she's the nag" business when they want to really avoid something. But that is just a tactic to blow us off, refuse to take responsibility in the relationship, and make us feel "bad" for something that is legitimately bothering us. This, in turn, confuses us and sets us up for more problems later....because if we continually have these MEN define what is SHOULD or SHOULD NOT bother us....after awhile we no longer knows WHAT bothers us because we are too busy trying to figure them out.

I hope this helps. Honey, its NOT YOU. Its him.

big hugs

dharma

iVillage Member
Registered: 04-04-2003
Wed, 04-07-2004 - 10:04am

I agree with everyone else on here too, what Dharma and Sweet told you is right.

iVillage Member
Registered: 08-09-2003
Wed, 04-07-2004 - 4:17pm
okay I need to answer this one before I go back to digging my pond.

MY ex was just like yours... he had a knife at my throat one night.. it was really late and I screamed because I was scared.. my then 5 yr old daughter heard it and told my mother she was afraid her daddy was going to kill her mommy. She was very stressed out.

When I told the ex this.. he immediately blamed ME for screaming... of course he wasn't wrong for pulling a knife on me.. its was my fault she woke up.. see they never own up to their actions.

I'm sorry there is NO excuse for throwing things.. if he gets THAT mad.. take a walk.. chop wood.. whatever and then when you are calmer we can talk about it. These are HIS choices. No amount of spin on his part can make it justified.

I got out because my kids were in danger. I was afraid that if they said something to, say a teacher that child protective services might get called.. then I may have no say in what happens to my kids.. I threw him out and filed for custody right away.

As for him saying you badger him and make him act that way.. mine tried that to. I was supposed to know his mood when he walked in the door and do and say everything to cater to it.. but honestly its all just an excuse on his part.

YOu cannot 'help' him at all with his anger problem.. it has to be all on his own.. But honestly if he wont even go to therapy, i'm not sure what kind of headway you'll make. He is just going to do his best to convinvce you that YOU are the reason he acts that way.

YOu're not.. neither are your kids.

Please remember that.. his actions, his decisions..

Hugs,

Jenna