Whose rights, what rights?

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-13-2006
Whose rights, what rights?
38
Mon, 11-13-2006 - 11:18am

In the middle of an argument my wife threw out the comment "I have no rights in this home!"

My question is, what rights can she be referring to? What rights does one have or should one have in a home or household? I don't consider myself an idiot but would find it difficult to enumerate what I could view as "rights" in a family.

Please supply your answers gently and without animosity, remember, I'm a man, and as such, claim ignorance as to some of the finer workings of a relationship.

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-13-2006
Tue, 11-14-2006 - 12:33pm

I am somewhat surprised at the lack of input into what constitute "rights" in a relationship. I do not view my wife's comment as throw-away verbiage, a statement to be ignored. Instead, I am asking for some clarity into what others think could possibly be defined as "rights".

Someone mentioned equality as a right. Equality is, as it should be, a double-edged sword. It cuts both ways. At its basist of forms it equates to an eye for an eye. It seems somewhat like the issue of "freedom of speech"; An admirable goal until it is used as a weapon against. I will add equality to my list of "possibles" but would rather have something more substantial.

Someone also mentioned that I was looking for blacks and whites in a world of greys and that also may be true but I would appreciate it if someone gave a good go at defining rights in a relationship.

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-05-2004
Tue, 11-14-2006 - 1:45pm

I haven't read this entire string, just the posts up to the one I am replying to.

I can understand how you'd think that some of John Gray's books are trite....however, the book that was recommended to you actually does shed some light on the significant differences men and woman have when it comes to fighting....issues that you are experiencing in your own relationship right now. So, while I do agree that parts of the book 'Men are From Mars, Woman are from Venus' will rub you as being trite...other parts may ring true and teach you something new about how to respond better in your fights/disagreements with your SO. For example, you reference how you want to try and 'fix' something when you wife communicates to you that you never listen - but you don't know how to. The thing is that is exactly how guys respond to situations like that - they want to try and fix them (and if they can't, it leads to frustrations). That isn't anything remotely close to what she wants when she communicates things like that to you. I suggest you give this one a try.

With that said, the other advise about fair fighting. Definately try and read that one with your wife. Maybe it will help her with the use of 'always' and 'never' which really doesn't help things (as you already know). GL.

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-05-2004
Tue, 11-14-2006 - 1:53pm

Input on rights....

Your wife telling you that she has no rights in the house isn't really about her trying to define what rights she really does or doesn't have in the relationship.

She is telling you that she doesn't feel like your equal parter. She is telling you that she thinks that what you say goes, regarless of how she feels about it. She is telling you that she doesn't think you take into account her desires/ thoughts/ opinions/ needs/ wants/ etc into account when you make a decision about something.

She says she has no rights because she doesn't feel empowered by your relationship - she feels repressed by it.

Her statement doesn't have to do with her rights and you being able to 'fix' that situation (read Men are From Mars, Woman are From Venus). She is trying to tell you about how the dynamics of you relationship makes her feel (most of us aren't very good at understanding our feelings, let alone communicating what we feel effectively).

If you want to get to the root of that issue....the questions you are asking on this board will not help much because her statement really isn't about the rights she has or doesn't have in your relationship it is about how the dynamics between the two of you makes her feel. The best thing you can do is listen and ask questions so you understand better why that is. A short-term visit with a professional to help the two of you get to the bottom of that issue would be helpful as well as helping the two of you improve how you communicate when you have a difference of opinion. GL Again.




Edited 11/14/2006 4:57 pm ET by lled2
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Tue, 11-14-2006 - 2:04pm

Honestly, I'm surprised at your seeming lack of understanding that a laundry list of what constitutes rights in a relationship should be lined out item by item all inclusive.








"Ignoring the facts
does not change the facts"
Avatar for northwestwanderer
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Tue, 11-14-2006 - 2:10pm

I agree 100%!!!

Sheri

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Tue, 11-14-2006 - 3:30pm
Great response, Iled2!








"Ignoring the facts
does not change the facts"
iVillage Member
Registered: 10-13-2004
Tue, 11-14-2006 - 3:33pm
I'm right there with lled2 as well. If I were to say "I have no rights", I would mean exactly what she described.
Dress Up Games, Doll Makers and Cartoon Dolls @ The Doll Palace
iVillage Member
Registered: 12-31-2004
Tue, 11-14-2006 - 4:17pm

To expound upon what I was saying:


Yes, on the surface one can say "I honor my vows, that's not the problem", but that IS the problem---especially the one about cherishing.


You say you have a habit of being forceful in your opinion to the point where your wife feels she must back down or 'give up her right to her own'.

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-13-2006
Tue, 11-14-2006 - 5:14pm

Ever since you began responding you have done so with a slight tone of hostility. >a laundry list ..... sheds some light on the reason behind your problem.< Surely, I'm not the only person in the world having difficulty defining rights in a relationship.

That you have worked out this issue between you and your partner is all well and good but doesn't bring clarity to me. You are trying to dictate to me what you think I should have as priorities. I have read what you have stated, responded to your issue that rights are not a black and white issue, but beg to disagree.

I don't disagree to equality, just don't see it as simplistically as you do. Equality is a motherhood issue; simply stated, but difficult to achieve. I said that I would include it in my list, did I not? But equality has been stated for years as an issue in American politics, for example, for that matter in French politics since the revolution, but these nations are no where near achieving equality. Women still get paid a fraction of what men get paid for the same job and different races have different opportunities to advancement in society and in the boardroom. If the issue is so simple, why is it difficult to achieve?

I asked what others view as rights in a relationship, also stating that I couldn't define it with precision.

If rights are to be used as an isuue then they must be defined, otherwise no one knows what is being talked about. Broad, sweeping generalities do not give definition. If you can't define it, how do you know when you've achieved it?

My argument is not with you, I'm trying to bring closure and understanding. If my question really has no answer I will understand that from the silence of others. I heard your message about seeking counselling but walking into counselling without having some idea of what is being sought after cannot be meritous, can it?

I have already defined what is equal in my household. We have near equal wages (simply because we live in s socialist country) and we share the chores of householding, which include economics, cleaning, cooking, shopping, care of children and discussions of planning. The problems arise when there is disagreement and how that disagreement is resolved.

Unfortunately, in this discourse with you I have not reiterated that the problem also arises from how the disagreement is conducted.

Of equal importance in my wife's intial statement is that she stated "I have NO rights." I restate this with emphasis on the "NO" because the word, in itself, states an unequivitaly of ultimates. "No" does not indicate any measure or amplitude of degree. It is an ultimate. Simply stated, "no means no".

By seeking a definition to "rights" I then can address the "no". Once the "no" can be quantified, then a compromise can be reached.

Thank you for your time.

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-13-2006
Tue, 11-14-2006 - 5:33pm

Your words ring true. At the same time that I see the wisdom in what you're saying, I also recognize why my wife so poorly communicates her position. Whenever she states things in ultimates of "never" and "always" my mind shuts down. I back away from the argument because I see it as unresolvable.

Feelings, as you know, are subjective. Because my wife may feel disenfranchised or repressed doesn't mean it is actually so. Her desire for immediate responses, for winning an argument, may cloud her perception that she is actually getting what she asked for. Simply stated, some people perceive that if gratification doesn't come immediately, then it doesn't fit the bill. (And I just realized that that wasn't "simply stated")