Unrealistic expectations?

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Registered: 07-14-2007
Unrealistic expectations?
4
Thu, 08-30-2007 - 1:23pm

I predominantly wanted to pick our Dear CL's brains about this, but any response is welcome.

There has been a bone in my throat all this post-break time up no matter how much I try to forget is well, oddly enough, one of those problems we were never able to resolve. I was reading Sandra's post on unrealistic expectations and well, I wanted the opinion of a more clear-headed party to answer this.

So, I am originally from Toronto and I met my ex at school in Montreal, where the language is Quebecois French and the unofficial sport is Anti-Toronto (and no I'm not joking). My French is ok-ok, but the 'dialect' is different from the one I schooled in. To illustrate, it's like getting someone who understands Middle American English to suddenly comprehend Scottish slang and accent.

In any case, the first half of the issue that came up constantly was the fact that I thought his friends were rude. They all speak fluent English, but refuse to do so when I'm here, so I'm left sitting there unable to understand a thing that's going on. I've asked him multiple times if he could ask his friends to please converse in English so I could understand. Never happened. And I've tried on my end. I spent the summer taking French courses, working in the PR department at the university, studying on my own, but the dialect gap is almost impossible to breach. I've tried to lead by example - the first language of my circle of friends is Chinese and speaking English for a lot of them is difficult, but they stick to it whenever he's here to visit.

The second half of it is well, there seems to be a clear lack of respect or interest on the part of his friends. I've sat at dinner tables where I've watched them bash my city for an hour. Literally saying things like how people from Toronto were selfish filthy bastards. I can hold my own in any discussion, but.the only time I defended an opposing POV, 10 of them jumped on me and tore me to shreds. And perhaps I am still very inexperienced, but weren't his friends supposed to show a little bit of interest in getting to know me? 3/4 of them didn't know my name after a year of dating my ex. Needless to say I hate going out with his friends. We've argued this issue for so long with no results, I finally gave up and endured the outings.

My question is after all this - was I out of line as he told me? Was my request for a language I could understand unreasonable? I was brought up to think that was common courtesy. It's a huge issue in my family because my aunts and uncles are all in inter-racial marriages. Am I unrealistic to ask him to tell his friends to perhaps exercise a little control on their topics of conversation? When does it go from being unrealistic to realistic? This bothers me immensely because it's the one point he kept screaming at me about on the phone when we broke up - how he gave me dozens of chances regarding this and I screwed them all up.

cheers,
Susanna

- There comes a point in your life when you realize who matters, who never did, who won't anymore, and who always will. So don't worry about people from your
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Registered: 06-22-2006
Thu, 08-30-2007 - 5:02pm

I want you to know I was about to go on vaycay...

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Avatar for northwestwanderer
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Registered: 03-26-2003
Thu, 08-30-2007 - 5:30pm

The other aspect to this, it occurs to me, is the political/quebecois pride issue. There's a lot of history there and while I'm not excusing their rudeness in speaking the way they did about people from Toronto, it just seems like it might not be QUITE as simple as your BF asking them not to speak that way because you're from Toronto, or asking them to speak English around you.

I highly doubt either issue was personal, in any event (in other words, his friends would have behaved that way with any GF of his).

Sheri

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Registered: 07-14-2007
Thu, 08-30-2007 - 8:33pm

lol. Nothing gets by you does it Sandra? Yes I'm thinking about it. But too many issues in the way right now and I don't know where to start reconciliation. Laughs, I’m still half waiting for that miracle that NC is supposed to make come true. Sometimes I wish I could list them all out and pick your brain for the answers piece by piece, but oh well, that would take forever. In any case, since he verbally thrashed me pretty soundly on everyone's facebook wall, I am (shamefully) very afraid. Which probably means I'm not ready. *winks* gotta wait until I'm ready to walk away. I remember.

lol. Your answers are never ever what people expect, that's why we ask and that's why the answers are so valuable.

Now where was I going with this? Oh yes, I get along fantastically with Les Quebecois every day. I love the people most of the time, even when we fight over who's better at hockey. So it was incredibly baffling why I can't get along with his friends since I work in PR for the university and, well, getting along is sort of my job description. I truly believe I went into meeting his friends with an open mind. I'm not sure how you learned your languages, Sandra, but I usually pick up languages when I ask people to repeat what they said slowly and then translate especially if they switch back and forth between the two languages so you can keep up with the conversation but learn the phrases. I think I’m explaining this badly, but anyways, as Sheri said, there IS a big cultural gap, but by and by most of them are more than happy to oblige you if you really try. His friends on the other hand – meet the Fish eye.

In any case, he IS Chinese, different dialect of course. Not that I'd force him to learn it unless he showed an interest. And the point I was making with the debate /vs sterotyping BS is the length I guess. The odd joke, whatever, a little rivalry is all in good fun. Most people know how far to push the topic. An HOUR of BSing? Isn’t that a little extreme? And I’m supposed to sit down and shut up? Come on. And it’s one thing to tell me that you dislike Toronto because someone there spit on you vs. telling me we all suck just because. I may not like, say, hot pink shorts, but if you give me a good back up for why you like them, I’m more than willing to listen. Anyways, I think even the best of us get tired of it when we're made to feel stupid every time we open our mouth. Plus I get tired of constantly being referred to as 'that Toronto Chick'. I have a name, thank you very much.

Don't get me wrong. There are some of his buddies not so close friends that are fantastic. Articulate, polite, are super happy to practice French with me or talk computers with me for hours. And then there are his core 3 amigos. Sometimes I honestly understand how much pressure my ex used to feel balancing his friends with me. He would skip one of the WEEKLY Sunday night Dungeons & Dragons outings to go on date with me - next day his facebook wall had a dozen versions of "you're whipped! WHIPPED BY SUSANNA. skipped D& D for a GIRL". He was expected to retain a girlfriend and still retain his weekly Sunday D&Ds, Friday movie nights, biweekly 6pm - 4 am party, go to school, and oh yes, sleep. Strong guys don't compromise for a girl, you see. ARGH. It’s frustrating sometimes why he’d choose to hang around a bunch of people who ridicule his clothes and weight (they used to call him ‘the tank’), and put him down. I thought friends were supposed to be supportive and offer constructive criticism. I digress

Anyways Sheri, you'll also right, I'm only the latest in a long line of girlfriends (including some Quebecois) that seem to be driven away, so it's not exclusive to me or my city of origin, but rather a general dislike of anyone who didn't grow up with them. So in the end, it really boils down to drastically different social rather than cultural norms. Well that was therapeutic.

Anyways have a nice holiday Sandra and thanks for the reply, both of you.

Susanna

- There comes a point in your life when you realize who matters, who never did, who won't anymore, and who always will. So don't worry about people from your
iVillage Member
Registered: 08-30-2007
Fri, 08-31-2007 - 12:38am

I'm gonna tell you something that I learned from being friends with guys over the years.
I noticed that the girls that my male friends truly cared for and were interested in all of his friends made an attempt to be friends or at least be cordial with but the girls they brought around that they didn't seem to be so into his friends ignored them or showed very little interest in getting to know them and some were even rude to them!

Understand this, If your boyfriend is really into you and cares for you he is going to make this known to his friends and in return they are going to know he values you therefore they will give you the upmost respect when in your presence because they know HE would not tolerate anything less from them! If they are speaking in another language knowing that it leaves you out! and ignoring your or being disrespectful in ANY kind of way it's because your boyfriend has not made it clear to them that you are someone special to him! I would be very aware of what's going on in your relationship right now! because if he loves you or even cares for you he would make sure his friends were behaving at there very best in your presence or he would not expose you to them or he'd be very offend and say something to them. The fact that he lets this go on says that he's not only as disrespectful as they are but that he has very little care for you as a person or your feelings and apparently his friends mean more to him than you do if he can come to there defense by saying you are over reacting! For example my man has a cousin who feels he can joke with people anyway he wants to well one day he joked with me alittle too much and man was all over his face and told him "The next time you disrespect my woman I will beat you soft!" What I'm saying to you is if he cares about you than what hurts you should hurt him and if your important to him you should be important to his friends and if they are acting like your just some chic he's hangin out with it's probably because he's lead them to believe your not anyone important to him! I'd beware!