How do you know?

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-05-2007
How do you know?
11
Tue, 06-05-2007 - 7:25pm

I've been with my SO for 10+ years. I love him and I know he truly loves me - for exactly who I am. We aren't married but we live together and we still laugh together, enjoy spending time together and communicate pretty well (I've even talked to him about the below some).

Problem is I've been struggling lately with whether this is enough for me? There is no fundamental reason to leave. He's good to me, doesn't hit me, cheat on me or abuse me in any way. He's an upstanding guy who is responsible and loyal. From the outside there is NO reason to walk away from him.

I also have pressing on me that I despise how people seem to be walking away from long term relationships these days (whether married or not). It seems like people hit this point in their marriage/relationship after 5, 10, 20 years where they "just don't feel it anymore" or "I'm not in love anymore" or "I'm not happy anymore" - in the same relationship they USE to experience happiness/love and those feelings. The reason they don't anymore is because one of them (or both) stopped doing the work - that's my take and I'm sure many will argue with me. But because I've been in a relationship for 10 years I can speak from experience that it IS work to make it last this long - it IS work to stick with it - it IS work to make it a lifelong relationship.

While I've not taken the wedding vows I do believe I live by them and there is nothing in the vows that say "as long as I'm happy, in love and experiencing "those" feelings"!

And my point is... I do not want to be the type of person who decides to just not do the work. BUT I also don't know, how to know if that's not my problem at all - maybe my problem is - I chose a man who has a different idea of how to operate in a relationship. A man whose priorities in life are different than mine. A man who doesn't dream or have goals in life and therefore is content to live exactly as we are now - forever!

From the outside HE is a good man, from the outside there is no viable reason for me to leave and even from the inside I have to question my sanity in considering walking away from a man that LOVES me and who I can't really imagine life without.

But we do not adore each other, there isn't passion and I've lost respect for him due to his inability to move forward in life. Unfortunately, I feel like giving examples makes those I'm seeking advice from, just focus on the examples - that's not what I'm looking for - we KNOW how to compromise and I've become really good at that - but it's the underlying belief - the difference in relationship ideals...

I don't know how else to explain it.

How do I know if I'm just "giving up" or if there really wasn't anything there to work with in the first place - we've just crippled along these years!?

Thoughts, advice!? TIA!

P.S. fyi - we aren't intersted in seeking professional advice. I've been down the therapist road and not sure I buy in to it!

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iVillage Member
Registered: 06-05-2007
Tue, 06-05-2007 - 8:11pm

a few humorous (to me) observations about your post:

1. you say you don't believe in seeking professional advice - but come to 'Ask Dr. Shoshanna' to get advice. polar opposites

2. your name 'roadlesstraveledby' means to many, inluding me, the 'road that is less traveled' is the life examined through therapy and self analysis.

3. WHY ARE YOU TWO NOT MARRIED? your question: Problem is I've been struggling lately with whether this is enough for me?

i would say that came to me as a very obvious answer to your question.....if you asked 100 girls/women if what you describe (your 10 year relationship with your SO) is enough, I would guess near 100% would say that no, it wasn't enough either.

other answers of mine to your questions or my observations:

u:There is no fundamental reason to leave.

yes there is. leave him....after so long together, why hasn't he shown the respect that you and your relationship deserve?

u: From the outside there is NO reason to walk away from him.
i'm looking from the outside and i see the obvious reason that you didn't go into.

u:I also have pressing on me that I despise how people seem to be walking away from long term relationships these days (whether married or not).

i despise it as well. yet sometimes people walk away because they are of very weak character and sometimes they walk away because they are of strong character. in other words, there is sometimes good reason to take that walk.

u:While I've not taken the wedding vows I do believe I live by them and there is nothing in the vows that say "as long as I'm happy, in love and experiencing "those" feelings"!

sorry to be so blunt here, but you haven't taken any vows. neither has you SO. none. there is a lot of good in the vows people take when getting married. yet, so many don't even take the time to understand what they are really agreeing to with their vows.

walking away from the vows you take is quite serious. yet, it is not an issue for you. he has said no vows publically and neither have you.

u:And my point is... I do not want to be the type of person who decides to just not do the work.

well, it sounds as if it isn't you. so, do the work and figure out what it is you need from this relationship that you aren't getting. the respect and real commitment that comes from marriage? what is missing for you?

u:maybe my problem is - I chose a man who has a different idea of how to operate in a relationship.

one the one hand i read this and see the usual blame of the SO for ones own issues. one the other hand i see this as the answer to your own question.....he isn't giving you what you need him to. but what is it he isn't giving you?

u:I've lost respect for him due to his inability to move forward in life. Unfortunately, I feel like giving examples makes those I'm seeking advice from, just focus on the examples - that's not what I'm looking for - we KNOW how to compromise and I've become really good at that - but it's the underlying belief - the difference in relationship ideals...

you don't need to give an example because you told us the major example in your second sentence:

u: We aren't married but

that is one giant but that you seem to be unable to live with......is that one of the compromises you really live with or have you just been telling yourself it is okay:

u:we KNOW how to compromise and I've become really good at that - but it's the underlying belief - the difference in relationship ideals...

which relationship ideals are your referring to? maybe you need to explore this question more on your own or even with the help of a trained professional?

u: How do I know if I'm just "giving up" or if there really wasn't anything there to work with in the first place - we've just crippled along these years!?

one way i know of is to take the road less traveled.

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-05-2007
Tue, 06-05-2007 - 8:37pm

and your user name tells me everything I need to know! maybe that's the advice you give everyone so you just used it as your user name!?

Please do not put your belief that everyone WANTS to be married off on me! I've been completely happy not walking down the aisle and signing a document to prove I love and honor someone!

I don't think half the people who walk down the aisle, say the vows and sign the document take it serious - I haven't done those things and I take it more seriously than alot of them!

Also... I am cerebral hence the username - but I do not care to invest financially and with my time sitting in a chair while someone spends HOURS listening and a few minutes giving advice!

Your post was not helpful to me because in my opinion it was judgmental and a whole lot of reading into things! As if because we haven't taken wedding vows there's no reason to be committed to ACTUALLY taking the road less traveled by!

I look forward to others' replies!

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-13-2004
Tue, 06-05-2007 - 9:09pm

I'm not going to push the marriage idea onto you. My partner and I have been defacto since 1993. We've got a mortgage, 2 kids and a 3 legged dog. And we're much happier and more content than many married people we know. We've got joint bank accounts, retirement plans and family health insurance. We also have the same legal rights as a married couple in the case of medical emergency. We're absolutely committed. Lack of a piece of paper makes no difference to us. I understand where you're coming from.

Let's talk about your situation:

I don't believe that a GOOD relationship is hard work. In my experience, the hard work arises when two people have vastly different ideals. You see, my relationship is easy and comfortable. Mainly because we share the same ideals about life. I don't think I could be happy or comfortable with someone who has different life goals to me. But then again, I am divorced....I've already left a marriage where our ideals were incompatible.

I'm really not sure what to tell you because you must do what feels right to you. Can you live happily with someone who has such different ideals to you? And how much hard work is too much hard work?

Dress Up Games, Doll Makers and Cartoon Dolls @ The Doll Palace
iVillage Member
Registered: 06-05-2007
Tue, 06-05-2007 - 9:18pm

Well... you make a really good point! And I tend to believe the reason I think it's hard work is because *I* am still learning and growing in regard to how to have a healthy relationship! There was a time (10 years ago) when if he went to play softball for a Saturday I would lay in bed and cry and *think* that meant he didn't love me (that's a more drastic example)! We have come a LONG way from that! I really do believe I've grown a lot but I also know I still have alot of room for growth in regard to operating appropriately in the relationship! So I guess that's where my fears come in to play that I don't want to make a knee jerk reaction and ruin a good thing!

But maybe looking at it from "how much hard work is too much hard work" is a good measuring tool for me! I'm going to give that one some thought! And thank you for sharing your story with me - marriage is great - but it's not "marriage" that makes a relationship worthy!

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-05-2007
Wed, 06-06-2007 - 12:32pm

u:I've been completely happy not walking down the aisle and signing a document to prove I love and honor someone!

yes, you post is that of someone who is completely happy. sorry to have pointed out the obvious to you.

U:I don't think half the people who walk down the aisle, say the vows and sign the document take it serious - I haven't done those things and I take it more seriously than alot of them!

i do agree with you. see, the thing is, that you choose to ignore, is that you haven't taken any vows. so again, this isn't an issue for you.

U:but I do not care to invest financially and with my time sitting in a chair while someone spends HOURS listening and a few minutes giving advice!

ure choice...however, i still stand by my answer to your post-it is one great way to find out "How do you know"

U:Your post was not helpful to me because in my opinion it was judgmental and a whole lot of reading into things!

not helpful...well, i agree with you again. yet, it sure seemed to strike a cord in u.

iVillage Member
Registered: 02-05-2007
Wed, 06-06-2007 - 12:54pm

Welcome to the board roadlesstraveledby,


Ok, no professional help, how about some good self-help books?


Love in the Present Tense: How to Have a High Intimacy, Low Maintenace Marriage, Shechtman


How to Create a Magical Relationship, by Ariel and Shya Kane


The 10 Second Kiss, Ellen Kreidman

Avatar for blondie0506
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Wed, 06-06-2007 - 1:20pm

I won't address the marriage vs. non-marriage or counseling vs. no counseling, as these are both very personal choices and to comment on them would be judgemental, rather than helpful.

That said, I'll give this my best shot.

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I believe this boils down to exactly what it is you're seeking to gain from a relationship. If you want a good guy who doesn't hit you, cheat on your abuse you, who is upstanding and loyal, then you've got what you're looking for. If you want more, and you don't have it, then it's time to move on.

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I think you're long-held, hard fast belief may be holding you back. Again, this is just MY opinion, but there are countless reasons that relationships don't work out. I do have beliefs regarding relationships with children, and that changes things somewhat, but to explain all my beliefs would take more characters than I'm allowed! lol!

I think there are countless reasons to leave a relationship. The biggest "catch all" reason I can think of is that it's not working for you anymore. That may sound trite, but that's the sum total of it. For example, 8 years ago I met a guy who said nice things to me, spent loads of money on me, was responsible, and generally a well-regarded individual. This fulfilled my needs *at the time*. Over time, I grew to truly learn who I am and what I stand for. I wanted a "best friend", a confidant, a person to laugh with a grow with. He was NONE of those things. There's much more to it, but from an objective standpoint, after 6 years, it no longer worked for me. I felt empty, alone and neglected. I walked away and am SUCH a better person for it.

I think if you broaden your "requirements" for leaving a relationship and allow just a little bit more "gray" into the mix, you might have a better perspective. And by saying this I'm NOT trying to persuade you one way or another. I'm just saying that "this is the ONLY reason people should leave" is confining and restrictive and doesn't allow for growth. It also allows for little understanding towards others.

<>

Good point. Ideally, you should know a man's priorities, etc. and how they align with yours BEFORE investing. Unfortunately, many of us don't figure that out in our 20's, 30's or even 40's, and sometimes EVER. During that time, we may have chosen the wrong partner. Knee jerk answer requested - are you content to live exactly as you are now? Forever?

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Only you can decide to take a chance and be on your own.

<>

Tough to carry on a "partnership" with someone you don't respect. What you reference above, IMO, is a very LARGE difference in goals. Tough to work that out and could possibly contribute to your "hard work" that you're finding yourself doing. I agree that good relationships are NOT hard work. They're easy. You make concessions and compromises, but at the end of the day, you're happy to do so for the good of the relationship.

<>

I'm going to post an essay in another post. It's a nice insight into overthinking things.

Avatar for blondie0506
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Wed, 06-06-2007 - 1:27pm

Here's the essay written by Timothy D. Wilson. It was published around the New Year, but is relavent, IMO, at any time. Hope you enjoy.

IT'S navel gazing time again, that stretch of the year when many of us turn our attention inward and think about how we can improve the way we live our lives. But as we embark on this annual ritual of introspection, we would do well to ask ourselves a simple question: Does it really do any good?

The poet Theodore Roethke had some insight into the matter: "Self-contemplation is a curse / That makes an old confusion worse." As a psychologist who conducts research on self-knowledge and happiness, I think Roethke had a point, one that's supported by a growing body of controlled psychological studies.

Not sure how you feel about a special person in your life? Analyzing the pluses and minuses of the relationship might not be the answer.

In a study I conducted, people in one group were asked to list the reasons their relationship with a romantic partner was going the way it was, and then rate how satisfied they were with the relationship. People in another group were asked to rate their satisfaction without any analysis; they just gave their gut reactions. It might seem that the people who thought about the specifics would be best at figuring out how they really felt, and that their satisfaction ratings would thus do the best job of predicting the outcome of their relationships.

It was the people in the "gut feeling" group whose ratings predicted whether they were still dating their partner several months later. As for the navel gazers, their satisfaction ratings did not predict the outcome of their relationships at all. Our conclusion? Too much analysis can confuse people about how they really feel. There are severe limits to what we can discover through self-reflection, and trying to explain the unexplainable does not lead to a sudden parting of the seas with our hidden thoughts and feelings revealed like flopping fish.

Self-reflection is especially problematic when we are feeling down. Research shows that when people are depressed, ruminating on their problems makes things worse.
In one study, mildly depressed college students were asked to spend eight minutes thinking about themselves or to spend the same amount of time thinking about mundane topics like "clouds forming in the sky." People in the first group focused on the negative things in their lives and sunk into a worse mood. People in the other group actually felt better afterward, possibly because their negative self-focus was "turned off" by the distraction task.

What about people like police officers and firefighters who witness terrible events? Is it helpful for them to reflect on their experiences? For years it was believed that emergency workers should undergo a debriefing process to focus on and relive their experiences; the idea was that this would make them feel better and prevent mental health problems down the road.

But did it do any good? In an extensive review of the research concluded that debriefing procedures have little benefit and might even hurt by interrupting the normal healing process. People often distract themselves from thinking about painful events right after they occur, and this may be better than mentally reliving the events.

What can we do to improve ourselves and feel happier? Numerous social psychological studies have confirmed Aristotle's observation that "We become just by the practice of just actions, self-controlled by exercising self-control, and courageous by performing acts of courage." If we are dissatisfied with some aspect of our lives, one of the best approaches is to act more like the person we want to be, rather than sitting around analyzing ourselves.

Social psychologist Daniel Batson and colleagues at the University of Kansas found that participants who were given an opportunity to do a favor for another person ended up viewing themselves as kind, considerate people - unless, that is, they were asked to reflect on why they had done the favor. People in that group tended in the end to not view themselves as being especially kind.

The trick is to go out of our way to be kind to others without thinking too much about why we're doing it. As a bonus, our kindnesses will make us happier.

A study by University of California, Riverside, social psychologist Sonja Lyubomirsky and colleagues found that college students instructed to do a few acts of kindness one day a week ended up being happier than a control group of students who received no special instructions.

As the new year begins, then, reach out and help others. If that sounds suspiciously like an old Motown song or like simplistic advice from one of those do-gooder college professors, well, it is. But the fact is that being good to others will ultimately make us kinder, happier people - just so long as we don't think too much about it.

Timothy D. Wilson, a professor of psychology at the University of Virginia, is the author of "Strangers to Ourselves: Discovering the Adaptive Unconscious."

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-05-2007
Wed, 06-06-2007 - 2:04pm
Thank you for those suggestions - I'll have to look into them! :)
iVillage Member
Registered: 06-05-2007
Wed, 06-06-2007 - 2:14pm

I think the problem for me is - I might want more but than how realistic is that!? To have everything my SO is now AND more... that seems rather selfish and tempting fate (not neccessarily in a good way) haha!

You are probably right but I'm not sure this is something I can just change my perspective on... how do you one day just decide "I realize for 30+ years of my life I've felt this way - but now I'll feel this way"!?!?!? Seems like a hard feat! To watch relationships break up around me now for YEARS - starting with my parents relationship 15 years ago... I wanted to be the type of person that didn't "give up" for lack of better words. It's much easier to justify if he's hitting me or beating me - but for a selfish thing like "I'm not sure this is right!?" Obviously we've done something right because we've lasted 10 years... now we just let it go! that's hard for me to stomach regardless how sane it might seem! :-s

No... but also don't know if I can be content to let go of something good.

Thank you for posting that essay - it was rather interesting. I know it comes down to me making the decision but I find it really difficult. Someone I love and enjoy being around - laugh hysterically with and I have to decide whether or not to walk away with the HOPE of finding someone better suited for me! Or I could end up alone - that would sure be a kicker! Leave good for great and end up alone!

Thanks for your post!

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