The longes post in history.. got time?

iVillage Member
Registered: 08-01-2007
The longes post in history.. got time?
16
Mon, 08-06-2007 - 9:48am

Ok, I am writing this in hopes someone can tell me if I made the right choice. I have mixed views on what I chose to do, through friends, family and co-workers. Granted I don’t tell the world my problems, when it comes to my immediate surroundings, but, I thought I could get a good consensus on the boards here. Maybe through the majority rules property, I can make a good assumption. Lol

Anyways, a little about myself, male, 40yrs old, engaged before but never married, centered life on my career, which did hamper some of my relationships. 9 years military didn’t help much early on in my life, then finding out the outside world doesn’t see military experience, (unless you are law enforcement or security) any experience at all, even though I have a technical background. So, starting over in the workforce I had to “get caught up in my goals” , hence the damper on a personal life.

Until 6 years ago, I met the most wonderful woman, lets caller her “J”.

We met over the internet, and on our blind date , I didn’t expect really much , just to sit down have drinks and nice conversation and just be on about our way, really convinced that she had lied either about her appearance, demeanor, or something. I am sure she was thinking the same. Wow, I was surprised, she was beautiful, smart, we loved the same music, we like to go out. She was also in the midst of a divorce , being separated and living on her own for about 6 – 8 months, I didn’t find that a problem, she seemed stable and over him. I even asked about him and how she felt about him and no tear was shed, she said she was not sorry it happened and just wanted the papers signed.

She told me she was very attracted to me and I had to say, I had fallen for her. We got along great.

A few months later we moved in together, right after 9-11, we both loved each other, we were both worried about the economy and after the attacks, didn’t really want to live apart either. I moved her out of her apartment and into my house, she didn’t have too much to bring over, so she moved in her most valuables, sentimental stuff , knick knacks and family heirlooms. The rest we rented a storage place for stuff I had to move out and the rest of her stuff she wanted to keep for when we got a bigger house. That is how it all began…

Here is where it gets interesting.

After about 2-3 months J starts talking about marriage, and I was not surprised, and well prepared for it. We sat down and talked about marriage , kids and future. I told her I saw a long a fruitful life together and not to worry , when I felt the time was right I would ask her. She convinced me she was very content with that, for I did well mean it, I was very much in love with her and we both were not getting any younger, and we worked together well and she was my queen , who treated me like a king. What more could I ask for.

We get along fine until in my lack of completely washing my past life from my house, she finds things from my past relationships. Pictures, letters, clothing and presents from women that didn’t really mean that much to me, they didn’t effect me like she had. Still my queen she was, I apologized from the bottom of my heart for my lack of a full combing of my house. Ahhh but that didn’t matter, I had pictures in my picture album from my ex fiancée, from 15 years ago, that was not going to work for her. Mind you , this was packed away not out on display either nor was there any nudes.

She told me to get rid of them, and I said, I didn’t expect her to get rid of her pictures of her marriage or past relationships, nor should she expect it from me, and that was a thorn in her side, to this day I think. I am sorry for that. The marriage thing came up again, actually threatening me with it, on how things will all be better with HER once we are married���

Then early 2002 my dad was diagnosed with cancer, it was the most devastating thing in my whole life. My dad, my hero, and my confidant on everything I needed to know about the world, is going to leave me.

J knew this was going to devastate me, she backed off a bit on the marriage, past life and future expectations of us and compassionately stood by me to support me. I was ever so grateful when she told me she would do all she could to help me through this.

Well, I started flying up every weekend to help mom and dad prepare the house the owned for 30 years. New washer, dryer installed, new water heater, roofing fixed, gutters cleaned, my dad wanted it all prepared for mom , when he was gone, so I went up and did the work.

J had a huge problem with this, said it took time away from us, and we had our own problems to contend with. What happened to the stand by me and support me?

I used up a considerable amount of my savings flying up there every month to do this, my brothers were no help, they still were asking my dad for money on his hospital bed.

January 2003, my dad passes away, no pain, no worries, just slept and never woke up. I was crushed, Even at 35, at that moment, I “grew up” so fast it hurt. I didn’t have that wealth of information to confide with, from construction, mechanics, to how to treat women with the utmost respect and gentlemanly like that no one on that earth has ever seen. Even through the worst of times my dad taught me how to deal with someone you love that can be hurtful to you.

3 days after the funeral I get home, unfortunately due to her job, J could not make the funeral, that was a bad time, I needed her so much. After the usual homecoming greeting of kiss, tears, I love you, and I miss you. The next words that come out of her mouth are “ well, now you will have time to spend with me.”

That was the dagger that split my heart, as you can tell, I have never gotten over those words and to this day, I can still hear her say them. For 2 months after that, there was nothing that she wanted to talk about other than marriage, and as god as my witness, it was 24/7. The issue of the past relationships and pictures came up numerous times, throwing them in my face, being very hateful about it. What did I do, I just came back from my dads funeral, and I feel I have no life in me. She went on and on , stating I spent most of my money to go up and help my family when she had to stay here and work. How it was not fair that my family got my help. Sigh

She even resorted to snide remarks, I hid in my computer room when she got mad, just playing games, I tried to deal with her on it, but, after a loss as I had, it was tough, and I was short tempered. Heck, after she started all this hurtful remarks , our sex life began to diminish , she even through that in my face , then right after that, expected me to be turned on and have sex with her, cause if I didn’t , she would leave.

What was I to do, she was my queen, I didn’t want her gone, I wanted her to understand my and our situation, and just ask to be patient. I wanted her love and support and to love and support her. That was not to be.

Then, one day, after another round of her constant remarks, I just snapped and told her she needs to move out.

Here comes the tears. “Why? What did I do? Please don’t do this!!” She had pushed me to the point, where I honestly thought I was going to physically hurt her and for her own safety and my own sanity and clean criminal record, she should move out.

We continued to see each other ,in living separate arrangements, maybe to give me time to mourn my loss, doing this alone sucked, but, she was not there for me, even in my time of tears. Maybe this was to show her I was not going to put up with the remarks and bickering when I was there to love her , and in hopes , she would love me, through thick and thin… etc. God knows I loved every inch of her. God also knows I am not perfect, and its not all her fault we didn’t get along sometimes.

So, about a year goes by and things seem to be ok, we are getting along well, we move back in together, all is well. I am all about second chances and I thought this was going to work. Mind you not all our problems were caused by her, but, I didn’t expect much of her, really all I wanted from her was to be nice, and, well, sometimes she didn’t want to be. Plus I asked for something else , as you will read below.

During this time we had been living apart she started going out with her friends more. Of course her friends don’t like me, cause I am the BAD MAN for what I did. As she goes out with them, she starts drinking more…. And driving……..

So, while we live together, she goes out with her friends, that is cool, everyone needs a girls/boys night out, not a problem. But I tell her if she needs a ride, call me. What does she do, she drives home drunk… and I will not put up with that. I have lost friends to drunk driving, I don’t want to lose the one I love, from either dieing or killing someone else and going to jail or something. Oh wait, did I mention that makes me controlling?

So, now, to her, I am controlling her, cause I don’t want her drinking and driving. She fully thinks that its ok, she used to do it in college, no problem, she drives fine that way.

So, here it is, now I am controlling, my past life effects her, I don’t have sex at the exact moment she wants it, I spent my money helping my mom get ready for losing my dad, her friends don’t like me cause of how she tells them I treat her, and I have already kicked her out once.

So one day, and I remember this well, after about 5 hours of her snide remarks about how our life sucks because we are not married, I could feel that feeling of the brink coming , she comes back with a “you know we aren’t going to work out if we keep going this way?”. My immediate response= “you’re right, pack your stuff and start looking for another place to live.” I went cold. Once again I felt that it was hitting that point of getting out of hand, and I was really questioning her love for me, or just her desire to be married, and just to BE married, and not particularly to me. For the longest time, she said she wanted to be married, yet, she never said she wanted to be married to me.

Ok, now that you have heard only ¾ the story, there is much more… the real horror and heart break comes later after we are living apart again.

My question to you is….

1) Do you think I was in the right to ask her to move out? Whether it be the first time or the second time , please comment.

2) Do you think its right we are not together?

3) WHY CAN’T I GET OVER HER? I love her so much, at least the side that treated me so well…. Yes I cant let go…. we have talked, but both knowing we are broken up, but I feel that twinge of how much I love her and want to hold her again.

Thank you… I am sorry this is so long, but I felt I had to tell the whole story.
BnT

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iVillage Member
Registered: 06-06-2007
Mon, 08-06-2007 - 11:16am
So, is her main issue with you that you two aren't married? Is that where the arguments really begin? Besides the other issues like the drinking and driving which is understandable and stupid on her part. It is kind of hard to get the full picture. Do you think maybe you moved in together too quickly? Is she once again moved out? It sounds like there are some serious issues to resolve before living with each other again...if that is even an option at this point. I do have to say that if you do get back together I would not co-habitate until you KNOW you are ready and can communicate with each other without feeling so angry with each other it turns completely ugly and possibly out of control.
iVillage Member
Registered: 08-01-2007
Mon, 08-06-2007 - 12:51pm

I would have to say , yes, not being married is her top complaint, she says being married would make everything ok, yet I have to disagree. Yes, it is a sacred rutual, but I dont think it changes someone. She says it actually shows commitment, and I understand that in a way, but, getting angry about it is not the way to make someone want to marry you. She had low self esteem, even though, I thought of her and would reassure her of being the most beautiful woman on this earth.

Then the issue with me "controlling her", along with not letting go of my past is also a constant issue with her.

We are not living together at the moment, nor talking, and I am sure that will never happen again.

My main questions where, do you think my decision was right in asking her to move out?




Edited 8/6/2007 1:00 pm ET by brokenandtorn
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Registered: 06-06-2007
Mon, 08-06-2007 - 12:58pm
Well, from what you've said I would say yes, you made the right decision. That isn't a decision to make lightly and I'm guessing your instincts told you it was over. I'm in my mid-thirties and I know when you start getting a little older those life decisions aren't made on a whim. I think on her part, she's recently divorced, partying, living-it-up so to speak...and then pressuring you to tie the knot? I'd be skeptical of that too. I'm sure you miss her and she misses you but if, in your heart, you know it wasn't working then you made the right decision and you can trust yourself on that. I hope I wasn't too wishy-washy :)
Avatar for northwestwanderer
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Registered: 03-26-2003
Mon, 08-06-2007 - 12:59pm

I think that if you're in a committed relationship, you do everything you can to make it work--asking the other person to move out is the last resort after you've done counseling, etc.

So, no, I would not agree that asking her to move out was the right thing to do, without having taken steps like attending couples counseling first (I apologize if you said you did that in your post and I missed it).

Sheri

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Registered: 05-15-2006
Mon, 08-06-2007 - 1:08pm
This is only my opinion: ( I read that long post and I think I'm entitle to give it to you) LOL. I come from a very old fashion family where its taboo to just live together without NO MARRIAGE DATE IN SIGHT. I know!!! I can understand where she is coming from, since we only have to go with your side of the story. If you love her so much and see a future with her, why not get at least engage. Even if its a long engagement. You two already live together and playing house. If I treat you like king, we both see a future together and we already co-habitate, I would want the ring and the husband. To some people it might not mean much, but to others marriage means commitment and security. It will also mean that you cannot kick her out everytime she nags you or get on your nerves. Do you ever think of just taking a long walk to calm down? Why everytime you two have a fight, she has to leave? She might not feel too secure with you and I don't blame her. Now, it seems like you two have a problem communicating. If you really want this woman, you going to have to step it up a notch. The only thing she has is your word, sometimes that's not good enough. Don't ask her to move in with you again unless you are ready for the long haul. I also suggest you see a marriage councelor. Find somebody impartial that will hear both sides and help you come up with the best decision... Good Luck!!!
iVillage Member
Registered: 06-06-2007
Mon, 08-06-2007 - 1:13pm
I am totally in agreement with that. I do not take it lightly either. I was giving him the benefit of the doubt...that he did not do it on a whim, there has to be more to the story. I don't think anyone thinks it's okay to kick someone out to the curb. I wanted to clarify that...
iVillage Member
Registered: 08-01-2007
Mon, 08-06-2007 - 1:16pm

No, I am sorry, I forgot to post that.

She found a counselor through her job and actually went without me on her first session, then came back to me and basically told me that the counselor said that our problems are my fault and that I need to go in with her.

Now, my first impression already after she tells me that is, she either told the counselor strictly her side of the story or she was not telling me the truth. I asked to go see another counselor and not make this a bidding war, someone she and I have not seen before and we would go into together, she refused and would only see this one. See, I also could get counseling through work. So, once again, we were at a head, she wanted to see her counselor cause she was immediatly on her side, or so I am told, and I just wanted to see a person who is nuetral and new to our problems.

I didnt like the thought of counseling first, with all the people I have seen try it, 99% still don't stay together, but, I did agree and she only wanted it with someone she basically claimed on her side. Why would a counselor say that? I thought they were suppose to be bias.

Anyways, thank you for your opinion, as small as it was, we attempted to even try and go to counseling, but, we didnt make it past the door to the car.

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-15-2006
Mon, 08-06-2007 - 1:20pm
I'm sorry learning to leave. I didn't have a problem with your post. I meant that for the OP.
iVillage Member
Registered: 06-06-2007
Mon, 08-06-2007 - 1:24pm
Oh no, no...I just wanted to make sure :)
Avatar for northwestwanderer
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Registered: 03-26-2003
Mon, 08-06-2007 - 1:33pm

A couples counselor should be unbiased but if you're seeing someone individually, then the counselor being biased towards you and what's best for you isn't generally an issue. But I agree, your ex should have been open to seeing someone new rather than trying to make her individual counselor into your couples counselor.

But, to quote Dr. Phil, I guess it comes down to, what was more important to you, trying to save the relationship, or being right? If you'd at least tried going to her counselor, you might have been able to persuade her that getting a separate couples counselor was a good idea. But that's all water under the bridge at this point. I'm not sure what benefit it is to try to look back at your decision to ask her to move out and decide if it was "right" or not, frankly, but that's the question you asked ;-).

If you're interested in learning and growing from the experience for future reference, I'd suggest reading the latest books on relationships/marriage by John Gottman and Terrance Real. Both are very research-focused and really get into what WORKS in relationships.

Sheri

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