I didn't sleep with him
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| Sat, 08-07-2004 - 10:17am |
So, what the crap is going on here? I would have just gone for a straight-up roll in the hay, but the whole atmosphere was very first-date like, with a slight edge of sexual tension but nothing overt, overlaid with an easy familiarity and intimacy that made it really weird. Plus, the way he was acting, I felt really weird about "making a move," like it would be deflowering a virgin or something, there was a feel of attraction and affection between us but he seemed so shy or something that I just wasn't getting a clear sexual vibe. And I initially thought, well, he just doesn't want to sleep with me. But he kept telling me I was gorgeous all night, talking about how men at the courthouse remarked on some of the women lawyers and he'd heard someone talking about me (hot and damn smart, tough combination), and I caught him gazing at my cleavage on more than one occasion.
He keeps wanting to spend weekends with me, called and emailed twice to confirm last night, apologized profusely when he got a call from work and had to excuse himself (he didn't want work to intrude on "our time" - and, yes, it really was work, I overheard the convo about filing motions), acted really date-like rather than friend-like. He was a "perfect gentleman" at dinner, we shared stories, he listened attentively, he was just very attentive to me, period, making sure the waitress got my drink refilled, opening doors, guiding me around a pothole as we walked out, telling me he'd had a lovely evening at the end. He went to elaborate lengths to mention that he had no plans tonight other than detailing his new car, which should take several hours. Why is he wasting my time, here? I mean, we're not getting together Sunday afternoon to go the museum, we're out til the bars close on Friday and Saturday nights, and he's acting like we're dating (except, of course, we're not sleeping together). And I'm half helplessly in love with him and half frustrated out of my mind by this crap. I am increasingly coming to believe that he is just trying to demonstrate that he's not a complete a--hole. But why go to all this trouble? Like, okay, maybe he gets some sort of personal satisfaction from not being perceived as a complete jerk, but why waste it all on me if he's not going anywhere with it, why spend his weekend nights on his best behavior on dinner-movie dates with his *ex*?
I have to stop seeing him. Last night, after the movie, I stopped at the ladies' room and as I headed out of the theater he rushed forward to open the door for me, and I found myself reaching up to rub his back and put my arm in his, just pure habit, and I was surprised I had done it, but he seemed okay with it and opened my car door and told me what a lovely night he'd had as soon as he got in. And crap like that is just killing me. We didn't just meet. We're not just starting dating. He hasn't said anything about being "friends" in like a month, but I can't tell if he thinks we're dating or just "hanging out." I need something else, I need a conversation about "us," I need to understand where he's coming from. After repeated events like this, I'm starting to think this is it, this is what he wants from me, just this weird, virginal almost-dating thing. It's wasting my time - why am I spending Friday night with him when I could be out with a guy who's clear that he's dating me? And seeing him again just makes me stupid, makes me love him, makes me forget he was a jerk when I needed him, but even though I left him it's like this whole weird "friends"-like thing is some sort of rejection. It's just not a good idea. I'm planning to get away to the lake for a long weekend this afternoon, I have to just make a break with him and have no more contact, it's too confusing and it hurts to keep doing this.
Anway, for those who were curious, that's how it went.
Edited 8/7/2004 10:42 am ET ET by milton333

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Have you considered writing out a list of questions for yourself... and then answer them honestly with the first thing that comes in your head? I do that and it helps me clarify what I'm feeling and what it is I'm afraid of... for me it's that if he leaves I may end up alone and childless forever (I'm 36 so maybe not that unrealistic of a fear)... but then as I think about it... heck I have spent several yrs alone while being married to a man that could not and would not commit to the marriage.
So... If you go back to this man, do you think he is going to change?
If you have a relapse with your illness, will you be able to forgive him if he is not suportive again?
Is a man who can't support you during one of the most critical points in your life someone you want in your life?
Is this the way a friend would treat you?
Do you have expectations of him that you know, deep down, he can never meet?
These are the tough questions that may give you some perspective... I know when I asked them of myself, I was mad, really ticked, for about a week because I hated the answers I had to give... sounds to me like you are too smart and too hot to be anyone's second best. So am I! Take care of you and stay tough... you are your only priority now.
I hope you're able to stick with your resolve to not see him any more for the time being.
Sheri
"It has been really nice seeing you again. For me, at least, being in contact again has really broken down a lot of the residual bitterness and anger I felt after the breakup.
But while seeing you is nice, it is also confusing. I was put off-balance by Friday night, for me it really has not been enough time for us to be sitting next to each other in the movie, or across from each other at dinner, as if we were strangers or casual friends. It felt very familiar, just like it hadn't been months since we'd last done that, just like we were still together. It was really disconcerting, because not only are the habits still very strong, so are the feelings. While not all of those feelings are good, or loving, they are all still quite intense, and that makes it difficult for me just to "hang out" as friends. Time together right now is likely to be loaded not only with familiar patterns and lingering feelings, but also with painful and awkward reminders that we're not together.
Additionally, right now I can't overlook that, despite everything that happened during my cancer episode, I tried to work it out, I've told you that I loved you and always would, and your response has consistently been to tell me that our relationship was some terrible nightmare from which you are glad to have awakened, evidently without any remaining feelings for me. I don't mean for that to sound accusatory, but we really are not on the same page at the moment, and I'm not sure what we accomplish by spending time together given that that is the case.
If what you want from me is friendship, that's a fine thing, but for me it is too soon. And if you want to be friends, there's no reason we can't check in with each other again in a few months with some more distance from "us." People's feelings change at different paces. I'm glad that you're comfortable with being friends and that you do not have those residual feelings for me; I need more time to get to the same place. I know where to find you when I'm ready."
Should I send it? Should I just not contact him without further explanation and delete my draft email? Argh, I'm so just upset and wired right now, I want this all to stop.
So, I'd cut it down to a few sentences...basically, that you're not ready to be friends yet, and that you'll be in touch when you are.
Sheri
Also, prepare yourself for the possibility that he may not even respond to this e-mail if you were to send it in its present form. How would you feel then? Don't give him this control.
~Claire
I've been keeping up to date as to your situation but decided to write something now.
Have you been feeling like there is so much to talk about but really nothing to say to him? Thats how I feel about my ex. Even though he has not contacted me (3 months almost) I feel like if he did, there would be so much I want to tell him and talk to him about regarding our relationship, but at the same time, I feel like it woudl fall on deaf ears, because, as you said, we are in different places.
He would only deserve your indepth thoughts if the paths of communication were already open. From what you have been writing they are not. If anything the both of you are tip-toeing around eachother, most likely trying to figure the other out. This is no way to deal or settle things and certainly is not an atmosphere conducive to re-starting a relationship together.
If he really knew that he wanted to be with you, that after several months of introspection and/or counselling that he has figured out why he did what he did to you he would be clear in his apology. Right now it looks like he is appeasing his guilt i.e. if she is willing to go out with me and be wooed by me, i couldnt have been so bad. If he understood the root fo his actions and the deep pain it caused you, he would offer his apology clearly and explicitly and with no expectation of forgiveness, sex, dinner etc.
He is still doing the same thing to you, although now it is masked by niceness which of course makes it that much harder for you.
No one here can judge you for seeing him, i don't know if i would do the same but it wouldnt surprise me. I think sometimes we like the game and we like to leave it while on top. We are human, and addictions and habits are difficult to break. You are everything he said you were, especially strong and with an intense awareness of yourself. You've allowed yourself to reconnect with him, for your reasons, all of which we understand. And now you have reached your limit, because really nothing has changed.
Give him what you want, whether its the full explanation of the letter or not. I think its key to be truthful to yourself. If you feel he deserves the full reason why you have to cut him off, give it to him. Also know that if he does not contact you, he respects you enough to not play games. If he does, he has changed even less than you think.
Take care milton,
Mel
I am not sure what you really want...do you know? It seems like you want him to admit that he wants to be more than friends and wants to rebuild the relationship with you. I think whatever you want to do is fine...but you have to figure that out. You need to decide if you want to give the relationship a chance to work out again or do you just want to be friends or do you need some distance to be friends. Clearly the ball seems to be in your court at the moment. You can let things go on as is or you can choose to change the rules of the game you are now playing.
I clearly am not one to judge as I am often posting here just to get feedback and not necessarily to do something. This board often provides me with a barometer of whether I am so far off base or not. I do not have many folks who I can talk to about my situation and so I turn here. I think in a sense you are doing the same thing...trying to figure out what path to take. The problem is - only you know what you really want and you have to be honest with yourself. It seems like you have a good time when you are together and yet you are not sure where you want it to head. Are you afraid he will reject you? Or are you afraid that he won't?
tb
There is not an easy answer because the relationship is just too hard. Sure you love him, most of us love our exes. But the sad thing is you need A LOT more than love to make a relationship work.
You were strong and doing well for a long time. Now he is back and you are going to have to start the grieving process all over again.
He did some really bad things... things that most would consider unforgivable and certainly things that you would not want from someone who you would spend the rest of your life with. Even if he said he was sorry for all of these things... does that really matter? I would think at the time, he probably is not too sorry.
You have your act together, you sound like a catch... why waste your time on someone who is not right for you. As much as you love him, I am sure that you can admit that he is not right for you.
Just my 2 cents....
First, you already know this- but only you can decide what is right for you. I too use this board as a sounding board to figure out what is going on or if I am so off base that I need to re-evaluate what I am thinking or doing.
And you and I have alot in common. I was diagnosed with ovarian cancer almost 4 years ago. My husband was not there for me. They came out of the OR in the middle of surgery and told him that I had cancer and they would have to take everything out. He then left and went to a freshman high school football game where he is the assistant coach. I woke up and no one was there. He arrives 4 hours after I am in my room and said he thought it would be awhile and wasn't thinking. Our marriage was already not great and that just tipped things over for me. My X who I had known for over 20 years was there for me. Called me to find out what had happened and just supportive. He was and has always been my best friend for as long as I can remember.
I am also in a high pressure field- I am a physician. I think of myself as a strong, independent woman who should know what she wants and be able to handle almost anything that comes my way.
So what do I think-- people make mistakes. We are all human. We do things that we regret and would rather not have done. Your X clearly made bad decisions in the past, but to me if you really love someone you can forgive them. So the question is- first does he realize that he screwed up? Why not just ask him directly. If you are friends you should be able to do this. Ask him if he knows how much his actions in the past when you were dealing with the cancer hurt you? You may need to be specific- but I would ask-- isn't that what you want to know? So why play games? If he is not sorry -- it is over and you can move on.
If he is sorry then I would tell him how hurt you were in the past by his actions and that how he acted made you feel...however you felt.. and then tell him how you feel now after he has said he was sorry ...see how he responds.
If you feel like he truly is sorry for what he did and learned from that then you next decision is what is going on now...does he want to be more than friends and give the relationship a chance? How do you find this out? I would just ask...maybe not directly but say it seems like things are not quite just friends and you are not sure exactly what is going on...you can keep it open and again see what he says. I realize you do not want to be hurt...but I truly believe in people and each of us has the capacity to change and grow and learn from our mistakes. Give him the chance to be the man you thought he was.
Milton- there are no guarantees in life...you know that. We all have to take chances...but the chances are worth it. I would never want to live life with regreat at not having at least taken the chance to have what I always wanted. Life is too short and the hands we are dealt are not always fair...but we are the ones who can change things...so Milton that is what I think. I know I am in the minority...just my thoughts.
tb
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