he keeps lying about porn
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he keeps lying about porn
| Thu, 05-13-2004 - 12:33pm |
Please help! My fiance and I just bought a house, and our wedding is in 4 months. For the 4th time I have caught him looking at on-line porn pictures of other women. (The only way I find out is because I snoop around on the computer to find out where he has been, and he isn't computer savy enough to cover his tracks) The porn is problem #1, then problem #2 comes when I confront him about it. I ask him, and he lies and makes excuses ( excuses like it was on his email, and he thought it was from a friend, it was a pop-up, and on and on). I watch him wiggle around long enough, and then I tell him I know better. Then, and only then, he tells me the truth??! This is the 4th time!! The last time, I really thought it was the last time. He promised, and had stopped for about 2 months. Then I gave him a poloroid camera, and let him take his own personal pictures of me to keep him satisfied. What should I do? This is our only problem. Do I call of the wedding, and take the house? I can't trust him anymore, and I am starting to doubt everything else he tells me on any subject. What do I do? Please help!

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Carrie
I also have a questions for the orginal poster: Why are you having such a problem with him viewing porn?? How does it affect your relationship?? It the porn interferring with your sexual relationship?? Does his viewing porn interfer with his job or his day to day life??
I am co cl for "Ask Dr. Ruth" board.
The problem isn't the porn....and technically it isn't the lying (although that is a problem - give me a second on that)...it's the fact that you don't "get it".
People do what they do because they want to do it. Their values, priorities and stanadrds justify and entitle them to their actions, feelings, thoughts, decisions, words, ideas, and desires. Those same values determine in all situations their character, conscience, integrity and honor.
So basically - you two don't share a "value system"...at least about porn.
He does not believe it is wrong to look - if he did, he wouldn't do it.
You do believe it is wrong and you basically confronted him with it thinking you could convince him that your belief that it is wrong - is right to hold. And that his belief that is right to look - is wrong to hold.
You probably made a threat.....or an ultimatum - about what you'd do if he did it again.
So...in the initial discovery...what you found out is that you do'nt see eye to eye on the "subject of porn". And rather than deal with that fact to reach compromise - you responded to the "feelings" that him looking at porn inspired in you.
So, now he's gone "underground" with the porn. He didn't change his belief that it was wrong to view....he adopted the position "it's a b(*ch to get caught doing what I see nothing wrong with."
So, he's hidden it. And you've snooped. Found him out....confronted him again.
To the lying.....here's whre the crux of the issue lies.
Just like he doesn't think it is wrong/bad to view porn. He also doesn't think it is wrong/bad to lie about his actions if it means elimination temporarily of negativity.
Meaning....anything in life that you "confront" hiim about - his value system says "lie to her to save your butt in this moment."
Given that you can't dictate his values...and his values dictate his actions - the "problem" that you've got isn't porn...or lying.
it's the fact that you two don't share a "values system" about what is right and wrong to do to "people" in regard to communication and interaction.
You see...this could have gone differently. If you'd have caught him the first time, he could easily have said "well, I'm not going to stop doing it because it's not wrong. But if you're unhappy about it being IN thehouse with you - we can compromise on that. I won't bring the magazines in the house. But dear, I CANNOT view the on-line porn at work because that'll get me fired and that'll cause us all alot of grief. So, as far as on-line porn...it WILL be coming into the house, but you can always know the type of sites I'm going to by looking at the browser."
Had that been the discussion venue....you culd have decided "Okay, I can't live with his looking at porn, he's not going to stop - do I want to continue the relationship knowing this will never change?" And you'd have had to answer that - that situation si the very one you sought to avoid - by the confrontation and threat/ultimatum....you dysfunctionally believed you could control what he thinks is right and wrong - by threatened loss of your benefit in his life.
So, you made the threat....he told the lie...and you continued to snoop because instinctively you knew that he didn't think it was "wrong" to view porn but that you'd just made it an "option" to lie to you about it in order to save his butt. When you have kids -remember this so that you don't encourage them to lie to you to get what they want at the moment.....bad habit, his parents taught it to him!
So basically, you've gotten further invested and involved in not just the relationship but a wedding...so you now are precisely whre you were the first time around when you "found out" not "caught" him looking at porn. Are you two going to have an honest discussion and make some sort of compromise so that neither of you get completely what you want, but neither of you lose everything you've got.....or are you going to leave because this is not an area on which you're willing to compromise? Because the option you still haven't got - is dictating his values which justify his actions.
The problem you've really got....and this would be hard for me to deal with...is the knowing that "lying is fine to save my butt" value that he holds. I personally could not, because I was one of those people for so many years and KNOW how I utilized that justification system to my benefit and their detriment, be in a relationship with someone who's values justified them lying to me to benefit them, in the moment - or in the long run.
In which case, you're honestly better to have found this out now....that in ANY situation in your lives if he perceives he'll benefit by lying, misleading, or omitting something - he will.
Situations are the stage on which we play out our values with our actions. Situations do not "inspire us to particular actions".
Erin
quickblade14@hotmail.com
I commend you for trying counseling already. Was the counseling for his lying about the porn or for other reasons? If the counseling was before the lying and hiding and sneaking then I don't think it would hurt to go again for this reason (especially if it worked the 1st time). If it WAS for this reason and it hasn't helped the situation then I agree with doubleblade on the idea that these apparantly are his "values" and they obviouslly differ from yours. If he is unwilling to change to make you happy (which in turn should make HIM happy---the old "I'm happy if your happy" thing), then he is, in my opinion, not concerned with your values or beliefs on certian subjects. If this is somthing that you can't and will not live with and/or compromise on then I think it would be best to cut your losses because if he is unwilling to satisfy your needs on this issue then they will continue indefintly, even after you are married, which is somehting you will be forced to live with.
His values say it is okay to view it and alright to lie to you about anything that you don't agree with him doing.
So, are you going to stay married to someone and put your future in the hands of someone who has that value system?
Yes, or no....because you can't change his values...and his values justify his actions.
Erin
quickblade14@hotmail.com
Also, how often? Why is this a problem for you? Is it interfering with your sexual relationship? NOt being nosey, but these answers allow us to help you.
I am NOT sticking up for a person that is being untrue, but sometimes men (and women, actually) will tell "white lies" to avoid conflict about certain things. If he saw a bad reaction in the past from you, has a different opinion about porn and/or could not convey his viewpoint out about the porn, he might just do his thing and then not tell you to avoid issue. He may think that looking at porn is really not a problem and that if you don't know, it won't hurt you or "you" as a couple. Now I am not saying that this is right AT ALL but it may indicate that you need a different approach or a fresh start when it comes to this. This doesn't need to be a "deal breaker" for you two, esp. if it truy is not your only issue.
First of all, great idea about taking pictures of you! That is a great compromise. Maybe you can do that again so there are more of them in different poses, etc.
I have lots of thoughts and suggestions for you (I have dealt with this porn issue once or twice), but more info will help me to give you these opinions!
We have had a few very effective discussions since I originally posted this message. He has admitted to being addicted to porn, and said he wants to give it all up. He has already taken steps to help himself. He wants me to password protect the computer so he isn't even able to use the computer, and will not be tempted (he doesn't have a computer at work). He has come clean about having some videos hidden here at our house, and showed me where they were. He threw those out. He is asking for help (from me and his brothers) to keep it completely and totally away from him until he can get control over this issue. To help, I have opened a bigger communication line about sex, and fantasies.
He also said that he has had a life long mentality to lie when "caught", and told me he is figuring out that he does not have to do that with me. (By telling me about the porn videos was already progress) So the "lie to deny" will require work from him (that he wants to do), and my understanding/patience.
As soon as we can afford counseling (definitly before the wedding), we are going to go back to work on this issue that originally was not present.
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