Drinking the wine...wondering why...

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-01-2011
Drinking the wine...wondering why...
16
Thu, 07-26-2012 - 12:15am

I'm really digging deep to understand why I needed this validation. I only wanted it from that A-hole AP....if only I could get rid of that feeling...it's the last nagging thing!

Why do I need that? Why doesn't H's validation which he gives me not enough? The other night we were watching something together (H & I) and I made a reference to something obscure...he got all sweet and looked at me...he said "The fact that you just said that...I love you." I mean it's not a big deal but all kinds of little things like that with H don't do a thing for me. When AP gives me a TEENY TINY compliment it makes my whole year! Are most people this way? Do I need to bite the bullet and invest in counseling to understand it or what?

I just wanted AP to adore me. That desire was overwhelming and it was independant of the way I felt about him.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 09-10-2010
Thu, 07-26-2012 - 2:14am
I need his validation too and I hate it so much. I don't want to feel this way, and like you said, H's compliments or sweet words don't do anything for me :/
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2010
Thu, 07-26-2012 - 3:01am

Blue,

I have no idea why, but validation from men who you already feel you "own" doesn't matter to you.  It is the unattainable guy, the guy you see as above you somehow, that you need to have.  I think that down deep, you are insecure (aren't we all), and that in order to prove to yourself that you are sexy and desireable, you need that validation.  I think it does even happen with your H.  When he pulls away and stops admiring you, you immediately get interested and his opinion starts to matter more.  

I'm assuming the a T would have you start working on your self-esteem so that the need for validation from picky people like XAP is less vital to you. 

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-31-2011
Fri, 07-27-2012 - 11:10am

I feel the exact same way.  Anything H says to me is totally discounted and I don't put any value on it.  It almost seems annoying to me...AP isn't really giving me much of anything except "I'm traveling for work" and "I'm with customers" when I pour my soul out and/or ask him things...ugh!

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-18-2009
Fri, 07-27-2012 - 12:13pm

Apart from that Janejosie, there is something called manipulation. Yes, a slow and degrading manipulation by the APs. A low self-esteem is required for the  AP to be able to do it. I have been thinking and reading about this, and it seems that even the manipulation becomes part of the game and fun. You can see the elements of Sadism too, where the "victim" is sometimes a willing "victim". Instead of physical pain, it is psychological and mental pain that's been inflicted by the AP, followed by throwing some crumbs. As time goes by, the intensity of the suffering only goes up, and there is pretty much nothing that can prevent the process, unless the manipulator stops enjoying, has found another victim, or inflicts unbearable suffering on the victim, such as public humiliation. Now you might argue that an element of manipulation is seen in perhaps all As, which is true, but it is the degree that makes them distinguished. Just as you could say there is an element of attraction to the same gender in everybody, changing from 0.001% to 120% :smileywink:

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-18-2009
Fri, 07-27-2012 - 12:28pm

Hey borderline,

Your husband sounds like me when I was married, more or less. Now I've been told that women need to be complimented constantly (too late), but your husband is right about other men compliementing you to be totally unacceptable behavior. There is a reason the society created the institution of marriage and invented the wedding band (for both spouses). Not everybody is the jealous type. Can you change him by triggering some jealousy? No, you'll probably push him further back. Have I learned my lesson and would give my future wife daily compliments after 10 years into the marriage? I don't know. It's easy for men to get complacent and take things for granted. Would having an A give you what you want in terms of being adored? yes, for a while, and after that it is normally cycles of pain and pleasure. Unless.... unless, you discard the AP after a couple of months and find a new one, or you get lucky and and find someone that will really love you, not just lust over you in the beginning. good luck.

 

 

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-10-2012
Fri, 07-27-2012 - 3:01pm
lannmann, u hit it really hard on the manipulation part. Will I ever learn to put a stop to it? I have left my H because of that, but he still controls me so much because of our 3 children. AP still plays around, and still lies left and right for things don't even matter for what so ever. I have to act like I believe him, if not a BIG disagreement breaks out (not a fight according to him). I don't know when will I be able to heal from all this men cr*p, yes have to let go of both of them right?
As far as men making me feel good, my AP does by complementing me all the time, thanking me left and right, showing and telling me how much he cares, I know I know...he doesn't have to live with me.... but I think that is just how he is. I really appreciate him being that way. My H NEVER even thanked me for anything ever, or said "honey you look nice". Instead, why are you wearing that, why didn't you do it or some sh!t like that.
iVillage Member
Registered: 09-10-2010
Fri, 07-27-2012 - 4:03pm
Lannmann, did you read all this in a book or online? I think it's very interesting what you're saying. I've read a lot about manipulation too, and mostly in regard to narcissists. Do you think these manipulators REALIZE that they're being manipulative?
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2010
Fri, 07-27-2012 - 4:23pm

Iannmann,

I completely agree.  I was talking to anotherseyes last night and I said that I must enjoy some elements of S&M  because I have been involved in a masochistic A for 3 years.  And I am a willing victim.  How weird is it that the game is appealing somehow and a turn on?  I'm glad I'm not the only one who sees this in an A.

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-18-2009
Fri, 07-27-2012 - 5:01pm
itstime2010 wrote:
Lannmann, did you read all this in a book or online? I think it's very interesting what you're saying. I've read a lot about manipulation too, and mostly in regard to narcissists. Do you think these manipulators REALIZE that they're being manipulative?

I had read one S&M short novel maybe 20 years ago, and it felt bizarre, but the similarity between S&M and and the all too common manipulation we read about here just occurred to me as I was writing that, i.e, it's my own theory :smileywink:

The narcissist is the key element in these manipulations. I am not sure, but I think they don't REALIZE that they're being manipulative, or if they are, because it has been a gradual build-up, they are not aware of its intensity. Somewhat like the "boiling frog" experiment, the victim might not even know he/she is being manipulated!

The issue is a deep-seated psychological disorder, that could go as back as their childhood. It is not humane and not normal.

 

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-18-2009
Fri, 07-27-2012 - 5:12pm
janejosie wrote:

Iannmann,

I completely agree.  I was talking to anotherseyes last night and I said that I must enjoy some elements of S&M  because I have been involved in a masochistic A for 3 years.  And I am a willing victim.  How weird is it that the game is appealing somehow and a turn on?  I'm glad I'm not the only one who sees this in an A.

I can imagine why the game could be appealing, although I'm not endorsing it in any way, and it doesn't have to be that way to be appealing. Consider the case where there this element, or in it's more subtle form, the rollercoaster is removed from the A: there is nothing lacking (except leaving marriages) and there is no NC/LC, there is continuous banter, flirting, compliments, friendship, emotions, sex....
As bad as it sounds, for some people that could become ordinary and lose its excitement. Happiness, thrill, joy, etc. are relative terms, there most be a "low", such that the "high" can be felt and measured against. Just like there must be "work" for the "break" to have any meaning. You can't be on indefinite break :smileywink:

 

P.S: Janejosie: If you want men to look "down there", put less emphasis on "up there". In other words, use less eye-liner :smileywink:

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