That scary word...abuse

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-15-2004
That scary word...abuse
10
Wed, 06-30-2004 - 1:04am
After visiting the helpful resource that cuppyis provided, I noticed that it is common to refer to the abuser as "the abuser."

I think this helps my sister's denial and I think it would do the same for similar women who have too much pride to admit that there's trouble in paradise. My sister is tougher than she is stubborn, and she's more stubborn than a rusty nail that I get asked to pull out of a board.

However, that site looks like a description of her husband, with "the abuser" being used in place of his name. But I think because of how "tough" she is, she is convincing herself that she can take whatever he dishes out.

But she closes up at the word "abuse." I often think she'd respond better if I dodged that word and just replaced it with "your husband" or just injecting the definition of abuse there instead.

Does anyone else have that concern or is it best to just call it what it is? Bear in mind, I don't think it's anything other than abuse (it clearly is), but calling it that tends to set her off. She's learning his habits, and has begun acting like him to the point where I'm expecting her to start growing gnarly black back hair one of these days.

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-12-2003
Wed, 06-30-2004 - 3:30am

Lucas, one of the things you have to remember about victims is that often admitting to something, like being abused, is to show a sign of weakness.

CL-Blueliner4

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-26-2003
Wed, 06-30-2004 - 11:33pm
I've thought about that scary word abuse also. After I finished Lundy Bancroft's book "Why Does He Do That? Inside the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men" I could see how much my husband was like the men in that book. The book was recommended to me here. And yet if it had been titled "...Inside the Minds of ABUSIVE Men" I might not have read it, because I didn't think of my husband as abusive. I believe Bancroft must have been aware of this problem and deliberately chose the words "Angry and Controlling" instead. I knew my husband was angry and controlling. But "abusive" seemed like it must refer to other people. Maybe it's one of those hot button words, like alcoholic.

Maaybe you could refer to your sister's husband as angry and controlling.

iVillage Member
Registered: 08-26-2003
Wed, 06-30-2004 - 11:54pm
Hi, I hate to but in, but while posting my own message, I read these.

The first thing to do is get your sis to realize he is a person of his own mind. He will not change no matter what, unless he wants to.

Second, make her remember better times, or make new memories, HAPPIER ONES. Show her the life without throwing her home life in her face. The last thing you want to do is make her HAVE to defend the person she has based her life around.

Last, make sure she is safe, and keep your answering machine off at night. You never know. Call her 5 times a day, and get together when its possible.

And Finnaly, write a response, and I will tell her personally how desperate things can become!!

I apologize if i overstepped my boundires, I am not a member here, just waiting for a desperate response myself.

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-15-2004
Thu, 07-01-2004 - 1:11am
Sometimes I get frustrated with my sister. She said my brother's and my emails to her were "abusive" because we were accusing HER of being abused. I never knew you could accuse someone of being a victim. She did defend her husband, which I wasn't really expecting because there have been times when she went to visit his family and had to leave for a while to "get away from the madness." He comes from a family of yellers/arguers.

The thing that just bothers me to no end is that they have three kids. Those kids all started out like normal kids, but now that the oldest is in school and the other two are talking and playing, you can see his behavior coming out in them. They fight all the time and yell, and the kids get whatever they want because it stops them from whining (is lazy parenting another common trait of abusers?). My brother has decided to keep his kids away from them because he doesn't want his daughters to grow up thinking that behavior like that is remotely acceptable. But every day that goes by when those kids grow up around him (and my sister is acting like him a lot of times too), it just bothers me like I need to step in and somehow do something.

My sister lives a state away, so I don't see them often. And now that I've mentioned that I've noticed his behavior, she is very suspicious of anything I do or say on the subject. And my sister is stubborn, she beats up boys (me included) and has taken advanced karate classes. I can't help but think she'd trying to intimidate her husband so that he may know better than to hit her. If anyone here has words of wisdom to offer to me or to my sister, it is certainly appreciated.

Avatar for ples62
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Thu, 07-01-2004 - 6:59am
lucas - there are a few things that may be very difficult for you to understand. As an outsider watching someone you love be abused is very difficult and prolonged. If you push too hard to get your sister to see that she is being abused - you will get cut off from her - either by her or by her abuser. It doesn't sound like that is what you want to happen.

As someone who has been living the past 24 years in an emotionally abusive relationship, had anyone said to me even 5 years ago that he was abusive - I wouldn't have talked with them again. In talking to my sister, she has told me that my mother tried to tell me that the way my husband was/is wasn't right - I don't remember hearing her, my mother, say anything like that. I do remember my mother being concerned about me. She was quietly and reliably there for me - no matter what her feelings on him were. (Sad thing is, he got to her as well, but that's another story!)

Just as she will learn that she can't change anybody, you must realize that you can't "make" her see anything she doesn't want to or isn't ready to see. Be there for her in a quiet and reliable way. Let her know your opinion - yes. But also let her know that you are there for her, anytime, anyplace. The day may come when something happens that she will be able to "see" as abusive and the light bulb will start to come on.

I watched my brother for years live with a wife, he is still married to her, that was absolutely horrible in an emotional way towards life in general. None of us could understand why he put up with it. But it was HIS CHOICE and just as it is an abuser's choice to do and be they way they are, it is their (your sister, my brother) choice to stay in the relationship.

Don't alienate her by making abuse the topic of too many conversations. Trust me, she will eventually block you out (it's called isolation on her part). Tell her you love her and respect her choices, but also let her know that you will be there, keeping a brotherly eye on her, her children and her safety - then let it go and do as you have said to her - be there for her, watching out for her, but respect her decision.

Just as no one can make you see or feel something, you can not make her see or feel something other than what she chooses to. My advice is to be supportive of HER and her current choices. I'm not saying, never mention abuse to her again, but don't be overly pushy about it.

Hope this helps,

ples

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-15-2004
Thu, 07-01-2004 - 7:27am
I understand that completely, but her bad choices are wrecking the lives of three children. And the cycle starts all over again. It makes me mad enough to vent. I'd love to be the generation upon which the abusive cycle dries up and dies like a weed.
iVillage Member
Registered: 11-12-2003
Thu, 07-01-2004 - 1:57pm

Lucas, I'm going to give you this piece of information, what you and your family want to do with it is up to you:


If you and your family truly feel that those kids are in threat or danger, you can make an anonymous report to CPS in her county and they should start an investigation.

CL-Blueliner4

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-15-2004
Thu, 07-01-2004 - 6:56pm
My family is not in agreement, however. My parents and one of my brothers are in denial. They won't call it abuse because there hasn't been any solid evidence of physical abuse. My sister is a few years older than me, and she is the ultimate authority in my family (seriously, she has more clout than my mom and dad combined). So when she says I'm an "idiot" (yes, that's her word) for saying her husband's screaming and yelling is abusive, then my parents agree with her. The whole family agrees that he gets too angry and yells too much, but wouldn't even hint to my sister that they believe that. The only difference between us wise brothers and the rest of the family is that I have the fortitude to say "abuse" when that's what it is. Everyone else is, frankly, afraid of my sister's criticism.

Burying our heads in the sand is a family tradition.

Avatar for ples62
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Thu, 07-01-2004 - 7:12pm
ah - Lucas - your situation is indeed frustrating. Your concern for your sisters kids is certainly justified. Yes, her bad choices are indeed affecting them and as an outsider looking in it must be very difficult. It does sound like your sister is very stubborn. My advice to you still, unfortunately,is to be supportive of her in a way to stay in her life. How old are her children? What do they have to say about it? Are they in danger physically? Yes, believe me I understand the emotional end of it, I have SO much guilt when I look at my kids. I see, now, the damage they have received for having lived in this family. My dh controlled me so much that I in turn, controlled them and their every move as best I could as we all had to be sure that daddy wasn't disturbed or bothered.

And now my 11 yo son is exhibiting signs of the same type of manipulation that dh uses. But I do talk with my son about it. I am trying to help him find other ways of dealing with disappointment.

Lucas, hang in there for her - whether she knows it or not, admits it or not, she needs you there for her. I don't know if there is any way that you will be able to convince her that her husband is abusive, but you can continue to love her and be there for her.

ples

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-15-2004
Thu, 07-01-2004 - 10:06pm
The three kids are 5 and under. Two Christmases ago, he yelled at his little boy to the point where the child peed his pants. Now, the boy ran into another room and my sister slipped in there and changed his pants. My brother's wife happened to see in that room, otherwise we would never have known about it. My sister explained it away as a coincidence that Angry Daddy was yelling at him when he happened to pee. That's a possibility, because he yells so often, that a pants-wetting could easily coincide with a psycho-rant, making the cause-effect link impossible to prove. Yet she kept it hidden!

Somewhere in her mind she has to know that something's wrong, and it's not that two brothers are being supportive and letting her know they will help.