God, this is so incredibly hard....

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-28-2005
God, this is so incredibly hard....
30
Sat, 10-08-2005 - 3:30pm

We were together from August of 2004-February of 2005 when I broke up with him ....I couldn't take his ambivalent behavior anymore. We had NC for 4 months. After that time I felt strong enough to attempt a friendship with him. We met up one evening and that was it. We were back together. We talked about the main issues and we agreed to try again. He clearly told me that he doesn't want to get married again (he was in a very bad 14 year marriage). That is ok with me. I don't necessarily feel like I need to be married to be happy with him. That was in June.

Things were great for about 2-3 months, actually better than they ever were the first 6 months. He was obviously very glad to be back together with me.....always loving, attentive, called more often. We saw each other about 3 times a week, always staying overnight everytime we're together.

Then we attended a wedding together -his ex-girlfriend's who he is still very good friends with. That's when the proverbial sh** hit the fan. I don't think it had anything really to do with seeing the ex get married. I think it was just the whole marriage thing. Let me add, that in addition to all this he has a huge deadline at work (and has them a few times a year) so he's been working long hours.

During the last 4 weeks he has

-been off and on extremely distant
-has 3 times in a row not initiated intimacy (this is very strange for him and was the first huge red flag)
-did not call on a Thursday night. We always get together on Thursday nights and have dinner together and at the very least give a call to connect and discuss our plans.
-did not call on another night that we usually get togethe and made other plans.
-has made many excuses about what is going on when I asked......don't feel well, have a headache, it's work, it's the kids....yada yada yada

Let me say that in the middle of this 4 week period he came on very strong one night (and I thought things were turning around).....he called ahead to make weekend plans and was extra affectionate and loving......only to turn around and act distant again.

Twice during this time period I came out and said....please tell me what's wrong. I can feel that something is wrong. He never had an answer for me. That just isn't good enough. Sure, everyone has a bad day from time to time, but this goes way beyond that. I am just supposed to act like nothing is happening when his ambivalence is killing me. I have been so emotional lately that I made an appt. with a counselor. Unfortunately she can't even see me until October 20.

Last night was another night that he would normally call. I purposely didn't come home and went shopping with a friend. I am not at all a game player. I am just not ready to talk to him about this. I don't even begin to know what to say.

I realize I should break up with him, but I am just not ready to do that yet. I know that when I do that I will never see him again because I couldn't take it.

I think I'm at the point that I need to be *point blank* with him. When we broke up the first time he admitted that he needed counseling but never got it.

I think I need to basically let him know that if this relationship is important to him, I need him to seriously work on this issue and if that means counseling,..........I want to tell him straight out that I can see he's running away.

He said that these issues have come up in his other relationships. Why would someone not want to get help and feel good about his relationships instead of running away all the time?

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iVillage Member
Registered: 10-09-2005
Sun, 10-09-2005 - 6:49pm

We all have our fears and at what point do we face them? We face them when we know that we have to or we will lose something or not experience something that we really want.

You said you had a great relationship that you were good to him and still you are in the same situation as I am. I was not good to my bf but we had turmoil. We were both very different people and for us to be together it was going to take some extra work. He didn't want to put in the work or he felt like he did put in the work but after three years nothing changed. Now he says he doesn't want to live his life like that. He said he is hurt, he is angry that it didn't work and he is just keeping himself busy until the hurt goes away. He has said he hasn't fallen out of love with me but I don't know any relationship that has ended where one person was not in love anymore. Sometimes I think he is already seeing someone else. I live less then a mile from him and I am constantly passing him in the car. When I go jogging he has driven by me several times. It is hard to get over someone when you see them constantly. My friend lives in the house next door to him and when I go over there I always look to see if anyone is there. I watched her dog this weekend and when I went over last night there was a car in the driveway that I have never seen before. I made up some excuse and I called him. He was very short and mean to me on the phone and I asked him if he had company he said "yes". He didn't even try to offer that it was friend or anything. He obviously doesn't care what wild ideas my head makes up and maybe he is mad because I am so close and he can't make a move without me knowing so he was being defiant. When I went back this morning the car was gone but I could tell it had been there all night because it had rained and where the car had been sitting was still dry. I am starting to hate him because even if a relationship is over does someone have to be that mean? If he would have just flat out told me he doesn't love me anymore then I would at least have something to go on. He has told me he can't go back. He wasn't happy and he felt like he was walking on egg shells all the time. Then the next time I see him he is crying and spends 45 minutes talking to me. Why even talk to me if you are done? Why talk to me for 45 minutes? I feel like he has sent me so many mixed signals and that is why it is hard to let go. I don't know what he sees when he sees me. Does he not feel or see anything anymore? Is it completely gone? If he would just come out and tell me then 'yes' it would hurt but I am already hurting so what is the difference. At least I could say there is no hope and go off and cry and start to let go.

Can't we all be adults? They say they aren't honest and they don't come clean because they don't want to hurt us but "hello" we are already hurting, that is a given, now we just want the damn truth. Isn't that only fair?

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-28-2005
Sun, 10-09-2005 - 7:28pm

You said, "I don't know any relationship that has ended where one person was not in love anymore."

I think I have respectfully disagree...sometimes two people are just not for each other no matter how they feel. Maybe one isn't in love "enough" but I do believe this could happen.

I do believe my boyfriend still has deep feelings....he just can't handle them.

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-09-2005
Sun, 10-09-2005 - 7:47pm
I think you are right, I have had others who have said the same thing. My ex would say "yes I love her but we just can't be together" if he were asked. So tell me why he has all the strength to acknowledge that and to walk away. Why am I not able to do the same. Why am I the one hurting while he is going out having a great time hanging out with his friends. I even sometimes think he has already been with someone else. I did something I am not proud of and I spied his emails and last week there was one from a girl that said she had a lot to say to him and hoped that he would allow her the time to do it in person. She said she missed him. I was totally blown away. How can he say he loves me and then have someone who obviously shared something with him, otherwise why would she say she misses him. I did wind up later asking him if he was seeing someone or if he had slept with someone and he said "no" to both. But if it is true why not just come right out and say it, at least I could step back and refocus and say obviously one of us did not feel the same because moving on for me, right now, is not a possibility. My heart belongs to my ex and until I am free from that I can't be anything to anyone. We talked for 45 minutes in person Friday and he was crying and saying he is hurting to and in the back of mind I think about that email and wonder if he is just taking me on ride. We are all adults. I don't need his sympathy I need the truth. It would help me to move on and not continue to hold out hope.
iVillage Member
Registered: 05-28-2005
Sun, 10-09-2005 - 8:10pm

Well, in some ways, I can relate from your boyfriend's viewpoint, although I was in your situation...weird huh. Since I'm the one that broke up I can very well understand how you can sever ties but still be very much in love. When you get to the point that you are unhappy more often than happy, when you feel that your mental stability is on the line, when you know in your heart of hearts that it will never work out. That may not be your situation at all, but I'm trying to give my perspective.

As sad as I am now, I am relieved that I won't have those huge ups and downs that I had with him. I just couldn't handle it one more time.

Although my boyfriend knows his issues and doesn't choose to get help to get better....he chooses to see himself as a victim. I really feel that he thinks I let him down because he was that victim. I have to figure out why I play that co-dependency role with him.

Incidentally, I sent him a copy of "He's Scare, She's Scared".....He may be pissed at me but he may possibly read it if it is delivered to his front door. I doubt very much that he would ever go out and buy it.

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-09-2005
Sun, 10-09-2005 - 10:33pm

Having that said, can I ask you something? When do you stop trying? You said you could relate to my bf and that was rather enlightening because I want to hear all sides. I can agree with you but in my mind if we love each other why can't we try to work it out? It is not like we had major problems, we just had a hard time understanding what each other needed to be their own person as well as a person in a relationship. From my stand point I am a fighter. I won't throw in the towel the minute things get tough. On the same token I believe in love. How strongly we felt for each other should have given us the fuel to work it out. He will say he tried for three years and nothing changed. I disagree. He tried in a manner that he thought would benefit him not in a way that was going to change how we interacted with one another. I really felt like we had the foundation to make things work. He was definitely against counceling. For one he doesn't believe in it and for another he said if you have to go to counceling before you are married then something is really wrong. I disagree. He is not perfect, he can be very difficult and I think he suffers from some sort of depression which makes finding harmony with him difficult.

You sent him a book? Do you think that will make him mad? Even if it does, if he ends up cracking it open maybe it will be an eye opener for him. I have not heard of this book, what is it about? Maybe I could benefit from it because right now I am not opposed to any kind of self help therapy.

Java

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-28-2005
Mon, 10-10-2005 - 7:22pm

To Java...

When do you stop trying? When the relationship hurts you too much and you are tired of being in pain or when it confused you so much that you don't know what's up and what's down. Your relationship was very different though. You said that you didn't have major problems. We had major issues....mainly my boyfriend, issues he wasn't willing to work on. I was deeply affected by that. I'm a fighter, too, to some exent, but when I feel that there is no way something will work out, I give up because I can't stand the pain that it will cause with no possible good outcome. Again, our situations are so different here.

One thing that is similar though. Both our exboyfriends are resisting counseling....that says, to me, that they either don't love us enough to do what it takes to try to make things work or they are too scared. Sad.

As for him being mad at me? What does it matter to me. I'm doing it from a loving heart and if he doesn't wish to see it that way, there's nothing I can do. There's certainly a better chance that he'll read it if it's delivered on his doorstep. Hell, maybe I'll even tell him it's coming.

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-28-2005
Mon, 10-10-2005 - 7:27pm

Got an email from him today.....he is obviously in denial about some things, mainly the fact that he doesn't see that his behavior changed, when he had tons of excuses for it on Saturday. From the tone of the letter he sounds hurt to me. Also, his phone is still off the hook - maybe that's why he couldn't hear it ring?????

Here's the letter:
*****************************************************************************************
I am not upset with you at all. I didn't think my phone was off the hook. I have been home alone all weekend and didn't hear it ring at all. I came down with a bad cold this weekend and have been going to bed pretty early so I am not sure what time you tried to call.

I didn't realize that I changed that much in the past month. I even warned you about 10 days ago that you may not see or hear from me much in the next couple of weeks because I was going to be busy with work..do you remember me saying that? Then the next thing I know you are all pissed off because I didnt want to get together last Sunday night.

Yes, I have been thinking about this other woman. I have not seen or spoke to her in at least a year but I do still think about her. Chances are nothing is ever going to come of it. And I wasn't thinking about her when I was you.

I am sorry you feel betrayed. I do love you and I care for you alot. I am obviously just not ready to move forward in a relationship right now.

I want to return your book to you. Let me know if its ok to drop it off.

Bye
*****************************************************************************************

How sad is it that we can't tell each other "I love you" until we break up...that's what breaks my heart.

I think I may try to be friends with him for awhile if he's ok with it. I can always start NC if it is too hard, at any time. I'll be up front with him, though, regarding that matter. Who knows, he may just want to say goodbye. If we remain friends, I think that email is the only way to go for now. I could never see him, at this point, even hearing his voice would hurt.

I know that you will all say not to do it, but you know how you have to learn from your own mistakes.....

iVillage Member
Registered: 08-11-2004
Tue, 10-11-2005 - 3:37pm
I have been reading your email for the past few days and have to say i can totally relate. My ex actually said to me that the plans he made with me were just a heat of the moment thing and he spoke to soon and wasnt ready for anything, he came on like a whirlwind the first few months with the roses, the i love you cant live without you stuff, and then it just slowly went away until the last month was just hell with us fighting all the time because i could feel him pulling away and i just held on tighter until it became clear he didnt want to be with me anymore, was dating other people, and didnt have the guts to say anything and still denies that he was with anyone else that it was just me and my holding on too tight that sent him away and that I need to get some help because I am very insecure! And i too have made the same mistakes, we work together, so i of course started the gossip with the he is a lying cheating jerk around the office, and he comes off looking like the hero because he doesnt say a word about anything and I just look like the bitter ex while he just looks at me like I am just a sad pathetic loser who cant live without him, and I am angry at myself because my heart is on my sleeve, and he too is belittling to me, i attempted to call him and he just hung up on me, said he has never been in such a draining relationship and wants no parts of me,that he cares about me but he just cant be with someone like me. so why would i miss someone who says they love you and want to spend the rest of their life with you "in the heat of a moment" and not mean it ? And calls you insecure and belittles you ? I dont know but I do miss him and want the life I had with him this past year back and am having trouble letting go, also because I became very close with his family and now, I obviously will not be speaking to them again and that hurts too, Me and his mom even spoke of what kind of wedding we would have, where, etc, and then he just lets go, i dont get it
iVillage Member
Registered: 02-23-2005
Tue, 10-11-2005 - 3:58pm

Were you two actually broken up yet? Sounded like he broke it off in the letter. It was one of those "i love you but i'm not in love with you" bits, and doesn't want a relationship. He isn't in denial, he's been avoiding you and making you feel guilty for blowing it out of proportion. He doesn't want anything to do with you or your book. It sounds very harsh but he's a coward and wants out. I'm really sorry that you are hurting over this guy.

I know you have decided to go forward and hit the wall running before you are ready to let go so I can't give you much advice. I would suggest not settling for a friendship but you won't realize that until you try and feel the pain that comes with it. He isn't going to be a good friend , and it is just a way for you to hold on to him. It's a miserable way to be. Did you read the post that had the article linked to breakupsurvivor? I would recommend that.

Best of luck
Gracie

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-28-2005
Tue, 10-11-2005 - 7:06pm

Actually, Gracie, if you read through the thread you would have seen that I broke up with him, because of his ambivalance about our relationship. He hasn't been avoiding me really either, as we've been in communication every other day or so, mostly on his part. I'm just not sure you have a clear picture.

But you are right about one thing...he isn't ready for a relationship. I just sent him the last correspondence and told him everything I needed to say for closure. I, also, told him that I wouldn't be able to maintain a friendship with him, but wished I could. I did NC when we broke up last time and it helped a lot.

Thanks

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