Alice - I am a newbie myself and began NC Tuesday. Messed up on Friday when he sent me a message and I replied. Have been too ashamed to post, and too down, but that's another story. You have got to dig deep girl! The few stolen moments are not worth the hours and hours of grief and pain anymore. That's what you have to tell yourself to be able to do this.
So, he had you and got his fix and now he is off with his family. NOT
(((Alice))) I know EXACTLY what you are going through. I think we are struggling in many of the same ways right now, judging by some of your posts. It is SO EASY to forget why NC is important, when you share one of those brief, teary-eyed reunions. It feels very real and very right, but it's shocking how quickly the good feeling erodes to reveal the painful ugly reality that lies beneath. I had a relapse last week (just talking, nothing physical) and within 5 minutes of the conversation ending I felt bad and empty and disgusted all over again; in fact, what's beginning to emerge is something resembling hatred for xMM.
You just HAVE to force yourself to remember THOSE feelings, and not the momentary high. You mentioned heroin. It is EXACTLY like heroin...the pain and miserable lows you endure for the high. Even though it's hard and it sucks, you have to give your wrist a proverbial slap when your mind starts drifting into the "buts" and "if onlys". Stay busy! Keep your mind occupied. Idle hands are the devil's workshop. This weekend I worked on some personal projects, took a few walks, had brunch with friends, etc.--all in an effort stay AWAY from my email and keep xMM off my mind. Of course it doesn't always work (I still think about him too much), but it DOES help!
Alice, did you not beleive my story that I told you in your Fate? thread?
Don't you see it for yourself now? He is not MISERABLE in his marriage, despite what he says to you. His marriage is improving with you around because you give him what's missing. He is more loving, patient and attentive to his wife now as he got you back. Meanwhile, you own marrige will go down the toilet because us women cannot be in two relationship.
Cut him off for good, he is just unworthy. In the beginning, NC feels like a self-imposed torture. In reality, NC is protecting you from more pain, more lies, more grief. NC is the quickest way to get over someone - that's just how our brain works. I'd be so glad if I'd be able to do NC - instead, I have to suffer with LC (x and I are coworkers).
<"Tomorrow I think I will have one last talk with my MM. Have to be more clear though, he really didn't buy any of my breaking up before!">
If you really want to be clear, then go NC. Nothing speaks volumes more than that. No amount of "last talk/words/deeds" gets the message across faster than blocking and walking. If you truly want to end it. Otherwise, the "last talk" just turns into a way to manipulate how to get more out of him, or control him, or seek attention from him.
It does help to know you're not alone. Before I found this board, I thought I was going crazy. And of course xAP had subtle ways of making me FEEL like I was crazy, in "overthinking" and "overanalyzing" everything about our relationship. Of course he was probably somewhat right, but the only reason I was reaching so hard for answers was because he wasn't GIVING me any. Heh.
In regard to your post, first off, props to you for not responding to his text message. I've gone the snarky response route before and you're right, it gets us nowhere--in fact I can picture XAP getting the text, smiling smugly and putting his phone away. THAT image alone deters me from replying! I'm sure it's killing him that you haven't returned the sentiment...his ego is going, "waaaaaa" right now.
To answer your question about their marriages...I don't have a firm read on XAP and his W. I don't think he's "unhappy" so much as he's just bored. Meaning, I don't think his marriage is that horrible, it just doesn't suit him, and SHE doesn't exactly suit him. He married young and has changed a lot since marrying her. I think he's changed a lot even since meeting me. I think he is attracted to passionate, confident, smart and unconventional women; I think he's looking for a sparring partner as much as he is a lover, someone who challenges him. From what he has told me, he has never had a PA; perhaps an EA, but nothing quite like this one (though I'm not totally sure I believe him). In the past, when I've asked him "how things were going" in his marriage, he's answered in vague, cryptic responses like "well, clearly it's not going great." Once they had a big fight and he managed to half-convince me they were through. I don't think the marriage is bad enough for him to ever leave her, even though he told me he thinks about me "100% of the time" and, for instance, emailed back and forth with me the entire time he was with his family for Christmas. Around the clock.
As you can see, I have spent a LOT of time analyzing the situation. It sickens me to think about how much time I have wasted agonizing about this stuff. If he loved me...maybe it's better for me not to know. Because like you, when I was in the depths of the "fog," if he had said to me, "I love you, I want to leave my W for you," there is a decent chance I would have followed suit. So, I guess I can be thankful he didn't return the L word. Even though my M isn't great either, heh.
I'm not sure if I agree that you should have "one last talk" with MM. In my experience, the "one last talk" was always actually my giving him "one last chance" to spill his guts and say "let's run away together." In those talks, he NEVER responded how I wanted him to, and I was always left heartbroken, disappointed, angry, etc...it didn't provide any closure, just more frustration. If he begs you not to leave, then you'll be in another tearful, "see, we can't live without each other!" reunion situation, and your NC determination will be threatened. If he says, "you're right, thanks for being the strong one" (which is what my XAP said to me), you'll be LIVID and wanting to claw his face for not caring more. It's kind of a lose-lose situation, it really is.
Go away with your family and turn the phone off if you can. Leave it in the hotel room when you're out and about (seriously, tell your H you "forgot" it). It's better to be vaguely wondering if he has texted than to be checking the phone nonstop and seething as MM provokes you and guilt-trips you from a cowardly distance.
Although I am sorry to hear about you breaking NC and giving in to him again (you had sex with him?), I am also very thankful that you posted this. That takes a lot of courage, and in my opinion posts like this are very helpful at the same time, because we say to ourselves: "that's right! That's what will happen when we give in!"
Believe me, I know all about 'beautiful bonding talks', I love when xAP is spilling his heartfelt thoughts about me . And then what? The next day? The xAP's are spending special time with their kids and wife and we feel totally left out. We realize that the beautiful bonding talk was nothing but talk. Nothing but words.
You described it right: it's all too ugly and not worth the ONE HOUR of joy. One hour, 60 minutes, it's nothing compared to the agony you feel once he left you and returned to his wife.
Oh, I can totally relate to your anger. There's not much I have to say really, besides that I am grateful that you posted this here for us. You helped me a lot with your post, Alice, you did. And I am sad for you that you are in "this place" once again, but things like this will give us more and more strength until we are at the point of NO RETURN. NOT EVER RETURNING BACK TO THE A!
Talking about marriages, my xAP says he is very happily married. I have always wondered why he would want me if his marriage is so happy; I think it's just the sex... That's the only reason I can think of. He thinks I am his little playmate who will do all the new and adventurous stuff with him. Well no more! And it's going to stay like that. Never again will he have me, I just wish I could stop thinking about him all together, because my thoughts still mess me up.
You CAN do it, Alice! Sometimes we stumble and fall, but what's important , is that we get up again! And start moving again in the right direction. And that's what you will do. That's what you want. And you can do it.
It's just so incredibly important to REMEMBER all the pain, all the hurt, all the tears. I tend to forget them too, but then I start reading again all the things that he did to me, and it helps me to not give in. But it's difficult. It's very difficult. I am not as strong as you think I am. I have caved many times, but I do not ever want to give in again. And it's not easy :-(
What's your plan of action now? Will you go NC without saying something? If you want to email, feel free to send me one.
Pages
Alice - I am a newbie myself and began NC Tuesday. Messed up on Friday when he sent me a message and I replied. Have been too ashamed to post, and too down, but that's another story.
You have got to dig deep girl! The few stolen moments are not worth the hours and hours of grief and pain anymore. That's what you have to tell yourself to be able to do this.
So, he had you and got his fix and now he is off with his family. NOT
(((Alice)))
I know EXACTLY what you are going through. I think we are struggling in many of the same ways right now, judging by some of your posts. It is SO EASY to forget why NC is important, when you share one of those brief, teary-eyed reunions. It feels very real and very right, but it's shocking how quickly the good feeling erodes to reveal the painful ugly reality that lies beneath. I had a relapse last week (just talking, nothing physical) and within 5 minutes of the conversation ending I felt bad and empty and disgusted all over again; in fact, what's beginning to emerge is something resembling hatred for xMM.
You just HAVE to force yourself to remember THOSE feelings, and not the momentary high. You mentioned heroin. It is EXACTLY like heroin...the pain and miserable lows you endure for the high. Even though it's hard and it sucks, you have to give your wrist a proverbial slap when your mind starts drifting into the "buts" and "if onlys". Stay busy! Keep your mind occupied. Idle hands are the devil's workshop. This weekend I worked on some personal projects, took a few walks, had brunch with friends, etc.--all in an effort stay AWAY from my email and keep xMM off my mind. Of course it doesn't always work (I still think about him too much), but it DOES help!
Alice, did you not beleive my story that I told you in your Fate? thread?
Don't you see it for yourself now? He is not MISERABLE in his marriage, despite what he says to you. His marriage is improving with you around because you give him what's missing. He is more loving, patient and attentive to his wife now as he got you back.
Meanwhile, you own marrige will go down the toilet because us women cannot be in two relationship.
Cut him off for good, he is just unworthy. In the beginning, NC feels like a self-imposed torture. In reality, NC is protecting you from more pain, more lies, more grief. NC is the quickest way to get over someone - that's just how our brain works. I'd be so glad if I'd be able to do NC - instead, I have to suffer with LC (x and I are coworkers).
Alice,
<"Tomorrow I think I will have one last talk with my MM. Have to be more clear though, he really didn't buy any of my breaking up before!">
If you really want to be clear, then go NC. Nothing speaks volumes more than that. No amount of "last talk/words/deeds" gets the message across faster than blocking and walking. If you truly want to end it. Otherwise, the "last talk" just turns into a way to manipulate how to get more out of him, or control him, or seek attention from him.
Just my two cents,
Hugs,
Misty
It does help to know you're not alone. Before I found this board, I thought I was going crazy. And of course xAP had subtle ways of making me FEEL like I was crazy, in "overthinking" and "overanalyzing" everything about our relationship. Of course he was probably somewhat right, but the only reason I was reaching so hard for answers was because he wasn't GIVING me any. Heh.
In regard to your post, first off, props to you for not responding to his text message. I've gone the snarky response route before and you're right, it gets us nowhere--in fact I can picture XAP getting the text, smiling smugly and putting his phone away. THAT image alone deters me from replying! I'm sure it's killing him that you haven't returned the sentiment...his ego is going, "waaaaaa" right now.
To answer your question about their marriages...I don't have a firm read on XAP and his W. I don't think he's "unhappy" so much as he's just bored. Meaning, I don't think his marriage is that horrible, it just doesn't suit him, and SHE doesn't exactly suit him. He married young and has changed a lot since marrying her. I think he's changed a lot even since meeting me. I think he is attracted to passionate, confident, smart and unconventional women; I think he's looking for a sparring partner as much as he is a lover, someone who challenges him. From what he has told me, he has never had a PA; perhaps an EA, but nothing quite like this one (though I'm not totally sure I believe him). In the past, when I've asked him "how things were going" in his marriage, he's answered in vague, cryptic responses like "well, clearly it's not going great." Once they had a big fight and he managed to half-convince me they were through. I don't think the marriage is bad enough for him to ever leave her, even though he told me he thinks about me "100% of the time" and, for instance, emailed back and forth with me the entire time he was with his family for Christmas. Around the clock.
As you can see, I have spent a LOT of time analyzing the situation. It sickens me to think about how much time I have wasted agonizing about this stuff. If he loved me...maybe it's better for me not to know. Because like you, when I was in the depths of the "fog," if he had said to me, "I love you, I want to leave my W for you," there is a decent chance I would have followed suit. So, I guess I can be thankful he didn't return the L word. Even though my M isn't great either, heh.
I'm not sure if I agree that you should have "one last talk" with MM. In my experience, the "one last talk" was always actually my giving him "one last chance" to spill his guts and say "let's run away together." In those talks, he NEVER responded how I wanted him to, and I was always left heartbroken, disappointed, angry, etc...it didn't provide any closure, just more frustration. If he begs you not to leave, then you'll be in another tearful, "see, we can't live without each other!" reunion situation, and your NC determination will be threatened. If he says, "you're right, thanks for being the strong one" (which is what my XAP said to me), you'll be LIVID and wanting to claw his face for not caring more. It's kind of a lose-lose situation, it really is.
Go away with your family and turn the phone off if you can. Leave it in the hotel room when you're out and about (seriously, tell your H you "forgot" it). It's better to be vaguely wondering if he has texted than to be checking the phone nonstop and seething as MM provokes you and guilt-trips you from a cowardly distance.
Good luck and (((hugs)))
Doe
Hey Aliceinwonderland,
Although I am sorry to hear about you breaking NC and giving in to him again (you had sex with him?), I am also very thankful that you posted this. That takes a lot of courage, and in my opinion posts like this are very helpful at the same time, because we say to ourselves: "that's right! That's what will happen when we give in!"
Believe me, I know all about 'beautiful bonding talks', I love when xAP is spilling his heartfelt thoughts about me .
And then what? The next day? The xAP's are spending special time with their kids and wife and we feel totally left out. We realize that the beautiful bonding talk was nothing but talk. Nothing but words.
You described it right: it's all too ugly and not worth the ONE HOUR of joy. One hour, 60 minutes, it's nothing compared to the agony you feel once he left you and returned to his wife.
Oh, I can totally relate to your anger. There's not much I have to say really, besides that I am grateful that you posted this here for us. You helped me a lot with your post, Alice, you did.
And I am sad for you that you are in "this place" once again, but things like this will give us more and more strength until we are at the point of NO RETURN. NOT EVER RETURNING BACK TO THE A!
Talking about marriages, my xAP says he is very happily married. I have always wondered why he would want me if his marriage is so happy; I think it's just the sex... That's the only reason I can think of. He thinks I am his little playmate who will do all the new and adventurous stuff with him. Well no more! And it's going to stay like that. Never again will he have me, I just wish I could stop thinking about him all together, because my thoughts still mess me up.
You CAN do it, Alice! Sometimes we stumble and fall, but what's important , is that we get up again! And start moving again in the right direction. And that's what you will do. That's what you want. And you can do it.
Hugs!
HTGO
Hi Alice,
It's just so incredibly important to REMEMBER all the pain, all the hurt, all the tears. I tend to forget them too, but then I start reading again all the things that he did to me, and it helps me to not give in. But it's difficult. It's very difficult.
I am not as strong as you think I am. I have caved many times, but I do not ever want to give in again. And it's not easy :-(
What's your plan of action now? Will you go NC without saying something? If you want to email, feel free to send me one.
hugs
HTGO
Pages