question for OW here/general whining

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-04-2004
question for OW here/general whining
36
Thu, 04-15-2004 - 10:38am
I'm trying very hard to sort things out. In trying to do things for others and keep a little bit of something for myself, I'm making a mess.

I've moved out a week and a half ago. At the house, I have lots of musical instruments, etc. that I didn't move to my apartment because I don't think the 75 year old lady below me wants me to "rock and roll all night." I left my PCs, my TV, my stereo... pretty much everything. It was a civil exit from the W and I didn't want to make it about "how much stuff I can pack."

Months ago I had planned some friends coming to the house this weekend to play music so I'm trying to get things arranged for that. I've been over to the house two evenings this week for a few hours, but still was at the OW's by 10pm to slip into bed beside her. She's not really at all happy that I'm back at the house for anything.

I try to figure out how much to share with her. I want to try to quell her fears about a reconciliation with the W (which ain't happening) but it doesn't seem me telling her helps much. I'm really tired of the whole thing, and sometimes I feel like if I just gave her more information about how the process is going with the W that she'll be ok and get over it some.

I have given up a lot of "things" that I worked hard to get, assuming I'll get some of them later but with no real guarantee. I miss my dog, my home, and pretty much everything. My W doesn't want to tell anyone about my moving out either until she feels strong enough to face questions, so I have one friend who knows... and he isn't really being a very good friend, to be honest.

I'm fairly broke at this point trying to pay for two apartments, living expenses, and such and my W is hanging our big tax return out there like some heroine-laced carrot: one bite and I'll be hooked again. "You know, maybe a week in Europe would give us a chance to reconnect." Not likely. But going from my great house with lots of comforts and things to my apartment with a bed, one lamp, and a folding chair... actually, it might stink if I were ever really there.

In the mean time, the OW doesn't seem to always be dialed in to my financial situation. I've run up several thousand on my cards this year trying to get her here and settled, and while I'm not trying to use that as leverage to get some understanding... um... well, I guess I'd like to use that as leverage to get some understanding, to be perfectly honest.

My R with the OW is based so, so much on being honest. We've shared things neither of us shared with anyone else, including lots we didn't share with the people we married. Now, already I start to feel like I'm not being entirely honest because I'm not telling her that spending $20 to buy a tanning package while I pay the $17 for munchkin's school pictures is a little frustrating. I get that she is excited about having some help, a job and not being dirt poor for the first time in years, but just that little thing made me feel like a fool. She is talking about a second cat and "would I mind" and maybe it would be fun to raise Pomeranians at some point... while I'm mumbling quietly about missing my dog but how with three places I'm split between I can't do that to my wonderful pet.

You know, I can't even use the word "home" any more without one of these two women making a face. Truth is, I don't even know which place is home right now.

anyway, last night when OW was snippy with me for being at the house for two hours she didn't know that it was this big, emotionally crunching event -- my W has finally went to therapy and the therapist the last two times has told her *exactly* what I've been saying for two years, so now she wants to cry on me about being sorry.

So here's the question part for those of you still reading... Other Women, what part of this would you want to hear? What part is important to share? Keep it to myself, except "I love you, sweetie" ? I just don't know, it's all so confusing sometimes. I guess I feel like the OW can't assign any "relationship value" to actions she doesn't know about, and at some point I selfishly need some of those points. I feel like I'm already sort of being taken for granted a little, and I could stay where I'm at and get that sensation...

Women, your thoughts and observations are welcome.

rain

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-14-2004
Fri, 04-16-2004 - 10:31am
Rain,

I've resisted posting to this thread because I could tell you were looking for input from the women on the board. I knew my perspective wouldn't be so much helpful as sympathetic. I too am attempting to extricate myself from my M while still keeping a friendly R with my W. It is even more crucial for me since there are children involved. But I do understand the fine line you have to walk. You must be friendly with your W, but not so friendly that she gains hope you'll be coming back. And you must give hope to your OW, but you must do so without completely cutting off contact with your W. I suspect this will get easier for you as time passes. Your OW and W will both realize you're not going back. There is no way to tell if you and your W will be able to remain friends throughout the D, but hopefully after a grieving period you can become friends again. And the doubts that have probably scared your OW will fade as you build towards a future with her. I wish you all the luck in the world and I hope to follow in your footsteps. Stay strong man.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-04-2004
Fri, 04-16-2004 - 11:52am
LOL. Ah, PG, the reliable wet blanket. I could never dislike a skeptic. Being skeptical and keeping everyone reasonable and honest is an unappreciated role, and one I'm not suited for, so I'll appreciate whatever gray clouds you choose to gather. Like a shot from the doctor, everyone needs a skeptic from time to time.

;)

Tried men... hmm... no, but a few men have tried to pick me up. LOL. Turns out if you can dress yourself in colors that complement without clashing *and* talk fluently about how to decorate, gay men assume you're playing for the same team.

And the OW is a Sagitarius. Nothing matches Leo for sparks like Sag. The three women (including my OW) who I've had the most wonderful relationships with (as well as the best sex) were all Sagitarians.

rain

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-04-2004
Fri, 04-16-2004 - 11:56am
thanks omaha... please don't hesitate to chime in on anything, even if I started out picking the brains of the OW here.

I think you're right about everything you said. It will get easier, it already has in just a week and a half. Both women just have problems dealing with my careful and methodical process so far though for different reasons so I'm trying to vent here instead of to the women in my life... they don't really need any more stress from me. LOL.

rain

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-23-2004
Fri, 04-16-2004 - 12:06pm
Hi Rain Again:

It sounds like you have it all together now, what you want.

I am happy for you, thanks for letting me know you were with

your W for 10years, and your still friends.

Your getting it all together, and I am happy for you.

Do you have any advise (from a mans pont of view) for me?


Thanks, Bunny

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-04-2004
Fri, 04-16-2004 - 12:29pm
hi bunny

Thanks for the vote of confidence. I'm not sure I have it all together all of the time, but I'm trying. As for remaining friends with my W as we separate... well, every day is a new day and no lawyers have been brought in yet. I'm hopeful, optimistic even... but it will be as day to day as the weather.

As for advice... I'll tell you what a friend told me last year. This woman is 51, twenty years older than me, and has led quite a roller coaster of a life. I love her dearly and respect her immensely, so when she speaks, I listen. I'll repeat for you what she told me as I first began to struggle with the A (which she was the first to know about.)

"Ask yourself this question: 'What is the central message of my life?' Not the theme, not the idea, not who you are, but what message would you call the one you most want to convey to people. If you were a T-shirt and had to keep your message short, what would you say? And be honest with yourself. "

For me, the answer took a few weeks of real thought. When I answered her she said:

"Now that you have your message, ask yourself this: 'Are my actions, is my life congruent with that message?' Are the people around me aware that this is my message, or do they think I'm saying something else I don't mean to? Are there people in my life who, if they heard that message said aloud would obviously scoff or dismiss it? Every action you undertake that is incongruent with your message will leave you unsatisfied. "

She suggested that every action that ran counter to my central message would in some small or large way bring me pain, and that every time I set that message aside or was in any way untrue to it, I would feel it. She also suggested that it couldn't and shouldn't happen overnight, but that as I moved towards my Truth I would lose friends and weed out the insincere supporters, but in the end I wouldn't need all of it because I'd be supported from the inside. And she was dead on right. And I don't miss those people at all.

As with any growth process, mine is incomplete and always will be. I struggle every day not to become a self-centered, raging egomaniac (cuz I have those tendencies.) I've been there, it didn't make me at all happy. So I'm trying to follow my central message now, and my life is much better. This advice changed my life, and very much so for the better. Do with it as you will.

Good Luck.

rain

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-23-2004
Fri, 04-16-2004 - 1:00pm
Thanks Rain:

My message I believe would say " Be Confident"

It is short but means so much. You need confidence in yourself

first, before you can have confidence and trust in someone

else in your life. Do you agree?

I am going to trust your answers, and be confident in myself

and whatever is going to be will be. I will take this slow,

and one day at a time. Thanks for the male input, I need

a mans input, being I have never gone thru something like this

before. I don't was to hurry or hurt anyone.

I have to live with myself first.

Please keep giving me advise.....I do appreciate it. One more question.

I do not e-mail him first, I always wait.

Since we only e-mail at work, we respect each others work habits first.

When it gets late in the afternoon, and the work process slows down,

that is usually when we either speak or e-mail each other, but I

never do it first. I do not want to seem pushy, or too excited.

Is that the correct way of handeling the day to day communication

in your opinion?

Thanks, Bunny

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-24-2003
Fri, 04-16-2004 - 1:18pm
I am not Rain, obviously, but I hope you don't mind me chiming in. No, I don't think you are handling your communication right. Unless he specifically asked you not to email him first and wait for him to email you I think you should shoot him an email every once in a while just so he knows that you are thinking of him. A relationship is a two way street even if it's an affair. There is a big difference between being pushy and showing that you care. Sorry if I sound a bit harsh but if I were him I would probably think "why is it that I always have to initiate? Just how interested is she in being with me?" You are trying so hard not to seem too excited that you are making it look like he is not very important to you.

Just a thought, hon.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-23-2004
Fri, 04-16-2004 - 1:31pm
I appreciate the input.....I did not want him to think I

was pushy..and you may be right in your thinking..

I will e-mail him this afternoon, maybe he will like that.

How often do you suggest emailing him first? More than

twice a week or more often than that?


Thanks, Bunny

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-24-2003
Fri, 04-16-2004 - 2:02pm
Do what you feel comfortable with. Twice a week is fine. Hon, it's not the frequency that matters but just the fact that he'll know that he's been on your mind. Nothing serious or heavy - something cute and playful to make his day. I'm sure in a little while he will be looking forward to coming to work in the morning to an email from you.
iVillage Member
Registered: 01-14-2004
Fri, 04-16-2004 - 2:41pm
I still think you're doing things the right way. It may seem that they both have difficulties dealing with your methodical style, but in the long term, they'll both appreciate it I think. If you were to rush into things, you'd certainly offend one or both of them. Not to mention the fact it would be detrimental to your future. Just be strong and confident (or at least appear to :) ). And don't let your loyalty to either woman make you do something you know is wrong.