Almost to divorce, need insights

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-04-2005
Almost to divorce, need insights
18
Thu, 01-26-2006 - 1:52pm

Hi everyone,

I've been married 12 years, has one 5 year old DS, and contemplating divorce. The problems in my M started when the baby arrived. Since that time, I had marked 18 years as the time when I can leave, for the sake of my child. I have come to realize, however, that this timeline is neither good for myself nor my son. My H is a good man, but over the years of turmoil, I have lost my love for him. I can safely say that I do not love him anymore, that I do not feel that I need him in my life, nor can I see me growing old with him. While the fights have subsided, we are emotionally closed to each other.

I had three talks with him last year, each escalating in seriousness. The first one was our marriage is in trouble (zero affection, zero communication). The second one was I think I don't love you anymore (Is love like a plant, if watered, will grow? Or once it's gone, it's gone?). Third talk was I don't love you anymore, I want us to go to counseling, and I will be looking to get out of the M if it doesn't work. Now I really headed toward the direction of divorce and not even wanting to try MC. I feel like MC won't help coz all it would do is to address symptoms. I feel the issue lies with me, that I am a different person from the 23 year old girl, and that H will not be able to change himself (not that I would want him to) to fulfill the me that I am now. I also feel that even if MC helps this time around, and we're okay another year or two, I'd be back at the same state of unhappiness/discontent that I am in now.

So I had the fourth talk with him two nights ago. I told him I want a divorce. He is so very very sad and wants to really give it a final try. I feel that it is too late. I have read that by the time women get to the stage I'm at, we are halfway out the door. Is it too late? Should I give it one last shot, for the sake of my marriage and my son? In a way, I feel like I settled and married the wrong man. So do I just accept that and make the best of it since he is willing to become a better husband and father?

If I choose divorce, how do I reconcile to myself that I'm making the right decision? As I said, H is a good man but we do not connect at all anymore, we're like roommates co-existing, sometimes harmoniously, sometimes tip-toeing around eggshells so as not to make the other one pissy. We also have built a good life together. We both earn a good living, own a house, take nice vacations, put away for retirement. So do I throw away all that and start over again? I know the only one who can answer this question is me. But if anyone has been through a similar situation, I would appreciate any insights.

The second issue is DS. From reading and talking to people, it appears to me that divorce at age 5 would be far easier than any other later age. I love him very much and he is very attached to me. He loves his father too, but is not as bonded with him. That's another thing I'm disappointed in H about -- while he loves DS, he's not the kind of father I thought he would be. So I almost feel like the sooner I go thru D, the easier it would be for him to adjust. If I wait, the more he will understand and perhaps blame/hate me.

Sorry for the long novel for a relatively common problem. Thanks for reading, and I would be grateful for any advice.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 11-28-2005
Fri, 01-27-2006 - 3:06pm

Ah, I've been you...in the 4th marriage...so heed that carefullly.

When you get into a marriage to meet needs of the moment, that demands that you change partners as needs change or situations arise.

What you're stating here is that "nothing I prioritized in terms of connectivity, sharing interests" was a priority when I chose him as a partner. I needed more external, financial or superficial needs addresssed - and being with him met those needs, so I saw himself thru this marriage as being "complete".

I've changed as a person, life has shown me I'm more capable of things than I thought, and I've expanded my definition of "great relationship" to include things that are of no relevance to him, and he's not interested in.

So now you're wanting a relationship "that includes the new elements you desire"...because nothing you've stated as what is missing can be achieved on your own.

That's "rebound" thinking prioritizing only what you haven't got, and have been staring at while developing a craving...and calling it a need.

I remember "needing' to be romanced, wined, dined, pursued, to be thought of as desirable and delicious.....so I left a perfectly good overall marriage - to have it.....with someone who didn't work, pay bills, or have any level of self-responsiblity.....that lasted 3 years and I was "dying" for a responsible, grounded, bill pyaing and working - and dumped him to get osmeone that did NOTHING but that and wanted nothing but that in a relationship. And to cap it off - he didn't want to work smart and hard to succeed - he simply wanted to kill time by working and achieving nothing.

So, you go to your husband and "be a man about it"......I say that because you're requiring yourself to do what you'd want done to you - if situations were reversed, and you'd be using something similar to that phraesology.

Be honest - tell him you married him to meet needs that have been met and been replaced with other needs he is not capable of meeting because of his own desires and definitions of great relationship. So nothing he's done has changed or beeen wrong - you were wrong to marry in a state of immature incompletion. YOu married him to "parent' you -and that's happened -and now like an adult you want to step up to the challenge of ilfe and define yourself - and become who you were meant to be. Not in defiance or adherance of him and his tandards, parameters, definitions, and goals - but in light of your own beliefs, needs, and self-requirement.

Then you file the paperwork, you move out, you let him move on because he'll possibly want to find someone that shares his definition fo "great relationship" which hasn't changed one iota - it just no longer meets your needs.

You get your life totaly set up where you're self-sufficient, self-reliant, you're dealing wit him on a civil and cordial basis for the children, and you're living large an din charge according to your definition. Don't go looking for a relationship to complete, fulfill or identify yourself.

That way, you won't be blaming him for waht you're not - and unrealistically go looking to someone else to make you what they can't. Nor will you have damaged the relationship for him and your children while you're becoming complete and secure in your life as a whole.

Erin
quickblade14@hotmail.com

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-13-2004
Fri, 01-27-2006 - 4:14pm

>>Edited to add: I like watching Dr. Phil and do so regularly. Funny how he always asks people if he can get them counseling. With a counselor. If stats were really that bad, why would he bother with 95% of the people on his show? (getting them counseling...)<<

another Dr Phil fan here too.

Actually it would be 66.6% of the people on his show ;-) Seriously though, if 1/3 of the marriages can be saved it's worth his effort. And the remaining 2/3 make for good viewing/ratings....many viewers love to watch a train wreck. Sorry to be so cynical about his motives, but he's gotta have some awful people on there to keep the viewer interested. And if he didn't promise counselling, nobody would go to his show. Dr Phil is a businessman as much as he's a life coach.

Anyway, there is also the selection process of choosing people for his show. We already know that he does a rigorous screening process before the show. And I'd lay money that part of the screening process involves the question "do you want to make this work?" And before he recommends counselling, he asks the same question on the show. He's not going to recommend counselling to a couple where one partner doesn't want to make it work...therefore, he wouldn't choose this type of couple for the show.

Though, as an exception to the above comment, I have seen a few couples on there where one partner was not interested in making the relationship continue. And Dr Phil didn't recommend counselling.

Dress Up Games, Doll Makers and Cartoon Dolls @ The Doll Palace
iVillage Member
Registered: 05-04-2005
Fri, 01-27-2006 - 5:46pm

Oh Erin, I think you hit the nail right on the head! And I am ashamed to admit it.

I had known in vague terms what I was feeling/seeking, but quite unsure. Having you spell it out so clearly in black and white, in brutally honest terms........ sigh.

What to do? What to do? My husband wants us to try and save our marriage. Should I try? Half of me wants to do just that. Do you think it is possible (since you know exactly what's happening to me) to fix the marriage given my mindset? Will I be satisfied and be happy if we fix the surface things? (I didn't wake up one morning and felt like this. We did have 5 years of bad relations that led to the alienation of affection, hence this.) And if we do, can the fix last the lifetime, or will this "craving"/"need" resurface years later? I fear that wasting more years will put my son at a worse age to cope with divorce.

If I could just swallow a magic pill that will take away the craving/need, make me content/happy with what I have, I would do so in a heartbeat.

I'm going to reflect more on what you said. I may post here or email you (hope you don't mind).




Edited 1/27/2006 5:54 pm ET by teetering
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-25-2003
Fri, 01-27-2006 - 5:52pm

Aisha,

Just saying that counseling can't be worthless, which is the impression I got from the OP. That since the #s were against it then there was no point. :)

And yup, if she doesn't want it to work out, then it really doesn't matter whether or not she goes. Or whether or not any of us think she should. Honestly, I think she is looking for validation about leaving and that's it.

Jen

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Sat, 01-28-2006 - 1:53am

I have a knack for remembering names of those who have been here before. I can't call my kids by the right names half the time (and I only have two - one of each sex, it should be easy!), but someone who posted once in 2002? No problem! Lol!


I agree that five rounds of counseling isn't enough to get you anything or anywhere. The only reason I'd change that is if your therapist told you he or she felt you had your head firmly on straight and there was no need for you to be there, but I don't think that's the case. Considering the first two visits are history gathering and "getting to know you", you they didn't really have a chance to get anywhere. I'd suggest going back and giving it more time. I find it interesting that you feel a "self therapy" book is more helpful when it can't possibly pick up on things you wouldn't even realize were relevant or give you insights to what seem like small, inconsequential things you may say during therapy. Books are fine, but they don't offer the ear or the knowledge that the therapist sitting across from you can offer. I can tell you in therapy I've said some small things, had my therapist pick up on the importance of them and in one felled swoop clear up a huge issue for me, just make it disappear. Amazing. I've also gleaned some thoughts and insights that I couldn't have gotten from a book, I don't have two-party conversations with a book.


My other thought on counseling is that you said you're pretty much decided but your husband wants to give it one more try. You've said he's a fine guy and you feel bad that he's so sad, why wouldn't you be willing to give him this try, even if you don't think it will be successful or worthwhile? At the least he'll get resolution from it and feel better about the divorce. Think of it this way, how would you feel if it was your husband who wanted a divorce, you did not, you wanted to try counseling but he refused to go. How would you feel? Wouldn't you feel he wasn't giving you or the marriage one last try? That he wasn't being fair in giving it a chance? I would think it would feel pretty awful to have your fate decided for you and be powerless to do a thing to try and save it. I understand that you don't think it'll make a difference. It won't make a difference to you, but it will make a difference to him. Why not give him that? What have you got to lose?







~ cl-2nd_life

"You can't control the length of your life,
but you can control the width and depth."

~ Author unknown








"Ignoring the facts
does not change the facts"
iVillage Member
Registered: 11-28-2005
Mon, 01-30-2006 - 10:21am

Here's the thing - -I left 3 of the 4 marriages having "needs unmet" while pursuing relationships to meet the needs, which changed over time - and again - shift of partner was in order.

In the 4th marriage - I got out to become "who I wanted to be" at the fundamental core. Happy, successful, secure, complete, self-identified, independent - I defined all those things not situationally, locationally, financially, or in terms of a relationship - but within my self.

I spent 8 years and am still "working on that' and have gone places, done things, and experienced life fully as a result.

If you're leaving to "find you" - great....if you're leaving to find someone else to meet your needs - it's almost guaranteed that the next person will be less likely to meet your needs, while you're losing options and security in alliance.

If you're not willing to go out and become who you wish to be fundamentally and existentially - you leaving to find someone else to mold, shape, complete, and form you - is you being irresponsible with your life.

It's what got you whereyou are. You can't go around doing the same things - hoping for a different result due to changd situations. That's the technical definition of insanity.

No matter where YOU go, there YOU are....the results will be pervasively the same as a result of you being the common denominator.

So if you're going "I want to be parented, cared of, loved, and be given security" - it would sound as if you're needing to stay where you are. That's the father of your children and he's more committed to them than any other man will ever be. There is legal bond and financial obligation, that if split will leave each of you with half of what you now each have together....but it'll leave you with considerably less option to re-establish the current lifestyle - by default of how things are economically and professinally.

So if you're not going to do what you're wanting him to do - don' leave. If you can't do what you're wanting done with him in the picture - do.

Erin
quickblade14@hotmail.com

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-04-2005
Mon, 01-30-2006 - 7:54pm

wingblade,

Thanks so much for your candour. I will be keeping your words in mind for a long long time as I travel down this road.

I am at peace now with my decision to get a divorce. H and I talked for over 3 hours last night and he has accepted this direction with good spirits. For the first time in many many years, I felt like we are friends. We talked in depth about what to do (custody, house, etc) and we intend to be good co-parents and friends. I was just feeling so conflicted because he so wanted to try and seeing him sad made me sad, and I felt like I owed it to him. Now that he is on the same page, and with no ill will, I feel so happy and relieved.

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-28-2005
Tue, 01-31-2006 - 10:14am

Well, I'd say YOU better get prepared to see him "enjoying his life and time" - while you are still getting your structure and balance.

Erin
quickblade14@hotmail.com

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