Never Easy--} Part II

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-08-2003
Never Easy--} Part II
25
Mon, 02-02-2004 - 5:04pm
My "never easy" post below tells of the xOW contacting me re: a birthday party, and how I allowed myself to get somewhat chatty & flirty... --->Mistake!!!

Here's a new one for the "Ending A Support" brain trust!!! What do you wimmens think?

Part II

I got another series of emails. Here's the "Cliff Notes" version:

From her- (no subject line/blank).. Hey. Did you hear so-n-so(my competitor) got laid off friday? they're restructuring. How is he ever going to find a job at his age? He's been in our business here for ever!

Back to her, from me- What about his co-worker such & such? Did he make it? Will the lay off affect him? I didn't call him directly, for not wanting to add to the spectacle of all the other calls he's surely getting today.

From her- Yes, such & such is okay for now. We'll have to wait & see. /// I told you the wrong date for the party. We had to change it to Friday 4/30. I really hope you'll come and bring ___(her co-worker/boss/my friend/customer) and ____(my ex-coworker & friend/competitor). _____'s coming also (her other co-worker/my customer). It wouldn't be a party without you.

****************************

Do I even answer this? For heaven's sakes! Her party is 3 months away! I am not going (I'm just not "there" yet; don't know if I ever will be). At least I don't think so. Maybe I'll be better in 3 months. (I sure feel a lot different than I did 3 mos ago, but am not out of the woods). Even if I did, I would bring my wife (but she's not mentioned here). No. I'm not going. I need to make other plans that day.

1- Do I answer her email?

2- Do I write again, like I did back in Sept., that I just need to sort stuff out & need space? (or is that sounding pathetic?)

3- Why isn't she inviting her co-workers herself? (She sees them daily!)

4- Why isn't she including my wife in her invite? (is it an oversight?)

5- I thought she was dating again. Part of me thinks that makes things safer, but the "rational" part of my brain screams "NOOOOOO!!!" Yet a 3rd part of my brain is curious what he's like.

6- What's up w/ this 3 months away crap?

I never responded anything to her the first time, and am inclined again to just ignore the invite, and keep the next communication strictly to business.

The stupid thing is how this simple matter has messed w/ me again. What a knucklehead I can be.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 10-10-2003
Mon, 02-02-2004 - 6:18pm
you are NOT a knucklehead. why? b/c if you're one, then so am i. and i absolutely REFUSE to believe that i'm one. so an invite's gotten you all confused again, huh? how do you think i feel? a freaking constitutional debate instigated an awful chain of emails...

BUT that does NOT take away all of the progress that either of us have made in this often-frustrating journey that we probably shouldn't have ever embarked on. but we "live and learn."

So here are my answers, for whatever they're worth.

1. yes, you answer her email. or else you inadvertently leave the door open (as i've found out the hard way). and then you'll end up dealing w/ questions that you'd rather not answer or are not prepared to answer.

2. no, candid honesty is not the best approach here. how about plain ole honesty. you reply by saying that you aren't sure yet about that date b/c you think your family is trying to plan something for that weekend. it is the truth. first, you really aren't sure yet. no lie there. second, your family is trying to plan something for that weekend b/c you are trying to make other plans for that weekend (and you are a part of your family after all). so everything is consistent with the truth. may not be 100% the truth. but it's still consistent with the truth.

3. i think you know why she isn't inviting them herself. b/c it is NOT a business function but a personal function in which she's inviting 1 co-worker. and she's leaving it up to you to decide if you'd be more comfortable with having other people that are business associates there than just her friends and family. i got to hand it to her. manipulative in a way, but thoughtful nonetheless. hey this doesn't make her a bad person by any stretch of the imagination. just goes to show that a) you're important to her and b) she wants you to be there and c) she wants you to enjoy yourself there.

4. do i really need to answer why she's not inviting your wife? c'mon now...

5. it does NOT matter if she's dating someone. you know that. and even if she were, you'd undoubtedly compare yourself to him. now, why go through that kind of torment???

6. why is she planning so far in advance? hmm...there could be an innocent explanation. i for one, send out mass emails to friends weeks (sometimes a couple of months) in advance of a trip if i'm going to be in their area. given that my friends are scattered all over the globe and that they are all in their 20s & 30s with extremely active social and professional lives, we've all got to plan ages in advance in order to be able to see one another. think about weddings. one of my friends told us over a yr in advance when she was getting married. granted, the wedding is in another continent. but you get the point. clearly, this party is very important to her and she wants the people closest and dearest to her to be there. can you blame her?

bottom line...so do you go? i think you need to stall for some time here. b/c she is, after all, still a friend. maybe in a month or two, you'll feel able to go. if that's the case, you don't want to have declined the invite prematurely. if that's not the case, then you can look forward to a family outing. BUT if you do go, i suggest you bring your wife AND the other business associates. if you went without them, i GUARANTEE you that you will be back on this board. i know it. just as i know that the sun will rise. why? b/c if you went alone, you'd get to meet all the other important people in her life. you'll get to know her family and you'll like them. i know you will. and some part of you will wish that you were part of that inner circle...

just my humble opinion. somewhat of a straight shoot w/out sugarcoating it too much. but not as judgmental as some of the other posts i've written...thoughts?

take care,

sambagita

p.s. riverguy, i've missed you... =)

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-26-2003
Mon, 02-02-2004 - 6:34pm
Don't completely ignore her email. Personally, I hate being ignored. If it were me I would reply with. "Thanks for the invite, but I won't be able to make it. Hope you have a great time" and that's it. You don't owe her any other explanation. If she asks again, same reply. She will eventually get it that you are not going to show. Although, she may ask you 100 times before she "gives up".

She's a grown woman, knows exactly what she is doing and how to get to you. It sounds to me like she is trying to work her way back into your life.

Distance yourself!!!!!!


(edited to add a thought)




Edited 2/2/2004 6:37:10 PM ET by alifechoice

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-17-2003
Mon, 02-02-2004 - 6:54pm
If I received an email like this...it would mess with my head in a major way...ok, here's what a woman who has a very loud inner man inside thinks about this:

She's not dating anyone interesting because if she was, well, you wouldn't be hearing from her. That's the good news...the bad news is once the line has been crossed, then any other social contact, which this most certainly is, will serve to tempt and tease you...and we all know that men are not the greatest at resisting physical temptation...I say this in the kindest of sentiments, believe me. It is not meant as a slam against men in general.

I enjoy men immensely...always have...but they are simply wired differently than females, LOL, thank the lord.

The party is three months away. If you were to agree to attend, then it would open the door to more contact which she is perfectly aware of and may be hoping for. She's testing the waters to find out if you still care, if you are hurting, etc. because she probably is too. Ok, this is human. But she didn't invite your wife because she'd prefer to believe your wife isn't really in the picture, LOL. I spent months envying my OMM's wife, and I hated myself for it...jealousy is a useless emotion, very unhealthy.

I hope this makes sense...if it's of any consolation, I slipped once from NC about two months ago...I sent my OMM an email with some jokes in it...then just one sentence asking how he was doing. He NEVER responded...cold, yes--and it really hurt badly. I poured my heart out to a dear friend later.

But I have to say as much as it hurt, I got the message loud and clear...he was not interested in pursuing this relationship any further. He's trying to make a clean break, for whatever reason. I was a little envious that I couldn't rip the band aid off so courageously. Ever since then, I've been trying to think more like a man: grit my teeth and keep on moving.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Mon, 02-02-2004 - 7:19pm

1- Do I answer her email?
2- Do I write again, like I did back in Sept., that I just need to sort stuff out & need space? (or is that sounding pathetic?)
3- Why isn't she inviting her co-workers herself? (She sees them daily!)
4- Why isn't she including my wife in her invite? (is it an oversight?)
5- I thought she was dating again. Part of me thinks that makes things safer, but the "rational" part of my brain screams "NOOOOOO!!!" Yet a 3rd part of my brain is curious what he's like.
6- What's up w/ this 3 months away crap?


RG, do you really want my input?

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-30-2003
Mon, 02-02-2004 - 8:05pm

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-19-2003
Mon, 02-02-2004 - 11:00pm
RG... Either you're making a mountain out of a mole hill or I've totally lost track of the latest developments in your situation. Sorry if I offend you but why are you even exchanging emails with her about your competitor being laid off. IMO, that's a personal (not business) situation and furthermore, it's gossiping about someone's misfortune! Yeah, you're a knucklehead because your reply to her initial email should have been: Yes, I've heard and I'm sorry for him. You should NOT have drawn her in further by asking if someone else was also laid off!

As to the party invitation, I agree with one of the other posters who said that you should just tell her it's unlikely you'll make it because your FAMILY has been making plans for that weekend.

IMO, if you're going to correspond on business matters only then (1) you need to make that clear to her and (2) stop feeding her bits of information and personal opinion QUESTIONS that will entice her to ask more questions and to keep your communication on a more personal level.

Sorry....but, you're the one enticing her and then you're complaining when she replies.....I don't understand why you can't see this.

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-27-2003
Tue, 02-03-2004 - 3:20am
RG--

For whatever it is worth, I dream of the email when my exMM says it hurts to be in contact and to please let go, meaning also not responding to his e's. Up until now he has only asked me to hang in there for him, with the one exception in October.

She is hurting. She needs to know you are hurting too. The party is a ploy. She is fishing, testing the waters. And you are being receptive. If you really don't want contact, write back....

"Please understand that this is difficult for me, too. I can't come to the party. I don't wish to be in contact with you anymore. I value our friendship, and you as a person more than that. Please find peace in your life. I am sure it will be much easier to find with me and my struggling marriage out of the picture. Someday, I hope, the pain will be gone, and we will both be able to enjoy our relationship in a manner that hurts neither of us, and only gives us both strength and joy."

Tough thought here..... if I remember correctly, her marriage fell apart, and you questioned whether you had anything to do with it. You know you did, even if it was on small level. Perhaps acknowledging that would also give her some closure.

All this being done,,,, and isn't this ironic coming from me....

NCNCNCNCNCNCNCNCNCNC

I think I'll try it myself soon......

Strength and peace

Lala

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-08-2003
Tue, 02-03-2004 - 8:28am
Wow. You are always so right-on. Thanks for all of your posts & thoughts over the past months. You've been a key person in my "recovery". You really have. Thanks.

my thoughts to your thoughts to my thoughts:

1- Door open. Good thought; I didn't even look at it that way. (Something to consider)

2- I like the approach, but I'll need to massage that a bit.

3- No, I really couldn't see why she didn't invite these people herself; she has a lot of contact w/ them, and is on very good terms w/ each. This really did puzzle me. You have really shed light on what could possibly be her perspective, and I think you may be exactly right.

4- Yeah...You're right. (But what is odd is that in the past, she was always so careful to ask how my wife was... almost in a way that was to purposefully "cover that base")

5- Right again.

6- I still think 3 mos is over the top for something that isn't of "wedding" stature. But, your thoughts are right again, I think.

Go/not go - your 'inner circle' thoughts are right, too. You know me. (ha!) After a night's sleep on the matter, I really just can't see myself going. I'd love to stay "friends"... but, I've been there/done that. It led to no good. I don't know that I'll ever go back (which really sucks, because we had a good friendship).

Sugarcoating- You're at your best when you shoot straight.

Sambagita, you've been really good for me. Thanks!

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-08-2003
Tue, 02-03-2004 - 8:32am
I've got to work on my wording. I like what you have to say, because you are right. (When you hear truth, it is easy to recognize). I'm struggling w/ that fine line between business only (and what constitutes THAT), and our past.

But you're right. I don't HAVE to explain anything, but a concern of mine is that there will be other people I know very well, and work with, and am friends with. They'll want to know why I'm not going... (and I do not plan to go)... It may not be a bad idea to float the "why" out there for the masses. (none of them know how wrapped up I let myself get w/ her in the past).

Your message board handle is appropriate to this situation. It is my life of choice. I need to choose wisely here.

Thanks!

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-08-2003
Tue, 02-03-2004 - 8:40am
Yankee, you are so right. We are different. No slam taken at all. Hence, the jokes about us "thinking w/ the wrong (parts)"...

I've surprised myself a little by how this has thrown me for a loop. I expected more out of myself at this stage. I really did. That leaves me feeling kind of stupid.

But now, am I reading you right? You're saying not to respond at all? I want to do this right, and that is why I tapped into all you "wimmens". Y'all do think differently than me...

Posts above say to reply, and not to ignore, because that leaves the door open (which I don't want to do). But in your case, being ignored was kindof a "tough love" thing... Ignoring the invite has been my first instinct...

I see both sides. I think I'll respond, but want to be VERY careful in how I do. My pride does not want to allow me to come off as a snively idiot. On the other hand, the door needs to stay shut. What's the best way to keep it shut?

You know I'm a huge NC advocate. Being in a close business relationship makes this trickier... How my NC is carried off is the trick.

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