fantasy with skin on

iVillage Member
Registered: 08-18-2008
fantasy with skin on
30
Thu, 12-10-2009 - 3:45pm

Hi All,


I was writing a friend who is struggling with feelings of missing xAP and I’ve read here on EAS that so many are struggling with grief that is debilitating in some cases.

Whether you think you can or you think you can't you are probably right. A parrot can repeat what it has learned but the mark of true intelligence is applying what is learned.

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-24-2005
Thu, 12-10-2009 - 10:59pm

I'm getting damn sick of the Internet screwing up so I lose a post, especially when I put some time and thought into it.


iVillage Member
Registered: 08-18-2008
Thu, 12-10-2009 - 11:08pm

DEE!!!


Good to hear from you. For you to say you look forward to my post would be like Shakespeare saying that he looks forward to Raymond Carver’s next book.


Sorry to hear about you breaking NC. Breaking NC in of itself is painful not to mention the Heavy Weight punch you felt in your stomach from the response. Ok not taking xAP’s side here but for him to be successful in IC he must be brutally honest with himself. Know that the first punch was administered to his stomach via his own fist.


As long as you learn from breaking NC, and deploy counter measures. (After all we are in a war for our self-esteem and mental serenity and we must be more successful in our strategies than they are in the Middle-East.)


I can relate to fetal position as I have been rocking in fetal position more than once. Hopefully you didn’t read his response during work because rocking in fetal position under your desk can be difficult to explain during annual reviews.


You are smart, introspective, and most importantly have kept your sense of humor through all of this. No doubt you will reach “I don’t give an ef” ahem I mean “indifference” in due time.


When we have allowed our hearts and imagination to run amuck, differentiating reality vs fantasy can be devastating. Reality can sometimes suck but when all else fails remembering one of Einstein’s other quotes is helpful: “If A is a success in life, then A equals x plus y plus z. Work is x; y is play; and z is keeping your mouth shut." It is the long version of NC=No New Hurts. How could Einstein know one of EAS quotes in advance? The man was a true genius!


Much love as you work on reality vs fantasy,


E1


Whether you think you can or you think you cant you are probably right.


A parrot can repeat what it has learned but the mark of true intelligence is applying what is learned.


Whether you think you can or you think you can't you are probably right. A parrot can repeat what it has learned but the mark of true intelligence is applying what is learned.

iVillage Member
Registered: 08-18-2008
Thu, 12-10-2009 - 11:19pm

Hi ((Clarity)),


I think bells are chiming somewhere when I type that!


I just lost a post too. I tried to spell check and that seems to be the magic button to make it disappear into cyber space :(


I'm glad your next attempt made it.


<

Whether you think you can or you think you can't you are probably right. A parrot can repeat what it has learned but the mark of true intelligence is applying what is learned.

iVillage Member
Registered: 08-18-2008
Fri, 12-11-2009 - 12:43am

Hi again Kmg,


<speaking to him again.>> I like that you wrote “speak” to him again. Notice you didn’t say see him or interact with him. You specifically said “speak”. I believe this is important because the way we try to fix things in A’s is with words. Words, words, and more words. We throw out words in an A like Obama throws out stimulus packages. It is our actions that speak so much louder than words. You are with your H and kids not with your xAP. That says more than any words ever could.


It is very possible that the reason you cannot imagine “never speaking to him again is because you are still in the A fog-- thinking words can fix everything. Sorry to be blunt but that very well could be the case.


<> Sorry if I sound like a broken record here on EAS but: A’s have not rules. There is no resolution!


I will repeat what me T repeated very simply to me, “He knew you were M end of story.”


<

Whether you think you can or you think you can't you are probably right. A parrot can repeat what it has learned but the mark of true intelligence is applying what is learned.

iVillage Member
Registered: 12-07-2009
Fri, 12-11-2009 - 9:15am

E1,


Your responses to the ladies were awesome with sugar plums

   ~Iddy~ 


iVillage Member
Registered: 01-23-2009
Fri, 12-11-2009 - 11:21am

Empowerment -

It has been a while, but I've been here. I too look forward to your posts. I noticed you haven't been posting as much so I was very happy to see this one. :-)

You hit the nail on the head about fixating and obsessing over things. I actually did go to a T for anxiety about two years ago for a few months. It was actually for anxiety I was having over the kids (one son diagnosed with Aspergers and my other son was having some troubles). It was also to discuss things that happened in the past when I was younger. He actually wasn't that helpful though. All he really did was listen while I talked. I didn't feel like I really worked anything out. He said I needed some closer friends who I could talk to about anything. I have a decent amount of friends, but no one who I can share secrets with until xAP that is.

Towards the end of my sessions with him I did tell my T about a night when a group of coworkers went out after a company soccer game. This is kind of when it all started. My manager got really drunk. He seemed to not like that I was talking to some other coworkers so he came over and sat on my lap. I was shocked! He had never done anything like this before. Then he picked me up and moved me to a different chair so he would be in between me and these other people. When he did this his hand brushed across my breast. Then he put his head on my shoulder and told me he was going to the Christmas party this year and the only reason he was going was because of me. I was completely shocked, but knew he was drunk.

My T told me that I should let HR know this happened and document the situation. Did I do that? Of course not, I could handle it and this was my manager. I worked at a small company and I cared what he thought of me. He was a great manager. He never got upset with me and always was very flexible with work hours and everything.

I told my husband about what happened that night (I'm not sure if I gave him all the details though) and went into my manager's office the next day and told him that I was happily married and apologized if I had given him the wrong impression.

Well, it didn't stop there. Anytime we went out (always as a group) something happened. He would flirt with me and text me very flirty things and ask me to meet him afterwords alone which I never did but I really did enjoy the attention even though I didn't admit it to myself at the time. I thought I could handle the flirting and I didn't think I was attracted to him in that way. I went into his office one more time and told him the same thing again about being happily married and this went on for a year.

I would also tell my husband about when these things happened initially. My husband wanted me to stop going out if he was there. I started lying to my husband about him being there. I started to really enjoy this special attention from my manager. After a few months of this attention, I requested a title change at work and different hours. He would help me with things at work whenever I needed it. I got almost anything I wanted at work that he could control (so not more money). I came to really crave his attention. He used to go out to lunch with a couple guys and I always wished they asked me too. Then he started taking me out to lunch alone. We kept the lunches business related although he would buy me drinks at lunch. I still didn't feel like I had really crossed the line because we weren't texting or IMing unless it was one of those nights out. I looked at it like I was getting what I wanted and I could handle it.

Then one night I was mad at my husband for some reason. I went out with some girl friends and we met a few coworkers. He was there. That night he didn't give me the same attention and I was annoyed. A typical thing he would normally text when we were out was something like "I'll be right back", then I might text "where are you?", then he would text "I'm always with you" and I would return a text with a smiley face. I figured out later he didn't text me that night because the girl that he was previously in an affair with was there. So after we went home I texted him and we texted until all hours of the night. That is when I felt that I officially crossed the line. That was a year ago August.

I told xAP everything about my past and I did that within 2 weeks of officially crossing the line. We talked and talked for hours.

I think this affair was supposed to be an exit affair for me. I knew I couldn't stay married and be in an affair so I needed to figure out what I was going to do. Within 2 months of me crossing the line I had a deposit made on a house to rent and was planning to move out of my house in November. November was also my D day. My husband saw an IM where xAP said he loved me. It was supposed to be an exit affair but then my husband acted totally different that I expected when he found out. He cried, but he didn't yell and swear. I thought he would completely lose it. He forgave me that night and even took some responsibility because he knew the sorry state of our marriage.

I thought I still needed time to figure things out because I still loved by xAP. Then a week before moving, my son cried out in the night for me. I picked him up and started crying and knew I couldn't do it. I wouldn't be there for him 3 out of 7 nights once we separated (we had figured out the temporary custody). So I decided I needed to end it with xAP then. That was November. I tried (not very successfully to end it from November to March). In March I realized it was not going to happen with me working there. I quit my job in March. I tried NC in March and failed a few times although doing much better than I had in the past. We saw each other in July for the first time in 4 months when my husband was on a business trip. That is when the hickeys came. I still have a hard time thinking he did that on purpose. Since then we have had mainly NC although we have talked briefly 2 or 3 times. He said he will leave me alone so I can figure things out. It has been NC for probably about 2 months. I feel like it is over.

Honestly what would happen if I let go of my fantasy? I think I have a fantasy of a perfect husband and lifelong partner. I want that to be with my current husband and I really hope that it will be. I think that if things stay the same that they are now we will probably stay together. My husband has made some very good changes and I have too. I know he loves me he just gets annoyed with me all the time and I am very sensitive about it.

Ok, digging deep here into something I try not to admit and definitely never put into words. I think that in the back of my mind there is a thought that if someday things don't work out with my husband and things don't work out with his wife and we figure this out on our own (while in NC) then maybe...He said he will wait for me...5, 10 years whatever it takes. See it is all such a fantasy. I don't even want to post this because I know I should not be thinking this way. How do you get over this kind of thinking? I know it is wrong.

I didn't mean to write a book, but it all came spilling out once I started. Maybe that is why I don't post all that often. :-)

Empowerment - as I mentioned it is great to "see" you. I think you offer excellent advice and you seem to really get me and others. I always look forward to your advice because I know you will be honest, but not too harsh for those of us who take tough love too personally. Thank you so much for your input on this site! Your posts are incredibly helpful and valuable.

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-23-2009
Fri, 12-11-2009 - 11:24am

withclarity -

I just wanted to let you know what I do in case it helps. When I'm typing out a message I highlight the whole thing periodically and hit Ctrl C to copy it. Then it is copied in case your post disappears when you are writing it. It your post disappears you can hit Ctrl V to paste the last thing you copied. You can also do all this with your mouse. Not sure if that will help your problem, but it seems to help me. :-)

iVillage Member
Registered: 04-20-2009
Fri, 12-11-2009 - 1:11pm

E1!
(giggle, blush) Gee, thanks! I loves me the flattery! Will you be my new Boyfriend? ;)

hmmmm.... the Self Esteem War. This is such a conundrum! I feel that in order to really know myself and correct myself, I need to be brutally honest with all my faults - and, omg, the list is getting really long and ugly. Breaking NC was just a stupid attempt to get some validation and reassurances - like salve for my newly exposed boo-boos. I am soooo hardheaded. Everything I read on the boards up to that point re: NC was ACCURATE, 100%. But, I still did it because - you know - I'm "special", my A was "special", we weren't "like that", yadda, yadda, yadda. Pile on the delusional bs until that little voice in my head telling me to not do it is smothered. But, break NC and let's fast forward to the results: 1) he wants you back, 2) he doesn't want you back, 3) you both piss and moan and cry about how much you miss each other but cannot be together, and so on and so forth. Blech, none of these options are appetizing. Like stepping up to a Crap Buffet, all you can eat!

Love the Einstein quotes! Ironically, Albert was a ho. ha! really, he cheated like a dog.

Thanks for all the love and encouragement; it really buoys me.

Cheers,
Dee
(p.s. Paxil ROCKS!)

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-24-2005
Fri, 12-11-2009 - 1:59pm

Thanks...I'll remember that.


iVillage Member
Registered: 01-23-2009
Fri, 12-11-2009 - 2:05pm
It is the least I can do. :-) You just need to make sure to highlight the text first and then click Ctrl C to copy it. Let me know if you have any ?s. It is kind of a round about way, but it works for me.