Rain,Brin,Anybody That Will Listen

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-17-2004
Rain,Brin,Anybody That Will Listen
8
Tue, 05-18-2004 - 1:13pm
Very Long!!!

First, I have to thank Rain & Brin, thank you 2 so much for your words! Rain, you don't realize how much comfort & at the same time fear that your words bring to me.

This may be too long but I have to tell my story, maybe you can better understand why I'm still hanging on. I'm not really sure where to start w/my story but here goes. I was married for 17 very long, very horrible years. I was from the start of that marriage very verbally & emotionally abused & did seek counseling to resolve those issues which I feel that I did. Towards the end of our M I was accused of having affairs with several different men that I work with (My MM was one of those) I never had an A and never had any intention of doing so. I finally ended the M, went through my counseling & was even dating another man when my MM started confiding in me about problems within his M. I told him that life was too short to be unhappy but I couldn't tell him what to do it was something he would have to do on his own. We became very close friends after that he would ask me about things that happened during my M & I in turn would ask him what kind of things were happening to him. He asked me where I wanted my life to go & I told him I wanted to find someone to love who would love me just as much in return. About that same time the man that I had started dating during my divorce started giving me some trouble I confided in my MM he was the only friend I felt that I had. He told me not to worry about it we would check up on him & we did. We met one evening after work & drove to where this OM lived about 1 hour away, we talked the whole time about where one day we would like for our lives to be. I could tell he was very upset about something I just didn't know it was me, I don't read people very well, so I asked him why he was so upset. He pulled off beside the road & told me he was crazy about me I was floored I had no idea & was absolutely speechless. He asked me how I felt & I was brutally honest with him I told him that I thought he was a very great, kind person and I thought a lot of him as a friend! He didn't stop there, he then asked me if I thought I could ever care for him I told him I didn't think so he was a MM & I could never be anything more than a friend he seemed to be okay with that but I could tell he wasn't happy with my answer. We then left, after driving for a while he stopped again & tried to once again tell me how he felt. He then told me please forgive me for what I'm about to do & then kissed me, I pulled back and asked him if he was in love with me. His reply was that yes he had been for a long time. I still had nothing to give back so he took me home after that night he would leave sweet little notes everywhere, would tell me over & over just how much that he loved me. What can I say, I was weak, I fought it for a while, then finally I just knew that I was crazy about him too & loved him with everything that I have & still do. I will never forget telling him that I loved him too, I will never forget how happy he was or the look on his face or the way that he held me & told me that he would never ever hurt me & that he would love me for the rest of his life. After that it has just been a whirlwind of emotion some good days some not so good. There have been some terrible hurts along the way, his W became pregnant early on in our R I came very close to ending it then with him begging me to be there for him. I'm still here & now can't get him to be there for me the baby is now almost a year old. Even through all the hurt I love him now more than ever before & want to be right beside him for the rest of my life.

Sorry this is so long, do you think I will ever be more a part of his life? How did I get myself to this point?

RJH

Thanks so much for letting me vent, it helps so much!!!

iVillage Member
Registered: 12-28-2003
Tue, 05-18-2004 - 2:52pm


NO to the question

Like the rest of us you willfully blinded yourself to the truth of your situation and what MM is really all about.

iVillage Member
Registered: 04-16-2004
Tue, 05-18-2004 - 3:00pm
Welcome back, rjh!

cl-noregretsyet (co-cl of MAS board)
&#16
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-04-2004
Tue, 05-18-2004 - 4:30pm
RJH,

I think you're in a really bad situation. I'll try to share some insight from my standpoint, because I look at your MM and say "there but by the grace...."

I started my EMA about 18 months ago. If early in my EMA I would have found my W to be pregnant, I would have left the EMA to try to save my M. A mistake probably, but that's what I would have done. So very thankfully that didn't happen.

Even with no children to consider it has been a very difficult thing to leave my rocky M. Like your MM, I was unhappy and moving towards being ready to leave when I got into an EMA. Also like your MM, I was still (very infrequently) having sex with my W. There were times I didn't want to because I was honestly afraid she'd stopped taking birth control and would try to "fix" our R with a child. Not saying that's what happened to him, just saying that I understand that as a compassionate and needy human being, I did have sex with my W because it was mostly comfortable and safe and we all have some need for contact. He probably did the same.

I'm sorry to suggest that you probably should have walked when he found out his W was pregnant. Hindsight isn't worth very much, I know. But more than likely he is dealing with tremendous guilt at the thought of leaving his W and young child, and to be honest I don't think I could have done it. Not making a judgement call on right or wrong, just saying I don't think I have the spine to make that sort of decision; the one I made was hard enough. Your MM is likely going through the same thing.

After a year of being torn between you and his other life/wife/child, he is (if he's even remotely like most men I know here and elsewhere) probably starting to become bitter. Bitter at his W and M for being "trapped" and not being with you, and also bitter with you for not understanding that he doesn't feel like he has any control over his life. Again, I wasn't facing what he's facing and I did (and sometimes still do) face the two women in my life and wish they'd both just leave me alone. From time to time, I wished someone would make the decision for me... maybe that's part of how he's feeling with his recent remarks.

Well, not really, but the stress and anxiety of the situation creates a sense of powerlessness that can be overwhelming. You just don't feel like there's anything you can do to get what you want without destroying lives one way or the other. Yes, we should all know as adults that we stand to have that issue when we get into the situation, but that isn't always a deterent (unfortunately.)

I'm sorry, RJH. I think it will be very difficult for your MM to end his M, leave his W and child and make a go of it with you, even if he does love you as much as he said. You probably need to start to consider whether your life can be lived the perpetual OW who can find some happiness in the little bit he will be able to give you or whether you can be the one who calls everything off.

Good luck. I wish I had a sunnier outlook for you... but it's probably time to start taking to heart the reality of the situation.

rain

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-14-2004
Tue, 05-18-2004 - 5:19pm
I have to say, I read all the responses to your post so far and I fully disagree with them. Of course, I have a different perspective than most. I'm not sure if you know my story so I will list the details here for you.

I have been married 8 years and I have a 5 year old and another child on the way. I've known for a long time that my marriage was lacking something but refused to admit it to myself. There were sexual indiscretions on both sides, but I chalked it up to simply being human. But I didn't like who I was and the things I was doing. I had basically convinced myself it was okay to be unhappy. I was ready to live my life that way.

Then I met IS. She and I had been friends and had lost contact for a couple of years. She came back into my life by chance last fall and without intending to, we fell in love. That forced me to reexamine everything in my life. I wasn't sure at that time that IS and I could have a future together, but I knew that I could no longer accept a life without love. So I entered counseling with my W to make sure there was no way to resolve the issues. Counseling simply reinforced what I already knew...that my marriage didn't just have problems, it didn't have the foundation to survive. At that point I felt it was only fair to be honest with my W. I told her I wanted to stay until after the baby was born. But she thought it would be better and more fair to her for me to move out sooner.

So here I am, 3 days removed from moving into an apartment. I am working to get my life in order and spending time with my son. Once the baby comes, things will be a little different, but I am a great father and will continue to be. IS and I are planning our future together and will continue to build on what we have.

I don't know if all of this helps you, but I wanted you to know that even in a difficult situation, it is possible for a man to be strong and make the right decision for his happiness and that of others. Whether your MM can or will do this is a question better asked of him. Of course there is guilt in leaving in this type of situation. But if he does things the right way and is responsible, it can be done. I wish you all the luck in the world and no matter what, know that you deserve happiness. Take care.

iVillage Member
Registered: 04-21-2004
Tue, 05-18-2004 - 5:35pm
I love you Omaha

IS

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-16-2004
Tue, 05-18-2004 - 10:39pm
RJH

I know how you feel, somewhat anyway. My MM also feels he cannot leave his M for us right now because of his teenaged daughter and her depression problems.

I often wonder if we don't actually enable our MM to stay in their marriages by sticking by them as the OW. You see so many divorces out there and it doesn't seem to matter if there are kids or not or what age they are. I know there is tremendous guilt for them, I felt it over leaving my ExH and we didn't even have kids. But still, if they can avoid the guilt and still find some happiness with us...where is the incentive to leave.

There may come a time when you might want to give him an ultimatum. Pick a date when you absolutely need him to leave his W by or you walk. Let him know that if he leaves you will be waiting for him (until the time you find someone else and move on of course), but if not, you can get on with your life knowing that he probably would never have left. That's kind of where I am at in figuring out what I am going to do in my situation....now I just need to pick that absolute date. :)

Take Care,

Brin

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-04-2004
Wed, 05-19-2004 - 9:28am
just a couple of follow up notes to my other post...

First, Omaha is doing pretty much exactly what you're hoping your MM will do. Personally, I can't get over the amount of strength Omaha has to exhibit to get this done and I kind of marvel at it any time he speaks up about it. I think after two months of being here and talking with him, he knows I have nothing but respect and admiration for his consistency and willingness to walk a thorny, rough path.

My caveat to that for you... just remember that Omaha is the exception. Most men just aren't going to be able to do it. I couldn't, and I'll wager that most men look at his situation and your MM's situation and shiver. Not saying your MM can't or won't, just hoping that you're realistic in your expectations. My best friend just found out I've been having an EMA for 18 months without a single person besides the OW knowing and he can't believe I could handle all of that alone. I look at Omaha with similar disbelief. We all have our thresholds.

Second, to follow up Brin's suggestion of setting an ultimatum date...

That is what my OW did to me. She moved here from 2000 miles away and she gave me a date by which to move in -- twice. The first time I moved some things into her apartment, but just couldn't leave my house. The second time, about a month later, I guess I could really sense that I was losing her and I could see it in her eyes. At that point I decided I just couldn't have that happen. I'd already rented an apartment, I just hadn't moved in yet, so I told my OW that I had sought counsel of others (a close friend, someone who'd been in the same situation, and this board, in fact) who believed it best I get my own place for the time being. And when I could see that she really meant to move back home if I didn't come through that weekend, there really wasn't a choice to make.

The caveat to this particular threat is that you have to be ready to move on. Ultimatums were hinted at to me, but I didn't take them too seriously for a while. I didn't figure she'd really leave. When it became apparent she was ready to walk, I realized what I was about to lose. I wish I'd been stronger earlier, it would have saved us some heartache that we're still working through, but the ultimatum did work, and I'm glad she did it to get me going.

rain

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-16-2004
Wed, 05-19-2004 - 8:49pm
Rain

Thank you so much for sharing your ultimatum situation. It has made me much more sure that it is what I must do. Although, I am looking at over a year for that final date to occur (I would want to wait until his daughter, who is a very troubled young woman, is at least 16yrs so that she would be able to drive herself to see her father whenever she wanted). At least now I have some insight into taking this route and confirmation that this is the way for me. I really really appreciate that, as it was driving me crazy not having a plan or a light at the end of this long dark tunnel. I think I will need to spend the next year making myself strong enough to go through with it, whatever the end result may be.

Much Gratitude!

Brin