thanks from lurker, and my story
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| Fri, 11-18-2005 - 1:48am |
Been lurking on these boards since the end of Sept and wanted to say thank you to everyone here, you've all been a tremendous help to me, from those who have shared their stories to those to have offered advice.
My story (long...as they all are)
I've been married for 10 years this past October 14th, we did not celebrate our anniversay. We were suppose to go to Nashville, instead I was staying at my moms and had been for about a month. He was home...I guess, not really sure what he did. What lead to that is a 2 year long story. My marriage is not bad, not even close...but I'm not happy here any more. We don't talk...just day to day chit chat, couple sentences here and there. I feel like we are so different and have nothing in common. I know that I am probably mostly to blame for that. I've distanced myself by playing a game on the computer for hours and hours, for the last 2 years, instead of spending time with my husband. My marriage before the game was ok...I thought we were happy. I'm beginning to realize...I really wasn't....it was such a slow process...I didn't see it happening.
My whole life revolved around him. I have no friends of my own. They are all his friends. I've had a couple people I've started to become friends with...but then I would lose contact with them. For one reason or another. We always did things he wanted to do. At times I wanted to as well. We used to go country line dancing. Then he lost interest...I kept going...and wanted him to go to. He would back out at the last minute. I eventually lost interest too. I wanted to go skydiving, he told me no, he didn't want me to. So I didn't, I need someone to go with me...to share it with. To encourage me. We would watch TV, he would be flipping through the channels, I would ask him to stop on something that I wanted to watch, he would ignore me (later said he didn't here me) or refuse to, because he didn't want to watch it. We don't have the same interests in TV shows..or movies. We would always have to watch what he wanted to. That has changed (I gave him a taste of his own medicine a couple weeks ago, he got the picture). While in the car, if I want to listen to a certain CD, we argue, cause he doesn't like some of the music I like. I asked hm not to smoke in my car...it took a few months of arguing and me telling him he didn't respect me or my wishes before he finally stopped. He goes in my purse and takes money...and doesn't tell me. So I think I have money and go to get gas or something...and don't have any. I feel like he has no respect for me. But I'm told that's BS when I bring it up. We also have different libidos. I'm high, he's low. Of course I'm the one struggling with it. I always have to initiate. And he only gives in, if there's nothing good on TV or he's not occupied by something else. So only when there's nothing better to do. He calls out from work to go fishing, but when I ask him to call out to spend time with me, he can't do it. He likes to be a "do it yourself" guy around the house, but he doesn't know what he's doing half the time. I'm a perfectionist...I hate my house now. I have all these projects that are half done or mistakes that are being hidden by furniture...when they can...or that I just have to learn to live with. There is not one room of my house that isn't ruined. I don't even clean the house half the time...cause I hate it..and feel like...why should I bother.
Those are the bad things. The good things...he loves me, I don't think he would ever leave me. He brings in the most money, so he supports me right now. I am a nurse, but I don't have a set schedule...work when they need me. Right now, I'm so depressed and unmotivated, that I have no desire to work. But I can...with the right frame of mind. He works a lot, to provide for me (this is what he said...not so sure I believe it) We are not poor. He does do things for me...and put up with a lot from me, my lack of motivation to work, or do the house work for example. Hmm, the list is a little short....I'm sure I might be able to come up with some more....but I'd really have to think.
I hate my life. I don't really want to live like this any more. I'm on anti-depressents and started seeing a therapist. The medicine is finally started working, so I'm starting to feel human again. I know I have self esteem and confidence issues, I guess I always have, but this is the worse it's ever been.
On top of all this...I had an EA with someone I met online...which eventually did turn to a PA. This person lives in another state, which made me think I was safe from the PA part. I've been working on forcing myself to not become so emotionally attached to someone, that I can't survive with out them. I don't want a serious relationship with this man. I do want to remain friends. He's not interested in a relationship either. He's been hurt and doesn't want to put the effort into maintaining a relationship. He's been up front with me about that.
I'm not as confused as I used to be. But I'm still stuck...and can't move forward with my life at this time...until I decide...do I want to stay with my husband or move on. Right now....I want to move on...but I am so afraid for regretting this decision years form now. I'm hoping therapy can help me in this respect.

Nice to meet you, Jerzi_gal. I'm sorry you're struggling so much, I know it's not easy and the answers aren't coming as quickly or as clearly as you'd like. I'm on my way out of town, so don't have time to say anymore, but I wanted to let you know I'm glad you're here before I went. I'll "talk" more when I get back.
~ cl-2nd_life"You can't control the length of your life,
but you can control the width and depth."
~ Author unknown

my signature exchange partner:"Ignoring the facts
does not change the facts"
I actually have a friend who's going through a very similar struggle right now. She's been telling her husband for the last few years that she's not happy, is concerned about the direction their marriage is going and needs to see some action from him. He has pretty much blown off her warnings and requests, making slight changes for a short time, then back to the same old non-involvement. The result is she's found other interests and activities and has quite an active life without him. Basically at this point, they live in the same house, not much more. He also love to remodel the house and as a result some part of it is always in some state of disrepair. My friend says she hates to go home because it doesn't even feel like her home when she's there. A big part of their problem (I think) is that when they married she had a young child which made it necessary for her to stay home most of the time when in reality, her preference and personality is such that she is actually geared towards much more fun and activity than that. As her child got older and required less, her desire for outside activities grew. After having sounded the alert that they were in serious trouble many times over the last few years, my friend announced to her husband a few months ago that she was through. At that point, of course, he's quite anxious to do "whatever it takes" to bring their marriage back. He's willing to make more effort to go out, to listen, to talk and be more involved, he's agreeable to counseling and is very intent on doing what it takes to make this work. She, however, is having a hard time trying to commit to trying when she's already moved past that point. Presently, she's about where you are. She's seeing a counselor, trying to figure out what she wants to do, what she'll be happy with in the years to come. I think her biggest fear (and probably is for most) is the concern that her feelings of wanting to end it and move on are temporary, that she'll get past them and want to be committed to her marriage again. She's also very torn up about her husband. She has cares very much for him, says he's a great guy, doesn't want to hurt him and hates thinking of putting him through the pain of a divorce he doesn't want. You're not alone in your struggle, Jerzi.
I just got a book from the library, but haven't had a chance to even crack it open yet, and I can't until I finish the one I'm in the middle of now. The book is called “Too Good to Leave Too Bad to Stay” by Mira Kirshenbaum . Obviously, since I haven't read it I can't recommend it, but you might check with your counselor to see if it's a book s/he thinks has merit and value.
I really respect your honesty in what you've written in your post. You were straight up even when it would have made you look better to omit those things. That says you're taking a truly honest look at yourself and at your situation, and you really want to come to the best answer you can. It's a strong person who's willing to put it all out there for everyone to see, even with the anonymity the internet affords.
Keep checking in, let us know how it's going, what you're doing and any concerns, angst, confusion you're having. We probably won't have answers, but we might have thoughts and observations that will strike a chord or open a door for you.
I'm sorry you're going through this and hope you find peace and happiness, whatever you decide.
~ cl-2nd_life"You can't control the length of your life,
but you can control the width and depth."
~ Author unknown

my signature exchange partner:"Ignoring the facts
does not change the facts"
Thank you, I've read many of your posts to other people and have come to respect you and your wisdom. I know alot of my problems are my own fault. I regret many decisions that I've made recently. I could have handled things a lot better. I've had regrets in the past, but I learned from them and never allowed myself to be put in those situations again.
I'm glad for communities such as these, basically I'm reaching out to just hear peoples thoughts, many times people will say something that will open my eyes and make me think...or help me in the funniest ways. I commented to a friend recently that I'm afraid of being alone. He asked me if I was afraid of being alone...or am I afraid of feeling lonely? It was like my eyes were opened. That was it, that was the key.
I just want to hear other peoples thoughts. Good or bad, although I don't care for personal attacks. Who knows, someone may say something, that will open my eyes...and solve all my problems, lol.
In thinking back, we had some things in common, but very few are left. See, the problem is this, there are his interests, my interests and our (few) interests. We do his interests, our interests, but never my interests. I have to beg, plead, threaten and eventually go by myself or not at all.
I may check out that book too. Might go read some comments on it from Amazon, if there are any.
Thanks again.
I don't know what advice I can give you. Because all my advice hinges on whether or not you want to try and work things out.
I do really hope that you have learned from your past mistakes and that you won't repeat them. If you have, then kudos to you.
Jen
Yeah, as if it would ever be that simple -- someone saying something that would open your eyes and solve all your problems. Having your eyes opened is the easy part, but having it solve your problems? Ooooh, I wish it could be that easy! It seems to me that even when you realize what's really at play it's still a long, hard trek home. But yes, I absolutely agree with the eye openers you can get from just a small seemingly "nothing" statement or observation that someone makes. Like the one your friend hit you with, the difference between being afraid of being alone and being afraid of being lonely. Huge. Simple, but huge.
Jerzi, am I reading you right that you're currently separated? That he knows how very precarious your marriage is right now and he's not willing to recognize that he's not done his share of giving in this "give and take"? Or that he's not willing to work to be a partner and join you in what you're interested in? I don't think he should be required to do everything with you, but I also don't think you should have had to beg, plead, threaten then give up and go alone all the time either. Give and take....you know.
I'm guessing that the computer game playing and the lack of interest on activities you were interested in pursuing went hand in hand rather than being a case where you simply removed yourself from the marriage without reason or provocation.
Interestingly, I'm reading a book that had some interesting things to say about affairs. "...third parties do serve to stabilize relationships and help keep the real issues safely underground.....the triangles stabilized the marriage so that neither partner was pushing for change" By no means is the author condoning affairs, rather showing how they allow the partner who's in the affair to distance emotionally and keep them satisfied with their relationship as it is by allowing them to avoid being fully invested and thereby making it easy to be satisfied with things remaining as they are. I had never looked at it that way. I thought you might find it interesting too.
~ cl-2nd_life"You can't control the length of your life,
but you can control the width and depth."
~ Author unknown

my signature exchange partner:"Ignoring the facts
does not change the facts"
We are not seperated at this time. I did leave for a short while, but I had become so depressed and anxious I was a mess. I had to come home, this is my security. Where I feel safest, and can be me. I, also, was staying with my mom, that was hard too. I've been out on my own since I was 18, I'm 33 now. Now that I'm home, things are very "cold" here. I realize I hurt him, and he's trying to protect himself from getting hurt. Niether one of us is really working towards making this marriage work at this point. I am going to counseling. He's not, he says he doesn't need it, that I'm the one who's had a change of heart. I also know that I'm not contributing in any way to make things warmer. I really don't want to. All I'm trying to figure out is, is this really what I want, or a phase I'm going through. The closest thing I've tried to do was go to the movies with him. We both talk about wanting to see this movie. I kept asking if he was working certain days (his schedule isn't always the same). The answer was always yes. I told him why I was asking, that I thought if he had a day off we could go see the movie. Haven't seen it yet and he's had days off. Of course I haven't tried the saying let's go to the movies tonight approach. He's gone fishing, and to hockey games. So I'm starting to wonder, does he even want to work on this marriage, like he said? He's angry with me, and this could just be a result. Which is why he needs counseling too.
That was an interesting fact regarding affairs. It makes sense to me. It doesn't justify it, but makes sense. It just makes things easier to deal with though. It doesn't solve the problem at home, for me at least. I was running, escaping the reality, cause it was too hard to deal with. I don't like conflict. I avoid it at all costs. It's a weakness of mine that I'm trying to work on. The only good thing that came from my affair...I am taking a good hard look at who I am and who I want to be. Because the person who had that affair, is not who I want to be. I guess that was my "rock bottom"
>>Interestingly, I'm reading a book that had some interesting things to say about affairs. "...third parties do serve to stabilize relationships and help keep the real issues safely underground.....the triangles stabilized the marriage so that neither partner was pushing for change" By no means is the author condoning affairs, rather showing how they allow the partner who's in the affair to distance emotionally and keep them satisfied with their relationship as it is by allowing them to avoid being fully invested and thereby making it easy to be satisfied with things remaining as they are.<<
I've never thought of it that way before either. And as someone who has had affairs, I quite agree with it. Sure, the right thing to would have been to address the issues, but having affairs was the easy way to satisfy my emotional needs without upsetting the apple cart.
Again, not condoning my or anyone else's behaviour, sometimes it seems just too hard to deal with stuff. Or you can't even figure out what needs to change in the first place. I did some counselling during my first marriage, but they seemed to just delve into my feelings without giving me any direction. Sometimes I feel that one can do with a dose of someone like Dr Phil. Someone who will tell their patient when they are out of line. Someone who will say that x is wrong in your marriage because of y. And you need to do z to fix it.
I look back at my previous marriage and the total loss of libido that I suffered. I spoke to many a professional, but not one of them sat me down and said "your libido is zero *because* you're not happy in your marriage". Nobody explained it to me. And something that I found incredibly hard was that I felt like I couldn't verbalise how miserable I was....especially when, like Jerzi Gal, there was nothing terrible happening in the marriage.
Jerzi Gal, sorry to ramble in your message...but I know how you feel. If you follow your heart, you will find what you seek. Don't return to something that makes you miserable.
So he says he doesn't need counseling because he's not the one who changed? I would think he'd be willing to go to counseling because things in the relationship had changed, whether it was him or not. I mean, he can take that hard stand, but it won't make the relationship better. His statement reads like, "I'm not going to do anything different so there's no point in going to a counselor." If that's true and your not happy with his part of the relationship (things have to be his way, as he wants them, refusal to do things that interest you) it doesn't sound like he's willing to consider your feelings or what you want any more than he has. In that way, I guess maybe he's right, he hasn't changed, he's always been this way, right? It's you that grew tired of never being considered and never doing things that interested you. I guess he's letting you know that staying with him means accepting that he's not going to be any more flexible than he is now. I agree that he could use some counseling, but it won't do him any good if he doesn't want it.
Has he always been this way? Has your relationship always been this way? It sounds like you're an accessory in his life rather than a living, breathing partner, you know? I understand that he loves you, but you do what he wants, see his friends, etc. It's as though you're to go along as a companion rather than an respected, equal partner. Do you have your own friends? I understand you'd like to do things with him, but it's also good to do things on your own and with friends. Do you do have a life of your own, a life without him? I'm not trying to be sarcastic, sometimes it's easy to lose sight of the fact that a partner is supposed to be a part of your life, not be your life, you know>
I understand you've hurt him, but he's hurt you by not being respectful and caring of you wants and needs. And I can completely understand not knowing if this is something you're going to continue to want or whether it's a passing issue. I guess I'd say look back at how long you've been unhappy with how things are. If what makes you unhappy are things that have been going on for a prolonged period of time and your unhappiness/dissatisfaction/dissolution has grown over time, it would seem almost certainly that you're only going to grow more unhappy/dissatisifed/disillusioned. And if he's making it clear he's unwilling to consider making any changes or adjustments on his end, you can be just as sure that it's not going to change or get better. To me, trying to learn to accept a life you're not happy in seems very sad, more than anyone should have to do.
I can understand the frustration in trying to see the movie together. I know you feel like you're making every attempt to see it and he's either not interested or he's not getting it, but it might also be a communication/assumption problem. Have you tried saying something more straightforward like, "I would like to see that movie, "XXX", would you?" Assuming he says yes you could say, "What would be a good time? Do you want to plan a day and time to see it now?" You could also sit down with him and tell him how you feel about how this movie thing has played out so far. Explain it to him like you did here. You might find out that while you assumed he'd say, "Hey, I'm off today so let's go see that movie", he assumed since you knew his days off you'd say, "Hey, let's go see that movie today." Without bringing the problem out in the open you'll never know why it's not getting off the ground. I've found assumptions, especially between men and women (we can operate so differently) can be the worst thing to do.
~ cl-2nd_life"You can't control the length of your life,
but you can control the width and depth."
~ Author unknown

my signature exchange partner:"Ignoring the facts
does not change the facts"