Arguing constantly...advice please

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-27-2006
Arguing constantly...advice please
52
Tue, 12-19-2006 - 10:37am

Thank you taking the time to read and respond. My fiancé and I have been together for over two years and I moved from Chicago to Portland because he is from there and I could transfer within my company. Since we moved a year ago, it was not easy for me learning the city on my own while my fiancé became a work-aholic (9am to 9pm Mon-Sun except most Sat night we go out) for his business---we began to build up a lot of walls with one another/arguing/fighting and I moved out at the end of September. We were bickering from April to August several times a week. I began socializing more with co-workers in Aug/Sept.

During the month of October, I immediately started dating a gentleman at the same company that I work at as he was a good friend hearing me vend about my fiancé, but I new I still had feelings for the x. After a week that I moved out, my fiancé wrote me a well-thought out long letter for all the things that he saw went wrong, we then sent several nice long emails back and forth followed by weekly coffee meetings and some dinners---it seemed that I saw more of him in the 6 weeks than I did living with him; I never stopped loving him, I just lost hope that we could forget the resentment/hurt feelings/things were going to change/go back to how they were in Chicago.

He tells me things constantly like I can accept that you are not everything on my ideal perfect list (I don't like partying until 4am three times a month(he is 39), I don't like being outside in the cold weather below ten degrees). It used to be that I was not petite either as I am five eight and 130 not five foot and 100 pounds, but he total accepts that now and says that I am the most beautiful person in the world.

I moved back in November and he is still working the long hard hours and the emails/text-messaging/phone call during the day has faded over the past week. I have asked (since May) for two nights a week (Saturday plus a weekday) for him to come home at 6pm and he keeps saying he wants to, but the business or he tells me fine he will quit everything, sell the house and live in an apartment. We have been in counseling and it seems to help. I love my fiancé more than anything, but we constantly keep fighting. For the past two weeks we have been fighting non-stop (I still kept my apartment while I moved back in) and he said on Wednesday to just go and find what you need so I packed up my car and went back to my apartment. Of course he called me an hour later (shocked that I left) and told me that I just don’t understand him and that he loves me and wants to work on us. Since we have been talking on the phone and we still get irritated with each other and he starts yelling at me.

I am sure this is a common-occurance with people, but it is like in my head I completely agree that this is not working and it is never going to end; but then when I see him, in the house we bought, dogs we bought together, my heart is just speaking so much louder to give it another try (but I have said this over 20 times in the past year). We are still in counseling. She can see that we love each other, and wants to commit on a hard 6 months together of work with her weekly and this was after I moved out again on wednesday to my place.

Any advice would be much appreciated and thanks for your time!

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Thu, 01-11-2007 - 3:50am
Confused, I am so glad you're talking to a qualified counselor, that will make all the difference in the world to you, will help you a zillion times more than boards, books, or anything else can. Your therapist can get to things that we lay people don't recognize, a therapist see things from talking to you that seem insignificant on the surface, but will cut through layers and make your process smoother, immensely faster and back to happy and healthy. Not that we can't support, understand and encourage you, but we can't begin to touch the work of a qualified counselor.


You're probably getting really tired of me repeating the same thing over and over, but here goes again. Confused, his words are just words, they're manipulations, they're methods he uses to get to you, to keep you hooked in. You know this, I know you know this, you recognize he's been sweet ever since he got his summons and you know why. All along he's sent flowers, cards, texts, songs, etc., and all along it's gotten to you. You say you know you need to stay out of contact and it's great that you're not talking to him, but cards, letters, flowers, etc. are contact and they continue to affect you. Stop accepting them, whether you refuse the mail and send it back or simply drop it in the trash, don't open it, don't read it, don't go there, don't let him do that to you. I don't know how your office is set up, but if he sends flowers at work and they go through a receptionist, inform the receptionist you're not accepting flowers and ask her to keep them or give them to someone else. If he sends them to your home, don't accept them. Close that door. Stop allowing contact. Stop allowing his manipulation. Why do you continue to allow contact? Especially when you recognize what it is and what it does to you?


I'm really glad you're going home, and I really hope you find a way to just stay there. Please, please, please, if you haven't already, block his number from your cell or change your number, whichever you have to do, do it ~ and do it before this weekend. If he catches wind that you're going home I guarantee you he'll pull out all the stops to contact you. He knows when you're with family and friends, his pull isn't as strong and he'll work extra hard to stay in contact, to keep you hooked in. Don't let that happen. You need to protect yourself. If you haven't been already, be honest with your friends and family about what's happening in your relationship. Truth and honesty will help you more than you can believe. Once you're honest with them, you can't go back to pretending it isn't so, it's a good security and safety measure for you.

I do understand about missing the contact with him. Anything that was a big part of your life is hard to give up. Even if it was mostly bad, and even if when it was bad it was awful, there were times that it wasn't bad, and that's what you miss, that's what you think about. Of course, you know that getting back with him means quickly skipping to the abusive stuff and just as quickly wanting to get the heck out of there. Keeping yourself occupied will help, join a gym a club, volunteer, take a class, you name it, whatever it takes to keep you busy and occupied, even if it doesn't feel like it's helping much, it is. I can understand missing feeling like someone in your state cares about you. I'm sure that's an empty, lonely, vulnerable feeling. But, distance is relative in the age of the jetliner, and your friends and family that care very much about you are only a few hours away, you know?








~ cl-2nd_life

"Experience is what you get
When you don't get what you want"

~ Author unknown








"Ignoring the facts
does not change the facts"
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Thu, 01-11-2007 - 9:52pm
Here's something you should see:


Abuser's responses to breakup








~ cl-2nd_life

"Experience is what you get
When you don't get what you want"

~ Author unknown








"Ignoring the facts
does not change the facts"
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Tue, 01-16-2007 - 3:24pm
Confused, are you back? How was your trip? How are you doing?








~ cl-2nd_life

"Experience is what you get
When you don't get what you want"

~ Author unknown








"Ignoring the facts
does not change the facts"
iVillage Member
Registered: 11-27-2006
Wed, 01-17-2007 - 1:24pm

Thank you for checking in with me. I had a great time at home and came back this morning. It was very tearful to leave my mom, as I know she wants the best for me, yet hard on me at the same time.

The trip overall was actually a lot harder than I thought with my feelings for my X, I mean we went out to so many restaurants, parks, shopping together and everything brought back memories. He proposed at my favorite restaurant since I was four (that my family loves too and of course unknowing we had dinner there the first night I got off the plane) and then shopping (passing the store where he got my engagement ring and the ladies remembered me and asked how the wedding was)….same with entering other retail stores---people remember me and ask me how the wedding was and telling me how in-love my X was with me as he would often discuss the items to get me at certain places with the clerks. I was in constant reminder of how wonderful things were in Chicago with him.

My family/friends, though they mean very well, were upset to see me so sad and depressed about my X. They don’t understand why I am not over him yet and move on. I can definitely see in reading books (Codependecy No More, Why Does He Do that, Are you the one for me, Adult Children of AA) that my parents were very controlling of me. They divorced when I was three and there is so much anger between them (I remember growing up that they would yell at me all the time and I can see why I thought it was normal in my relationship with my X). I pretty much had a good heart-heart with a couple friends/family in early January and they knew everything that went on in the past few years in my relationship. They are there to listen, give me a million reasons why I should not be with him (they never really liked him and thought that I was selling myself way to short), but the second that I tell them that I miss him, they get ticked off at me and basically tell me I am stupid and most want a victimized life.

I did go on a couple dates last week with very nice guys, but I feel that I am there physically when my mind is in other places and wishing I was dining with my X. I am going to talk to my counselor this weekend and hope to get better. As far as my X goes, I haven’t really talked to him at all in ten days, though I miss him much. He sends me one text msg a day telling me how many pages he has read/seen the therapist/gone to anger management. I miss him a bunch, but like you said, I don’t think I could ever trust him again even if does completely change in 6mos-1year. I mean the thought of moving back in with him scares the heck out of me (though he has promised to chg and never ever invade my privacy) and thoughts of being felt like I am on eggshells all the time; but so why do I miss him so much is my confusion?

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Wed, 01-17-2007 - 2:33pm
I'm sorry you had to go through so many renditions of "how is the wedding coming" from well-meaning people. That had to be tough, I know. But, there's another way to look at it. It seems that you're looking at it from a loss standpoint, how sad that you didn't get what you wanted. The flip side is a win. What a tremendous gift it is that you didn't wind up trapped and committed into that hell. A narrow escape and something to be thankful for, for sure.


It sounds like maybe you've hit on a reason that you're so drawn to him? Is it possible that you're attracted to him because your subconscious sees his behavior as much like the one you had with your folks and it sees him as a way to finally 'fix' what you didn't fix with your parents? The subconscious is funny that way, it likes to try to fix old problems when it sees a new situation that's similar.


His anger management and counseling are worthless, neither address the problem, and you know that. He's spinning his wheels, trying to look like he's accomplishing things for the better, all the while continuing to prove that he does not believe he has an abuse issue. And further proving he does not want to change it; if he believed the problem was abuse and if he wanted to change it, he would get appropriate help. But he's not. There's your reality.


Did you tell your friends and family what's going one? I have to ask, though I have before and you haven't answered; why are you continuing to accept contact from him? My only guess is that you're not sure you're not going to go back to him.








~ cl-2nd_life

"Experience is what you get
When you don't get what you want"

~ Author unknown








"Ignoring the facts
does not change the facts"
iVillage Member
Registered: 08-04-2003
Wed, 01-17-2007 - 6:34pm
Missing him regardless of how bad the relationship was, is normal. You still have to grieve for the end of the relationship, for what could have been, for what might have been, and especially for what you hoped would have been. Grieving is part of the process.


Carrie

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-27-2006
Wed, 01-17-2007 - 6:58pm

Thanks for your reply. I think that is the reason that I thought the relationship was normal and didn't take action sooner with it is that was the way I was raised. My mom was very controlling and strict with me (she would never admit it, but friends would always tell her that). She was always pushing me to do better. She would yell at me often and it was like a loose cannon at times----the divorce was very long and hard on her as she pretty much solely raised me. I saw my dad maybe six times a year and he viewed me as his biggest expense rather than anything else. My dad also told me that I could always lose some weight too and that I did only should only small sizes as it would make me larger. Both parents have very short tempers with me or anyone really.

I did tell my family and some close friends everything and they of course were appauled and can't believe I would put myself in a situation like that. They think the worst thing I could do would be to go back to him and that I would be very stupid and ruin the rest of my life.

Yes, I am greving for the loss of our dreams and everything that we rosily imagined once and can't believe how everything is so completely different that fifteen months ago.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Wed, 01-17-2007 - 11:41pm
It sounds like being yelled is something that isn't new in your life, huh? It also sounds like your ex isn't the first significant guy in your life that you felt you had to change to be acceptable to.


Confused, In telling family and friends the truth about your relationship, I was looking for you to have some real-time support by people you know, love and trust, to have the experience of hearing yourself verbalize what's gone on in your relationship and to give you a support system that you could continue to share it with. Did hearing yourself actually say the words to people have an impact on you? It sounds like it was nothing but a negative, humiliating experience. In thinking about it, I think it could likely feel like that initially even if it were an ultimately positive thing to do. For me sometimes being honest doesn't feel comfortable, but it does feel right, and in that way it's a positive, growing experience. Does that make sense? How are you feeling about talking with your friends and family?


Itwinflame's right about grieving, here's some information on the grieving process and self care, much will likely hit home with you:

The 5 Stages of Grief

It's not a surprise that dates are a stuggle for you, you're processing a lot and really aren't available for a real date, if that makes sense, you're still attached and connected with your ex, you haven't cut ties yet; those facts would make it difficult even if this had been a healthy relationship, but you're also working through abuse, and that's a lot to deal with. Dating may not be workable until after you've "cleaned yourself up" in therapy. You're in a confused, vulnerable place where you're still not sure about lots of things. It might be better to stick with friends and those kinds of activities and hold off dating until you're really available and ready. You might consider talking to your therapist about it.

Huge hugs, Confused. Know we're here for you and we understand.







~ cl-2nd_life

"Experience is what you get
When you don't get what you want"

~ Author unknown








"Ignoring the facts
does not change the facts"
iVillage Member
Registered: 11-27-2006
Thu, 01-18-2007 - 11:09am

Yes, you are right in discussing my feelings with my family, I feel I get laughed at more and they tell me how stupid I was for being with him and letting it go on for as long as I did. If anything, it added to me missing my X more because he definitely acknowledged that he did not like the way that my family treated me, but I let it go to far into taking his advice and not speaking with them for a certain number of months. Since I didn’t speak with my mom and her side, I had to hear how wrong I was for doing that (even though I have been talking with them since Aug) and how hurtful it was to them. I mean my mom came to visit me in march for four days and since she did not like my X she cut the trip short and only stayed one short night before heading home to Chicago and told me that I needed to get rid of him then; which in turn just wanted me to stay longer and work harder on the relationship.

I also learned (in my readings the past month) that part of the reason that I was with my X for so long is because my family did not like him and another area where I could always do better. Growing up, I always felt pushed my mom to do better in school, sports, etc. I tried to talk to mom about how a small part of the reason that I was attracted to a control freak is because my mom controlled me growing up and of course she completely disagrees and ends up yelling at me and getting really upset so I just drop it all the time. My friends and dad all think she was way to controlling with me as well, but she will never admit to that at other times I have tried to bring this up.

These boards, reading, and counselor do help; I do feel alone up here, but it is not like I would want to move back to Chicago either. I am trying to figure out me and to some point I do feel in limbo with my life and where to look/do/go next.

iVillage Member
Registered: 12-27-2004
Thu, 01-18-2007 - 1:17pm

"I tried to talk to mom about how a small part of the reason that I was attracted to a control freak is because my mom controlled me growing up and of course she completely disagrees and ends up yelling at me and getting really upset so I just drop it all the time."

Typical controlling tactics, similar to the ones you experienced with your boyfriend. She's really a classic.