Talking to Exes. What's okay?.....
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| Wed, 08-30-2006 - 6:30am |
So I have an issue that is somewhat resolved but am still looking for others opinions. Help Please!
About a month back I accidently came across my live in boyfriends MySpace page. I knew he had them. He has showed it to me before, but that was when he first started it. when he did we didn't have a computer at home and he used his at work. When he got the lap top computer for work is when I found out more details.
One day the page was still on the computer open, but not signed in, i clicked on it because he always talked about it and our pictures on there. I found comments from an ex fling who he still considered an occasional friend still. They seemed to be just joking around comments or small talk, but if not logged in i couldn't see what the past comments or the private messages in the box were before that. She did post one comment as a joke that he was whipped because he didn't agree that if she came to visit that she could see our new place. I'm not sure if said they couldn't hang out in a group if she came to visit or not even at all. She moved far away a couple years back, and a year ago my boyfriend had the problem right around the time i was moving in with him. He told me beforehand that she was visiting and that him, and a few other people including her were going to a concert. I did tell him my feelings he explained it was nothing to worry about.So I got over it, he admitted to even doing that after knowing how I felt about it that he was wrong. He said he was selfish and sorry for it.
So, it brings us back to the subject. I was aware that they had the occasional e-mail, which he made it sound like that was as much as every 6 months to catch up on life details, her relationship, and his.After he admitted to being wrong last summer he said it wouldn't happen and be a problem again. I don't want to control his life, just state what i will and will put up with and let him decide what matters to him. Don't be mistaken, I have too made sacrifices in not talking to exes or even just guy friends, or going out as much with friends out of respect for him.
So after I told him about the Myspace thing. He then explained himslef saying that it was all innocent and just talking and that other than her the other people on there have always been just friends or people he had a college class with. He said he was wrong and that he should have known it was wrong to do since he had agreed before that it was wrong and that he wasn't going to do it anymore. I had asked him questions about everything and he either answers or thinks my questions are silly so he doesn't really say much about them
After about two weeks, I still wondered if there was other MySpace pages, he had deleted the first one because he wanted to and suggested we start one together. We did start one, but i use it to talk to family and close friends and he doesn't.He said he never liked the whole thing much anyway. I did beg him that i didn't think it was best that he got rid of his page just what he was doing wrong with it. We went back and forth on that.I in no way want to control him, but if he admits to fault and agrees that he did things he shouldn't then lie and hide when he does them,or conveniently forget.What should I think? So,two weeks later I got into his email(he wasn't mad about it) though it was wrong. I am still glad I did it though I feel guilty.I still felt it was un resolved. I found some emails from her, one back and forth conversation went something like this:
Her asking him where the page went.
Him replying that he does things for love like others and he cares about me and wants it to work, that she(meaning me) may feel threatened since 'you'(meaning her) are a beautiful women, and I am a territorial person that way. He also mentioned how I was mad that another girl was on his friend list on the page and she commented something. He explained to me she was just a friend (then i was fine with it because he had mentioned her other times and i had met her at a bar once quickly). He used the words to the '1st' girl in the email that the 2nd girl was a girl he had briefly dated for awhile.He said that they could still email and if he ever got instant messaging he would talk again after things blew over with the situation.
So I was even more mad then I was before because he basically told her I'm jealous, which i wasn't. That he was planning on continuing to lie and keep things from me after our fight anyway! I confronted him again, he told me that he did say those things to her because he didn't know how to cut it off and doing it slower was easier.I asked why it was necessary to copliment her or tell her i was mad he talked to the other girl too(when i wasn't untill i knew the truth) He admitted to lying once again throughout the relationship about the truth about the 2nd girl that they did date for a short bit, when we have always been honest and fort coming, and he had always mentioned her as a friend that they used to just go out and had no desire to date her.
I now don't know what to believe because he wants me to forgive him for lying and keeping things. We had always been so open and respected eachothers opinions and views(so it seemed)like i mentioned, i always told him my views and gave him options and i truly did sacrifice things and people right away in the relationship for him. That could be why he never believed that a younger guy friend of mine always and really was a friend and just that, because he knew he hadn't told the full story on certain things. I have written my bf a letter with my thoughts and questions and also sent him an e-mail after that. He has acknowledged them and said he is glad i wrote them, but he never answers the questions or 'writes back'. He is busy with work, but he does have free time for video games and watching sports, etc.
So that is why I'm here because I know he has a Myspace page(besides our joint one) that is just for fun, it's rally a character and not his own profile. I know he checks it about once a week but I don't know for sure if he is sending messages to anyone on there or if he knows that i know about it.So I need to ask him and see what he tells me I guess. He told me he had no other pages and email accounts but now I don't know what to believe after all of this.He did delete one other page I found out and i am not sure if he made other 'fake' identities,and if he abuses the emailing or contact rules or not.I don't think he uses the instant messaging, he said he never had intention to or even keeping in contact with her, he just didn't know what to say. I feel he is innocent and nothing was meant to go further.I don't believe he would cheat on me or desire to. I just want him to answer the questions I have. I feel the need to bring it up and just ask since he won't answer my letters but maybe I'm afraid he'll lie again and if he tells me something, How am I supposed to believe what he says now? I am a very attractive girl, I realize this. I feel secure with myself for the most part and I feel I deserve somebody great. Sometimes I think he knows I'm attractive and wants attention for himself from people or thinks he can just do what he wants because he doesn't do anything wrong other than that.
Besides this, I feel like I'm the one who wants sex more, even though he is affectionate and does pay alot of attention to me. when we have sex it is fun and great and we're both satisfied. i'm not sure if he is insecure because he doesn't like me touching his stomach or seeing him change alot of the time. I like to walk from room to room in the nude on occasion and feel okay with doing it in front of him. Another concern after all of the other 'stuff' is he never was too interested in porn before he got the computer, he had a dvd that he watched very rarely if i wasn't home for him, or whatever, but now I have found alot of downloaded porn and websites and he's even a member for one site.He is generally cheap and money hungry and I don't see him paying to be a member. How do I know if he is?, because I feel it would be worse under the circumstances. The download history shows he looks at it at most once a week but how do i know if he visits other websites more often or not since he can easily delete that history? I have thought about just asking him about it, but I don't want to embarass him or make him hide things. I am not sure yet if I'm okay that he does this since before he didn't seem to need to or couldn't because he only used his work computer and you can't do that stuff at work.
So I come to the point of thinking, Is it okay or not to me? I really am uncomfortable with it and he has always knew my opinions,..i'm pretty sure. I again don't know if he knows I know he does it and assumes it's ok with me. I feel if he lived without it before and he has said it never was a big deal, then why not now? He hasn't treated me much different since before this so it doesn't seem to be a problem but it could be too. I have always had a higher sex drive since I sm younger than him. I want to think it is the occasional normal view but I don't want to just let my feelings go either. I don't feel insecure against the images, just disrespected of my views and thoughts on all of the subjects, Any comments nad help on any of this Please???? Sorry it was so loooong, and Thank You for taking the time to read and help me out!!!! Intuition_girl0727
Edited 8/30/2006 7:56 am ET by intuition_girl0727
Edited 8/30/2006 7:57 am ET by intuition_girl0727

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smuckers
I'm making some assumptions from what I read in your post:
<> I take "his problem" to be her and you "explaining your feelings" was that you told him you don't approve. I'm also assuming that he was "selfish and sorry for it" was for seeing her. Why would his seeing her be selfish? And if you don't approve of contact, I don't get why was it okay just because you thought it was infrequent?
<> If that were true, there wouldn't be a problem with him being friends with a woman. But, the fact is you don't trust him and you had a problem with contact from ex's before this came up.
His actions are telling you everything you need to know. He says he's wrong, but obviously he doesn't think so and obviously he doesn't subscribe to the same beliefs you do or this wouldn't be a problem in the first place. He says it won't happen again, but it has. And since there's a pattern of behavior of him telling you he "made a mistake" and it "won't happen again" you can pretty much bet that he doesn't think it's wrong, and he most certainly will do it again. In his email he told her he planned to lay low for a while then go back to being in contact. That's not an "accident" or a "mistake", that's a planned process. How can you trust him? You can't. When you know someone will lie to you, you know that you can't believe them. Sounds like a stupid statement, but it's true. You can't believe him and you can't trust that he's being honest with you. You'd be a fool to believe him.
You mention that you're attractive, but that has no place in this. Fidelity and honestly have nothing to do with attractiveness. You seem to suggest that maybe he does this because he wants attention. That's an issue within himself that he'd have to deal with (therapy). It's not something you're going to solve or fix and it's not something you're going to *make* him stop doing.
So what are your choices? Stay with a guy who you know will shine you on but will do what he really wants behind your back or move on. And in moving on, make sure your next bf agrees with you that contact from ex's isn't acceptable.
For the porn, I guess I don't get your concern. You already knew he used porn and had no problem with it, but you're concerned that he didn't tell you he was now viewing on the pc too? Why would he? And I don't get how you say that you feel your thoughts and views on the images are disrepected when you were okay with the DVD?
You say your relationship is one of respect, that you think this is innocent and he's not going to cheat. But you've invaded his myspace and you've gotten into his email. Those are both direspectful and point to anything but trust. And I've got to say that while you've said a couple of times that you don't want to control him, it certainly sounds like you do.
He’s lied, but has he cheated? If he has a history of doing it in the past, I’d be worried. But I get the feeling (I had similar experiences) that he felt cornered a bit after you confronted him on the myspace stuff. Did he date this one girl for awhile? If so, did they end badly? There’s a lot of factors in here we don’t know about.
Is she currently with someone? Married? If so, what’s the big deal? People move on, but by hacking into his private accounts is a terrible way to keep bringing it up, which is probably getting him even more upset.
I’m surprised he wasn’t even more upset with you for doing that. That’s usually a relationship breaker on all accounts, at least it was in my situation. Maybe he loves you more than you think for not doing that?
As for the porn, I find it repulsive, but I haven’t met one man who didn’t either watch it as much as possible or keep it secret. I had one boyfriend who had a box of it. Gross. But for them, it’s no big deal. If you OK’d it before, you really have nothing to complain about. Guys look at porn. We like to shop. That’s the world. Get used to it.
Sorry to be somewhat bratty, but I don’t think there’s anything wrong here with your guy. But you do have some issues to work out. The trust between you two is unusual. Maybe you two should air things out?
I have to agree with much of what you've been told here. I think that your boyfriend clearly is lying to you and plans to continue to do the same. Joanlogan brought up a good point that he may feel pressured due to being cornered by you. He should have stood up for himself and told you that he didn't agree and planned to continue contact, cornered or not; but it's certainly possible that his evasiveness is due to your stance. I also agree that your post has an air of control and that while you profess to believe he will not cheat and this is innocent, the fact that you continue to dig suggests otherwise, as does the fact that you're "soothed" by knowing that you're attractive (which has no bearing on faithfulness).
Whatever the reason for his lies, it's clear that he does not agree with you and does not plan to stop communicating with this woman. It's also clear that you cannot trust him as he's shown that he's not honest with you. You'll have to decide what you're willing to accept. You said in your post that you made it very clear to him what you'll accept. Regardless of what he tells you, you know the facts. It's up to you to stick with your values and what you'll accept from a boyfriend or end it because he clearly doesn't stack up to your requirements.
Your post didn't touch on its title at all. In don't have a problem with talking to ex's. If I'm secure in the relationship, there's no need to worry, and if I'm not secure in the relationship, it's not a relationship I'd stay in anyway. Truthfully, I think being friendly with ex's says good things about them. My husband's ex-wife used to call and cry on his shoulder; I thought it was great that my husband was supportive of her and felt sorry for her. Jealousy or concern never entered into it. I will say that if you don't believe in talking to ex's or being on friendly terms with them, I urge you to never become involved with a divorced father.
I think in your situation, what you know is that your boyfriend is not honest with you and will not be in the future.
As far as the porn goes, I don't understand your concern. You knew he used porn when you got together and were okay with that. You indicate he's not using porn more frequently, but is viewing from a different source. I don't understand why you'd expect him to report his new porn source to you or why that would indicate a problem to you? You indicate you don't agree with porn use, which I don't understand, as you suggest you were okay with his use initially.
If porn use is something you don't agree with, you now have two issues that are in direct conflict with what you'll accept, as well as a relationship with someone whom you cannot and should not believe is telling you the truth about anything.
How old are you, Intuition?
~ cl-2nd_life"Experience is what you get
when you don't get what you want."
~ Author unknown
"Ignoring the facts
does not change the facts"
First off, Not many women are too accepting of porn. I always tolerate it and I still do and I have talked to him on the subject. I think I was worrying more about it ffrom reading others posts and thinking,...could that be me? So, in a perfect world for women porn wouldn't exist but I'm alright with his normal usage regardless of the source. To me it just appeared it was getting more frequent when it wasn't. I guess that's what we get when we associate other peoples situations with our own, even if there is no relevance.That situation we compromised on.
The First topic about the exes did technically stay with my title of the post. I was giving my situation, how I felt, and was looking for others opinions or what the ythought was respectable behavior and what isn't. I never thought he was going to do anything wrong besides the frequen chatting he did. The problem I had was before the MySpace(which he left open and hadn't had a problem with me seeing it before). We always agreed on how often we contact our exes or talk to them if they contact us(in this case she contacted him first). So it is not just me expecting him or trying to control this, it's agreed that we both limit it if we are somewhat still friends with anyone. He has not given anything up that he doesn't expect me too as well. he never dated her, she cheated on her boyfriend for 3 years at a time with him and others knowing he never wanted a relationship with her. He was young then and didn't think serious about her ever. She too has a serious relationship now for awhile. I know he never saw it as lying because he didn't think it was much of anything that he was doing. when you make an agreement with someone about how often you talk to exes and such and what you talk about you tend to believe them.(It's called trust). I do trust him. I just pointed out that he wasn't participating in the agreement himself that he expects me to. We agreed if we talked here and there through email to say "Hi" every 6 months or so, that's fine, but it shouldn't be excessive. So i'm not being unreasonable or controlling when he does know this, agreed to it and wants me to abide by it too. they never were really good friends so he didn't feel he was losing much. I now know he wasn't trying to hide it, and when he told her he was going to wait untill hings settled down. I really feel he meant it that he was just telling her that because he knew it was still okay to email every few months. I really wasn't snooping in the myspace, i looked at it one time when he left it open and has no problem with me seeing it before. The email thing was wrong, not something i've done before, and want to do again. I don't regret it, because we talked and needed to clear things up. I think in a way it was supposed to happen for reason.He wasn't mad when he found out i read his emails. He knows my password so he could do it to me too. He felt he wasn't trying to lie and that he didn't think it was wrong because it was innocent chat to him. I believe that, but he's not the type pf person to say things to appease me and he won't be controlled by anyone. He just says what he thinks. I also am okay with platonic friends, he has one and so do I. They are fine. We both agreed that our exes and ex flings were not of any importance to talk to then to catch up here and there. I only expect out of him what he expects of me. I think most people want to control what there partners do but they realize they can't. I know it seems he may and will lie again but I honestly don't think so. I think alot of it for him was after he sent messages he didn't think much about them again,so he kind of forgot. He did mention other times they had emailed once or twice a year nd I was always okay with that, like he was when I mentioned anything I've done. I know from a strangers point of view it's confusing and all you have to go on is this story I have posted. I was looking for opinions on what people thought about if they were in that situation. I also wanted to know what people thought about me trusting him after it or not. I appreciate the comments, but don't criticize me for not trusting when I never was threatened by him talking to her ,..or anyone else. I just don't like 'feeling' lied to even if he was or wasn't in your eyes. I also stated that I was attractive and felt good about myself because i didn't want people to mistake my feelings for insecurity when it was about an agreement a long time ago on both our parts, and feeling respected as a person with feelings and opinions. You ake a risk asking for advice because people are both sympathetic where they'll 'side' with you but insult you at the same time. So for the record, I was fine that he talked to her twice a year or so, but not every other day which she had been initiating conversation whether she is happy in her relationship or not. It is alot different for men to forget about who they were with before 'emotionally ' and physically than for women. He never did have any emotions for her though. I didn't breaak trust issues between us before he may or may ot have, because he was fine with me seeing the page and email otherwise he would have reacted differently and told me that it upset him. Everybody has views on when it's okay to talk to exes or 'the like' and how odten and what the content. He did think differently about it before, but he realized my points were correct since he doesn't want me doing what he did. I really don't feel that even though he told her he was going to contact her again that he had any intention of even doing so except for back to the agreement plan we had before. You may think I shouldn't believe him and trust he wasn't lying or won't do this again, or not to trust him. I feel he now knows what my views are as a riminder and the boundaries. Sometimes relationships need the little 'tests'. I think most people unintentionally will see what they will get away with,..or can. I also have to state most and all couples have differences they don't always see eye to eye on all subjects.That doesn't mean that you should jut give up. Yes people don't change but they can learn from thier mistakes and it doesn't always mean they re-commit the crime.I don't control him anymore than he might have the influence on me, as alot of couples do and should.I have my opinions, so does he, we try to meet in the middle. As a guy, some things go in one ear and out the other, so i'm hoping he remembers what he expects and knows I only deserve the same. I do have faith in him seeing as I know he wasn't and wouldn't ever cheat.I do trust his true intentions and he trusts mine. I guess this is the biggest issue we've ever had.I fel blessed that it probably isn't as bigof a deal for either of us as some situations. We have talked about this through and through. We both understand eachother now as much as you can really understand what is in anothers mind. Please realize that everybodys view of respect is different. What I may tolerate, like him being messy sometimes others may not in their relationship. It's all about different views and it's hard to make assumptions about whether or not what's what from one story about a couple you don't know the backround or personal lives of. I hope you understand this. How do you feel now?
I think there were a lot of exuses made in this post, excusing him, and excusing you.
I think that there's a lot of control going on.
I think that a lot must have changed from yesterday to today since yesterday you said, "How can I believe him?" and today you say "I trust him".
I think you have some negative and incorrect views on men.
I think children "test", adults don't and I don't think they have any place in relationships. "Tests" are games.
I didn't read any posts that sympathized with you or sided with you, I only saw answers that told you what they thought.
If you've talked about it through and through, why did you need to post about it? Cl's right, the title of your post was "Talking to Exes. What's okay?....." but inside the questions were about how to believe him, not about how much communication is okay.
I don't think anybody told you what to do, they told you what they thought of the situation you presented.
When you post in a public forum you get the responses of those who choose to respond. It's not unusual to get some responses that you don't agree with. You are free to take the ones you like an discard the rest, that's the beauty of the boards.
If there is a member you don't care to hear from, there is an ignore feature that takes their posts from your view.
I have to tell you, suggesting those responses that you don't like are drunks, old divorced bitter people who hates everything, or 60 year old men isn't likely to evoke the desire of many members to offer their thoughts to you.
For the record, I pretty much agree with Marcy's post and absolutely agree that tests are not a part of any healthy adult relationship.
~ cl-2nd_life"Experience is what you get
when you don't get what you want."
~ Author unknown
Edited 9/1/2006 2:48 am ET by cl-2nd_life
"Ignoring the facts
does not change the facts"
>>will 'test' there limit even knowing it isn't going to be accepted or tolerated sometimes just to see what the ycan get away with, wothout giving in entirely. We all do it in our relationships sometimes, it's a natural human thing to try to annoy somebody or give them a challenge or try to break the rules. If you say you've never tried to 'test' your spouse in any way or form as an adult just to see what you're allowed to do or get away with than I feel your either lying or fooling yourself.<<
This is so far removed from the truth it isn't even funny.
I have NEVER pushed a limit with my H. I do NOT try to annoy him (that would be so productive.) If I agree to "rules" I abide by them. If I do not like them then I go back and renegotiate those boundaries. I don't need to "get away" with things because I am an adult and fully capable of governing my own life. It is a "natural human thing" if you are a child and you need other people to keep you within boundaries. It's what you do while learning to control yourself. Not once you are grown.
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