screaming ranting fit
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| Thu, 05-20-2004 - 10:28am |
What is the deal? How can I possibly have so many problems with the women in my life?
The W called last night to ask if I'd like to go out of town Memorial Day weekend. Duh. I moved out. I don't come over. I've told you I don't see a way to reconcile and we should start to talk about how to achieve a peaceful end to this, and you want to know if I want to go out of town for 3 days? Are you insane?
The OW is also insane. I've been there every single night since I moved out, I've done everything she wants to do, she's met my best friends, I'm doing things with her and her daughter every weekend, and she still isn't happy. Not to mention our previously furious sex has stopped -- not reduced, but stopped. The other night I lost to a Stephen King book. Gee, this feels just like being married except there has been a significant financial change. I could move back home and be treated this way except there I at least have a big screen to go watch.
I don't mean to offend any women here, but I have a question, and I mean this as sensitively as I can ask it...
Why do women get psycho change-o? BOTH of these women were one person while they were trying to get me, and now they are acting like different people. I know, we all change once we're moving further into a relationship, but I really feel like I get better once I commit and the women I commit to start to just take advantage of that. I swear, I'm done being nice and I'm going to start becoming a beer-swilling, SportsCenter-watching, belly-scratching misogynist like 90% of other men. These men's women are (for a large part) desperate to make them happy and get them to pay attention to them.
I'm so sick of giving a damned and trying to bring happiness to these people. I must be out of my mind. Every single woman I've ever dated or been with isn't happy once they have my full attention and I start treating them like the goddesses they are to me. Maybe I'm just doing this wrong. Maybe I really need to be a jackass more often, one who doesn't want them so much. And yes, I'm completely serious.
I realized yesterday in the course of having a private meltdown that my central problem is that I don't like for people to be disappointed in me. It started, I believe, with my mother and spending most of my time around her, trying to keep her from being disappointed in me. So I'm still doing that, putting everyone else first and not doing a very good job of worrying about myself at all. I'm trying to have a civil exit from my M because I can't stand to see that sad, disappointed look in her eyes despite how much she's hurt me. I have kind of put myself in a financial and emotional hole at this point because I don't want my OW to be disappointed. And in the end, everyone around me just keeps taking.
I know. Like I said, I'm just ranting. Kind of losing it today. Thanks for reading. We now return to me trying to focus on helping others instead of whining about myself.
rain

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Taken for granted and the role of the "primary giver" can get tiring after a while. Very lonely place to be if you ask me. Where the hell is that safe place you can put you can bury your head in??? sigh.
So then, what can you do? Why don't you just step back from both of them and take some time for yourself? Even if they protest, explain that you have recently been through a great deal and that you need some time and space to put everything into perspective. Stop trying to please, for at least a weekend, and do something for you. Drink beer, watch sports, scratch whatever you want to, but just take care of you.
As for your question about why we tend to go psycho-change-o, well, I don't know. In the past few weeks it seems that many of us on the board, myself included, have been experiencing similar feelings, and I don't know that any of us have figured them out. I think that the general consensus is that if you want more attention, you have to give less, but that game just sucks. I suppose the only real advice I can give other than to put yourself first for a change (which, by the way, does not necessarily translate into being a jerk), is just talk to OW and find out what she's thinking. As for W, well...I'd say it's about time you put her on skates. You have no hopes for reconciliation, and you have done the best you can to make this easy on her. In my opinion, the best thing for both of you is to end it quickly.
Other than that, all I can say is I'm sorry you're feeling so down and that we are of course here to listen. Hugs,
~Notso
Golly. I just love dispensing advice when I'm unable to follow it in my own messed up life. LOL!!!!!!
Anyway, hang in there and feel free to rant and rave any time.
Peace
GB2
Now the cynical part: I believe that it's human nature for people to desire most what they can't have. Period. Some people will argue and say they aren't like that, but by and large, I think it's our tendency to idealize whatever situation in which we are NOT. So when OW knew you were still attached and somewhat unavailable, your relationship intensified (and it's not that she doesn't have genuine feelings/love/whatever for you. I'm just saying that the unavailability sweetens the pot). Now that the W knows you're unavailable to her, she wants you. It's not a man/woman thing, I don't think. It's a human thing.
I look at it this way. If I lived in a country that had no access to, say, *chocolate*, I can bet that I would crave chocolate every day of my life. I would dream about it. I would want it more than anything else. But here in the U.S. (thanks to Milton Snavely Hershey who decided that even we "commoners" should have access to sweetness!) I can have chocolate every damned day of my life! Do I? Nope. I haven't thought about chocolate in AGES.
But take it away, and I'll fight you to the death if that's what I need to do to get some.
I know this probably isn't helpful or particularly insightful, nor does it provide any clear answers. I guess it's just a matter of understanding how human relationships change and evolve, and it comes down to a matter of whether or not you're ready to embrace those changes.
But definitely talk to OW first. Find out what the motivation is for this change.
I wish you the best.
KC
Edited 5/20/2004 11:44 am ET ET by fantasyhere
You know I admire and respect you. And I know you were at a moment of weakness when you wrote this so I'll try not to give it too much weight. You certainly don't want to become the type of man you're describing. And I'm quite certain if you tried, you'd be miserable. You're much too self-aware to be content with yourself in that mode.
I do know how you feel. My M was based on me working as hard as possible to make her happy. There is nothing wrong with that in theory, but ultimately the other person must care just as much about making you happy. Otherwise you eventually collapse when you realize all your efforts have only gotten you a content person who has no interest in giving you the time of day. I too grew up with a mother who leaned on me way too much. It made me deeper emotionally, but it also made me a little too eager to please. However, I will not change myself to fit what women typically seek in a relationship. Nor will I change to avoid getting hurt. What I am doing and will continue to do, is pursue a relationship with someone who likes me for who I am and works just as hard as I do to make it work. Someone who doesn't expect me to be a certain way, but appreciates it when I am.
I know you feel your OW has changed now that she "has you". I don't know her at all so I can't say whether this is true or not. But I know in my M, I felt like that was the case. And when I looked at it in retrospect, I realized she hadn't fooled me, I had fooled myself. Early in my R with my W, I was working so hard to convince her to love me, I ignored my own feelings. So by the time I realized I didn't love her, I was very deep in the situation. My advice to you would be to step back and evaluate your OW. Is she really the person you believed she was? If so, I'm sure you can work through these problems with communication and effort from both of you.
I am so sorry you are going through all of this turmoil. Just be true to yourself. I know you're the type of person who likes to please others. But the last thing you need is to find yourself in another bad M. Take this time to really examine everything and don't do anything rash. I will say again that I think you should be spending more time alone. It may be time to tell the OW you need some of that space if you are to continue in this R. I wish you all the luck in the world. Feel free to e-mail me if you ever want to talk. Take care.
You know, I just think I need to learn to follow my instincts. All the time. I can't think of when I've followed my instincts and been wrong, but I can think of lots of times that I ignored what I was feeling/thinking/observing and later wished I'd listened to myself.
My W is one of those times. If I'd had the strength six years ago to follow my instincts, I wouldn't be in this situation with her.
As for OW... as much as I love her, and as much as I often think we're Soul Mates, I looked at her when she was 2000 miles away and thought to myself, "Here's a person who is wonderful and has a good heart, but who spends way too much time looking to the future and how happy she'll be 'when' or says 'if I only...'"
And maybe that's happened here- that she wanted us to work out so much and that was something to focus on, some happy thing to put on the horizon. Now she has us (for all practical purposes) so she has to focus on the other things she doesn't have or what she'd like (to go home to visit, to get a house, to have camping equipment so she can sprint off to the wilderness because she 'needs her getaway', etc.) It's kind of strange considering she gave me such grief over wanting to keep a handful of things that are important to me from the house.
If I'd followed my instincts, I would have probably still done this, but I would have been much more direct in the beginning, telling her that I think she tends to live for future instant gratification and I just don't/can't live that way any more; if nothing else, I would have had a reaction from her to judge.
And actually I've been thinking about the whole sex thing. She was a sex fiend when she wasn't really dating anyone and all we had was cyber to go off of, and always wanting more of me when she couldn't have me, but now... well, it doesn't have the urgency it once did. Which just blows my mind since our R sparked off of shared sexual interests. Once it turned the corner into being a real R, I thought we'd be fantastic together. But now it's just kind of coasting until she gets whatever it is she wants now.
I guess I find this all strange because I'm so much the opposite: I live quite a lot in the Now. Most of the time I'm just very happy and content. My best friend told me he thought maybe I was losing it because I didn't seem completely broken down over the mess my life is in; he was afraid maybe I was in denial. I told him that life was good, every day had at least some positive moments in it and I was really happy and patient because I don't really have anywhere to go or any hurry to get there. Why work myself up about the future or all the things I have to do to get there? I can't live tomorrow until it gets here. He just looks at me like I've lost it. Then again, he's a good Catholic boy and I'm a weird Buddhist/Christian/New Age combo platter. LOL.
I wasn't always this way, but in the last 2 years I've really learned and grown to be happy with waking up in the morning, maybe spending a few minutes with a guitar... I just can't seem to get anyone in this boat with me, and with only one person paddling, my little boat just goes in circles...
Anyway. Thanks to all of you for being friends and neighbors and throwing in your two cents.
rain
I may not be in your boat, but I'm paddling alongside you. I too am appreciating each day and I'm feeling happy and content with myself for maybe the first time in my life. Sure, my life is in a bit of upheaval and there are still more changes ahead. But I'm stopping to smell the roses now. I'm noticing things I never did before and even enjoying my time alone.
I don't have all the answers for you, but I think you're headed down the right path. You and your OW certainly need to communicate regardless of how things work out. Hopefully she is just going through a bad patch and you two will be able to get through this. But I think following your instincts is a good thing. Just remember that no one is perfect. All relationships take work. But if the bond isn't strong enough in the beginning, it is destined to fail.
Good luck with everything man and don't give up on you. I think you're approaching a level of self-awareness that is truly a wonderful thing. And as I said, I'm heading in the same direction. Be strong and honest. That's really all you can do.
I agree with much of what the other posters have said, especially Omaha. I just wanted to add another thought. You have mentioned that your marriage to your W was built on the foundation of your trying so hard to make it work and your trying to make her the "one." As you found, that sort of foundation is shaky and bound to crumble. As I have been reading your posts this morning, the 'warning' sign began flashing in my mind for you. Are you *possibly* in the same situation with your OW? Like Omaha, I don't know her and I can only glean a very small sense of your R with her from a board like this. However, if you find yourself working overtime to please her, she has for all practical purposes lost interest in your previously incredible sex life, etc......does any of this sound/feel familiar to you?
I'm not trying to be negative, and in a perfect world you will find that you and she are going through a phase. But, please be open to the possibility that while there is nothing wrong with you as a person, or your OW, or even your W for that matter---maybe neither one of these women are the ONE for you. Just that simple.
Hang in there...I am thinking of you and sending you hugs and support! I hope things become clear for you and you are able to get back to feeling great.
Billie
I have recently left my a eith OM. While he treated me like a queen and DH took me for granted, I knew that it was a two way street and since i wrote DH off long ago maybe i should give him the benefit of doubt. Check back in with me in a couple of months to see how that's going :)
About the psycho part. I can honestly say i have played a hand in that. But getting older( and im only 26 so i use that losely) has made me more secure and i find the more at ease i am with myself, the less the psycho tendencies come out. And we all have them-god bless hormones.
People put on fronts, people change. Dh was like that- showered me with love and affection, once the ring was on- no play time for me. I do have a "not so normal" nsex drive but come on-that's not right.
OKay-so back to you. W-she's in denial. Pure and simple. It's hard and this is her way of dealing with. My suggestion, use padded gloves when talking to her about it.
OW- she's comfortable. W is out of the picture- she has you all to herself- time to let your guard down. Maybe talk to ehr non chalantly that some of the problems you ahd with W were the dramatic changes to her personality and sex drive once you got married. Might help. If it does let me know- i need to try that.
Good luck- have fun- hope you get her to put the book down.
P.S. I love sportscenter and drink beer- is that really so bad?
cw
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