Im dating a married woman

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-01-2007
Im dating a married woman
19
Sun, 07-01-2007 - 8:21pm
My girlfriend and i have been dating seriously for about a year, and we knew each other for about a year before that. I am very seriously in love with her, like i have never loved anyone before. This is the first relationship i have ever been in in which it was not about what i could get from it, but about what i could give, and what WE can get out of it. It really is a partnership, in the truest sense of the word. I really sincerely try to put her first in everything, even before myself. I say that because i dont want anyone reading this to think that this relationship is anything less than completely utterly serious to me, or that she is anything less than the one and only love of my life, or that i am pointing out problems that she has, or ways that she is wrong. None of the things you will read below are necessarily bad, unless they make her unhappy...they are things that are true about her, and so i love them...i would never ever ask or even want her to change in any way, but they are standing in the way of our happiness and of our making our shared dreams come true. Now, the problem, as you may have surmised from the title above, is that she is married. She has been married for almost 13 years. She tells me that she loves me, and that if i can be patient, she is going to leave him for me. Not "maybe", not "im not sure", she says that she is sure that she wants to spend the rest of her life with me, which is also my dearest wish. Sounds great so far, right? I am really struggling with the fact that she keeps saying this but not doing it. i really am struggling with being patient, and when we are apart, i frequently find myself doubting her resolve to make this happen. I have definite difficulties trusting, so maybe some advice regarding that, regarding making me better at trusting, would be in order! Before i go any further, i want to give some idea of the relationship that we have. i want anyone reading this to understand why i say that she is the love of my life. The thing that attracted me to her initially was that i detected in her a kindred spirit. After getting to know her better, i can say that i have never known anyone else that i had so much in common with. We have many many interests in common, we are both geeks...into comic books, science fiction, etc...we both also enjoy murder mysteries, and are "media junkies" in general. We both have a strong desire to travel, we want to experience everything that there is to experience...we spend many hours curled up on the couch watching those travel shows, day dreaming about travelling together. We go for walks in the park, we spend hours and hours just talking about mundane things that to anyone else would seem completely trvial. We laugh and cry together. We do housework together. We do bills together. We virtually never ever fight, and every single fight we have ever had has been about the inability to move our relationship to the next level...most of those fights can be attributed to me, and so i have really made an effort to stop bringing it up, to stop pressuring her about it, those kinds of things, and i think that i have been successful. We are also very similar emotionally. We share things that neither of us have ever shared with anyone else, because each of us knows that the other understands, which is an amazing feeling. we have the same fears, we have the same neuroses, the same hang ups, and we want the same things out of life. We have the same political views. We have amazing sex, spiritual and intense and satisfying to both of us. We sincerely love each other as we are. Neither of us expects the other to change in any way, but we both know that if the either person wants to change, the other is there for them to help and support in any way possible. And she DOES inspire me to change. She makes me want to be a better person, the person that i could have and should have been. We have completely honest and open lines of communication, even regarding difficult and unpleasant topics, which is something else i have never experienced before. I feel that i can be completely myself around her, and she told me the other day that she has never known anyone before that she felt she could be honest with...that she spent every second of her life doing things for other people, and that for the first time in her life, she felt that she could do things for herself, and that she could be honest about her needs and wants. i know that it is trite, but it really does feel like we are the same soul in two bodies, and that when we come together, the whole is so much more than the sum of our parts. Compare to that to the marriage she is in now in which her and her spouse say at most 15 words a day to each other, in which they dont EVER do anything together, even on their anniversaries, he didnt even get her anything for her birthday this year! She is responsible for EVERYTHING, and he is a complete slob...i know this last statement to be true because i spend many hours picking up after him. Based on the description that both she and her mother have given to me, coupled with what i have observed, they are married only in name, and live like roommates, with completely separate lives and nothing in common. There are a couple of problems though. i think that they all come down to her fear. I dont want to sound like i am criticizing her, because i am not. i dont want her to change, and i love her like she is. i really do understand her fears and why she feels the way she does, but that does not make it easier to handle. What i am asking for here is just some advice on how i can help her come to grips with her fears. If the result is that we are able to move forward, like both of us desire, then that would be a dream come true. Now, as i see it, the following things are her main concerns. 1) She is petrified of hurting her husband, and very reluctant to do so. Again, i completely understand. If she were less caring, selfless, and generous, she would not be the woman i fell in love with, but i do believe that she allows this selflessness to stop her from seeking her own happiness. If she is with me out of the same misguided loyalty, i would want her to leave me too...i never ever want to do anything to stand in the way of her happiness, but i truly, deep in my heart, believe that we will be happier together than any couple since...well, since forever. 2) She is afraid that i am "too good to be true" (her words) and that things will change when we get together, perhaps even deteriorating to the point that her current marriage is at. This is another one that i completely understand. We have both been betrayed in the past many many times by people we should have been able to trust. I think that she has simply lost her faith. The question is, how do i help her get it back? 3) Her husband makes more $ than i do, and she has about $20000 in debt that she wants to pay off before leaving him. She is not materialistic, but she is afraid of being poor. I can understand that. i mean, as much as people would like to believe, as much as they would like to romanticize and fool themselves to the contrary, money is important. i dont want her to be poor anymore than i want to be poor myself. $ is important to her, so it is important to me too. So, i guess that that is about it. Thanks sincerely for listening. Any suggestions?

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iVillage Member
Registered: 02-05-2007
Sun, 07-01-2007 - 9:14pm

Welcome to the board masterofallu2,


You probably won't like my advice, but I'm going to give it to you straight and it won't be easy to do.


As long as you are involved with her, stay with her, talk to her and carry on with her, you make it very easy for HER to stay EXACTLY WHERE SHE IS.

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-01-2007
Sun, 07-01-2007 - 11:49pm

Thank you so much for your reply. You know, it's funny, but she actually told me one time that i made being married to him bearable. At the time, it kinda bothered me, but she meant it as a compliment, so i tried to take it as such without being a whiny baby, but i suppose that in some way, i have always believed what you are saying to be true. The difficulty in that is...i think that if i truly love her, if i really do put her ahead of myself, if she needs what i provide to her, and i think that she does, wouln't it be selfish of me to withhold that for my own gain?

And as for your last comment, of course i dont want her to cheat on me, and that is a DEFINITE fear that i have, something that i have considered a LOT, but i believe part of a good partnership is trust, so i have to believe that she will be faithful to me as long as i treat her right. Please tell me what you think. i really do appreciate your thoughts on this.

Thanks again, sincerely.

iVillage Member
Registered: 04-29-2003
Mon, 07-02-2007 - 9:05am

Relationships that start as yours and hers did, fail just about each and every time. For starters, she's a cheater. Rationalize it all you want, but how most ADULTS carry out their lives and marriages is by ending something bad before beginning something new, otherwise they're just cheaters who ignore their problems.

Finally, by getting involved with someone who has not given themselves the time to be alone and get their act together (you're a rebound, don't forget it) you're setting yourself up for a mighty big fall. I'm sure that you feel that your situation is different that because it is it won't fall into the pitfalls that 99.999999% of these types of relationships do, but I think you've been forewarned plenty.

Of all the fish in the sea, you pick one that's taken.

iVillage Member
Registered: 04-02-2007
Mon, 07-02-2007 - 10:40am

i truly love her, if i really do put her ahead of myself, if she needs what i provide to her, and i think that she does, wouln't it be selfish of me to withhold that for my own gain?

____________________________________

So basically you love her more than you do yourself? You need to LOVE and Respect yourself first and foremost. You need honesty and trust among other things for a healthy relationship, how can you have that when you are both lying and cheating? How long are you willing to put her needs about your own?

Cheater = Liar......You both have been lying and cheating for 2 years (at least your moral values seem to be the same). So you are ok with her going and climbing in bed with her husband after she has been with you? Of course you make her marriage bearable... she has her cake and gets to eat it to. If she wanted to be with you she would be. Maybe her husband will find out and kick her to the curb and you can have what you want. Cheater + Cheater = Cheater. Karma is a B*tch and it will come back to bite you.

iVillage Member
Registered: 02-05-2007
Mon, 07-02-2007 - 11:36am

::And as for your last comment, of course i dont want her to cheat on me, and that is a DEFINITE fear that i have, something that i have considered a LOT, but i believe part of a good partnership is trust, so i have to believe that she will be faithful to me as long as i treat her right. Please tell me what you think.


Seriously, what goes around comes around. So even if you trust her, or the next woman, the chances are they will cheat, due to the seeds you have sown.


:i think that if i truly love her, if i really do put her ahead of myself, if she needs what i provide to her, and i think that she does, wouln't it be selfish of me to withhold that for my own gain?


This is not about 'your own gain' - this is about loving and respecting yourself enough to do the right thing.

iVillage Member
Registered: 12-11-2006
Mon, 07-02-2007 - 12:21pm

'so i have to believe that she will be faithful to me as long as i treat her right.'

Not necessarily. She is behaving in a cowardly way. Instead of getting out of a bad situation she is choosing to lie and cheat so that she can pay off her debt. There are so many things wrong there, don't you agree? Do you want her to stay with you for all the wrong reasons? What if you two get together and things go downhill. you will never be able to trusst her.

'i believe part of a good partnership is trust'

But she doesn't and has proven that in her marriage. SHe is not doing her part to create and instill trust is she?

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-01-2007
Tue, 07-03-2007 - 12:02pm

Wow! Thanks to everyone for your responses...your advice is sage, and i have taken everything to heart. I have noticed that my response to the first response that i received seems to have generated more advice than my original text, so, to everyone that has said that i should not trust her and that cheaters never change, we actually have discussed this several times, starting several months ago. She has already agreed to go to counseling with me once she is out of the relationship she is in. Like i said, we share a lot of the same emotional baggage, and we both have a lot of things to work through. Both of us have a real desire to make this relationship work, and are aware of the hard work that it is going to require. i am not going into this with blinders on, i know that the odds are against us, and that it is going to be a very difficult road. But i also KNOW that what we have is not based solely on a feeling. There is a genuine and palpable commitmemt from both of us, her too, to make this everything that it could be, everything that a partnership and a marriage should be. I really do appreciate everything that all of you have told me, and i know that it comes from a place of trying to help me avoid being hurt, so thanks so much for your caring and sometimes brutal honesty, and i sincerely do agree with a lot of the things that everyone has said. What i am looking for though, is not reasons to get out of the relationship. I love her unconditionally and if this thing puts me in the ground, then so be it, i will go down thinking that it was worth it, knowingly making the decision to follow that path, but i am not leaving her. That may sound like co-dependence, naivete, or just plain foolishness, but i am not the only one who is contributing to this, and what she gives me, support, love, tenderness, and someone who understands me, is worth any sacrifice. I am not being a martyr. She has already given up a lot to be with me, and if i did not believe she thought this was worth sacrifice as much as i do, i would be gone. What i am really looking for is a way to help her move past her fears and financial dependence on him so that we can start living out the dreams we have shared. I know that it probably would be beneficial to me to break up with her, so that she would be in a position to fully appreciate what i add to her life compared to what is missing when i am gone. However, she needs me, and i am not going to deprive her of what she needs just to satisfy my own selfishness. If it takes 5 or 50 years, in which case we would probably both be long dead, i am prepared to make that sacrifice. It would be difficult, and half of it would be very very lonely, but i have promised myself and her that no matter what ever happens i will stand by her. Does anyone out there have any advice to give me on what i can do to help assuage her fears? i would like to say again that no one has told me anything that i have not already considered, and i do think that none of you are off base. i really do appreciate what you all are trying to do. What i really want, what i am asking for, is not reasons that it cant work or reasons that i should get out now before it is too late, because i have already played all these scenarios in my own mind and in conversation with her, i am looking for a non-manipulative, supporting way that i can speed up the process. i believe and trust that this could be everything that either of have been looking for since we started dating. a very large portion of the time that we spend together is not "exciting", nor is the relationship that we share fulfilling only because of future promise. the individual moments are the best i have ever had. please, in the future, try to limit your responses to positive things that can be done to get what her and i both want but dont know how to get.

Thanks again.

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-25-2003
Tue, 07-03-2007 - 12:25pm

Dating a married woman is a mistake that will end very badly for all involved.

I am willing to believe that you love her, and that maybe she loves you too.

However, she is emotionally entwined with her husband and family. Until she is dovirced and recovered from her divorce, she will never be a real partner nor wife.

In your shoes, I'd wait until she's completely divorced, and then another two years from the date of the divorce before you start dating again.

Statistics show that's how long it takes for one person leaving a marriage to fully process the damage and hurt of divorce and be fully available to you as a relationship partner.

There's no such thing as "divorced in my heart", or "out of love for years". These are rationalizations to circumvent the difficult and painful process of greiving a bad marriage.

If you continue to hook up with her, this relationship will end and you will hate each other. If you marry her, the two of you will divorce.

I know this sounds harsh, but it's the cold truth.

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-01-2007
Tue, 07-03-2007 - 2:55pm
Neither of us have ever been dishonest about her feelings for her husband. She openly admits to me that she cares for him and feels an attachment to him. How could one not have feelings for someone after being married to them for 13 years? I am fully aware that it will take her a long time to "get over" him. Again, this is not what i am asking for. Regardless of whether anyone else in the world thinks it will work between us or not, and believe me, i have heard all the reasons that it will not work, i am not interested in advice that is full of negativity or all the reasons that i should leave her. i believe in her, and in us. I am not stupid. i know that the odds are stacked against us. i know that she has a history of unfaithfulness and it is extremely unlikely that i am the magic cure to the illness that plagues her. i am not lying to myself. Everyone in the world, including both her and i, has reasons to disbelieve in love. Everyone has reason to be jaded, cynical and mistrusting. i dont think for one second that even a single step of this journey is going to be easy. But, i do believe that we can make it work if we both truly want that, if we are willing to work our hearts, minds, and fingers to the bone to make it a success. There are probably a million reasons that we should fail. We both have histories of unfaithfulness. We both were abandoned as children. The newness/excitement will wear off. Once we get it, the thrill of wanting something will be gone and we will move on. I am a rebound guy for her. She will never get over her husband. we will never get our finances straightened out. whatever else you feel like throwing out there. The bottom line is that the reason that all those marriages fail is that people give up and stop trying to make it work. Her and her husband have both given up on their marriage. She and i both recognize that the fault is as much hers as it is his. I gave up in my prevoious marriage. People get complacent and start looking elsewhere. It is human nature, and no one, including the 2 of us, is immune to that. It's easy to wait for "god to walk in the room", for magical moments to occur, and people expect those moments to last forever, and when they dont they start looking elsewhere for that rush of romance. i can say for 1000% certainty that i will not give up on this, and i believe in my heart that she will not either. if we have to get counseling, if we have to fight every day for 20 years, whatever, i am willing to do it, and when we are together, it works so well that it is worth it. i understand to the core of my being that, realistically, we probably will not make it. None of this is news to me. i have no illusions regarding that. But, in spite of all that, i believe that it really comes down to how badly you want it. if you want it, you will work for it, and it is possible, no matter how unlikely, to make it a success. her and i are both open-eyed regarding this. i know my weaknesses and limitations, she knows hers, and we are both aware of the other's faults. i did not come here looking for ways to fix every problem that our relationship will ever face, or for answers to whether or not i should continue to pursue this relationship. These are things that i have already sorted out for myself. What i am asking is whether or not anyone has any thoughts regarding the subject of how do i help her get over her fear and guilt so that she and i can move our relationship forward. If you dont have anything to say regarding that sepcific topic please keep your opinions about our doomed relationship to yourself. i came here looking for help, and instead i get a bunch of self righteous armchair psychologists slinging "harsh realities" at me. Well, you know what? none of this is news to me. i would be a fool if i did not examine all of those potential pitfalls before committing myself to her. i am aware, cognizant, and completely awakened to the fact that she and i have only the slimmest chance of making this thing work. i dont think that we are the exception to the rule. i know beyond a doubt that things will become mundane, that when we are together every day it will stop seeming so urgent to spend time together, that everyone in every relationship since the beginning of time has been attracted to other people, and that that inevitability is something we will have to face in the future. in fact, i think that unless we both really work, unless we both commit that no matter how hard or ugly it gets, we will not give up, it probably will fail. i am not relying on some magical fairy or some great sex to keep us together. i know that whether or not we fail rests solely in our own 2 hands. So you can stop telling me how foolish i am and that in time our relationship will be the worst thing that ever happened to either of us. Please, what i am asking for, and what i really need, is some ideas on how to move out of the limbo that we are stuck in now. Thank you sincerely.
iVillage Member
Registered: 07-03-2007
Tue, 07-03-2007 - 4:07pm
I am in a situation similar to yours. I am a married woman, of 20 years, dating and madly in love with someone other than my husband. I felt your pain when I read your letter and I understand how hard it must be for you not to be able to be with the one you love. As to why your freind doesn't leave, I have no magic answer. I am definatly not in love with my husband and haven't been for so long. Yet I find it so hard to leave. I have 2 children who for the most part are grown, one 19 and the other 17. My reason for staying was always stability for my children. I feel they are old enough to understand now and I still haven't left. I know it is fear of the unknown. But what I also know is that I have found my one true sole mate and I do love him more than anything in this world. I dream of a life with him and it is during those dreams that I am at my best. I don't want my children to think poorly of me, I don't want my church family to disown me, and I don't want the public to think of me as a scaret. I have always put my family first in everything I've done. I am married to such a work-a-holic. Our daughter has graduated high school and he never even once drove her to school. Raising the kids, taking care of the house, keeping the cloths clean, keeping groceries bought, keeping meals cooked,(and I am one of the few women left that still believe in a cooked meal everynight), keeping the kids in extra-curicular activities was always my job. And yes I also worked a full time job as a nurse. (8-12 hours a day in a pediatric office)We have no family that has ever helped out. No grandparent that so much as attended a little legue game (and my son played for 7 year) or a dance recital (and my daughter took dance for 8 years). No help just me. I was deeply in love with my husband at one time, but his lack of parenting or ever helping out around the house has turned my love into recentment. I have been lonely so much of my marriage. I came from a broken home and thought because he was still around I should be greatful. I done everything, because I always saw my mom having to do it all alone. I was a very faithful wife until I met "my freind". I had never had sex with anyone other than my husband, and have always been a God-fearing Christian. I have spent my intire life helping others, it's not in my nature to hurt anyone. (even my husband) I do not want to hurt the man of my dreams either. I know if I let him slip away I will never again know true happiness. I was happy raising my kids but that was about the extent of happiness to me. But the way I feel when I'm around him is something so wonderful so unique I know it doesn't come along but once in a lifetime. I have hated sex my entire marriage, and thought of it as a wifely duty. Since being with my friend for the first time in my 40+ years of life I know what passion and desire feel like. Even the bible teaches that sex is a gift from God to married couples. I can't figure out why I never felt it as a married woman, but yet as a sinner. I quess the main purpose I wanted to write you is to let you know just because your friend hasn't left her husband doesn't mean she loves you any less. And you were right when you said you felt it was fear. But even so just know that she can love YOU with every breath she takes, and dream only of a life with you, while she is still married to someone else.

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