Money...help!

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-31-2003
Money...help!
13
Thu, 11-20-2003 - 3:09pm
Oh my goodness. Just had a big argument with my bf over the phone. We've been having money problems (who hasn't been)...and recently started to talk about getting married. I don't want to sound materialistic here, but the guy has no money. He owns his own restaurant, and is majorly in debt. He makes just enough money everyday to buy supplies for the next day and to get himself a pack of smokes. He hired an employee recently and now he has to pay her tomorrow, and I know he won't have the money to. I told him I can't help him and he says he doesn't want help. I want to bring him to reality that this restaurant thing isn't flying like he thought it would, but he gets so angry. I don't want him to think that I want to be with him only if he has money (I know that's what he thinks). But I don't want to bring this fight into a marriage. I'm torn because I know he'll think I'm being materialistic....I just don't want to drown and end up having to cover his butt because I was too weak to say anything. Please, what would you tell him?

Sarah

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iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
In reply to: stoonmom
Thu, 11-20-2003 - 3:20pm
Hello...but until that restaurant and his income or lack thereof is DIRECTLY IMPACTING YOU BY LEGAL MARRIAGE....you don't cover his butt, or cover up his butt, or help his butt regarding HIS business.

You're right to be wary...if this business venture is simply ill-timed due to economy - that's one thing. If he's NEVER had a history of financial security or employment success or business success.....you need to get out of the relationship.

Let's get technical here.....dating is when you see if this person meets your needs and lives up to your standards...it's not about "do they want me".

A relationship is when after a significant period of dating you've determined through interaction in a myriad of circumstances and situations that you two SHARE values, priorities, goals, and definitions of a great life and how to achieve them. Not just "as discussed in generalities" but as evidenced by the life and lifestyles, goals and pursuits, successes and attempts that each of you has made as an individual in a variety of regards in life affecting venues....you agree that you both want a committed, exclusive relationship and trust, harmony, emotional bond is possible becuase you share the fundamentals in life.

Let's see...if you accidentally skip dating....and you go out and have fun and do nothing be consider your feelings about yourself when being around him, and get committed really quick to "having a great life with him" - without reviewing the facts of his life and lifestyle as HE created them for himself (that's his values and goals an dpriorities showing up there)......and you instantly make his successes your responsibility, and his feelings your priority, and his needs your obligation.....then you will en dup covering his butt in every regard...and you will lose your own!


If...let's say you did the true dating, and you formed a relationship and now you want to change him, and his course of life, and his occupation because of the financial instability and insecurity...you've done both of you a disservice. You liked the fun and excitement,you don't like the practical reality of the risk involved in those things.

If the man is not living up to your standards, meeting your needs, if "his life and lifestyle is what you want to live for yourself" end the relationship because you'll have nothing but regrets, resentment, frustration, and fear while you're in it - and that is not the "feelings" you get in a relationship to have 24/7/365.

Erin

quickblade14@hotmail.com


Avatar for northwestwanderer
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
In reply to: stoonmom
Thu, 11-20-2003 - 3:52pm

The next time the two of you discuss marriage, I would let him know that you are not

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
In reply to: stoonmom
Thu, 11-20-2003 - 4:28pm
First, what exactly is "materialistic" about wanting your BF to be financially stable? Financially stable doesn't mean wealthy. It means self-supporting, able and willing to earn enough to pay for basic needs, and at least some of the "extras" that make life pleasurable. It also means being relatively debt free, and not living in a state of constant anxiety over money issues. You don't need to bring him to reality that his business venture is not working. He's living that reality, and every time a bill comes due he's reminded of it.

Second, why would he think you only want to be with him if he has money? He doesn't have money now and you are with him. You are even discussing marriage to him. If he accuses you of that, understand that he is MANIPULATING you. He knows that you worry about being considered "money hungry", and he uses that to fault you rather than deal with his problem. He makes it seem that it's your expectation of his financial stability that is the problem, and not his financial instability. And you are buying into that by fearing his "judgment" of you. It is not only reasonable of you to have this expectation of him, as well as for yourself, it is necessary in order to have a successful marriage. A high percentage of divorces occur because of money issues, and some don't have money issues even close to the severity of your BF.

Third, if you marry him before he becomes financially stable on his own, you will be covering his butt as well as yours. Legal marriage will give you that responsibility. His debts will impact your finances, your lifestyle, your future - make no mistake about that.

My advice to you is this. Don't try to get him to understand his problem - he already understands it. Say nothing about it. Just don't marry him and tell him why if he asks - you can't and won't marry him until and unless he gets his financial house in order - period. Then turn a deaf ear to any outbursts. He's a fool if he thinks cruel words said in anger and accusations against you will convince you to marry him. A man who wants a woman for his wife uses words of love sweetly said, promises to cherish her, and allows her to trust him because he already demonstrates personal responsibility. Don't accept anything less than that.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
In reply to: stoonmom
Thu, 11-20-2003 - 6:16pm
you're not being materialistic - you value financial stability and building a nest egg and you don't want to inherit his debt or liabilities (i.e. if he doesn't pay his employees they may sue or he will be in trouble with the government).

Financial stability is a must for me and that is not at all materialistic.

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-12-2003
In reply to: stoonmom
Thu, 11-20-2003 - 7:47pm
and what if you wanted a family? Is this the situation you'd be able to raise a child in? That would be foolish.

I knew a guy like this- I liked him and we had fun together, but-- he was a bum as far as employement/money went. I had a few dates with him and cut him lose. I hear he's shacking up with some woman (his "sponsor" as he calls her) and still unemployed (2 years later), refusing to really pull his socks up and get ANY job...

But as long as he has enough for a pack of cigarettes....

He also claimed that a woman should "love him for who he is"-- well, I didn't particularly like "who he is" much less get close enough to "love" him.

Warm regards

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-06-2003
In reply to: stoonmom
Fri, 11-21-2003 - 9:20am
As I suggested on the other folder he needs to come to that conclusion himself. Otherwise, you are attacking his dream.

You can always share with him this poem, but somehow I think you will not quite share what it's saying.

Don't Quit

When things go wrong, as they sometimes will,

When the road you're trudging seems all up hill,

When the funds are low and the debts are high,

And you want to smile, but you have to sigh,

When care is pressing you down a bit,

Rest, you must - but don't you quit

Life is queer with its twists and turns,

As everyone of us sometimes learns,

And many a failure turns about

When he might have won had he stuck it out;

Don't give up, though the pace seems slow -

You might succeed with another blow.

Often the goal is nearer than

It seems to a faint and faltering man,

Often the struggler has given up

When he might have captured the victor's cup.

And he learned too late, when the night slipped down,

How close he was to the golden crown.

Success is failure turned inside out -

The silver tint of the clouds of doubt -

And you never can tell how close you are,

It may be near when it seems afar;

So stick to the fight when you're hardest hit -

It's when things seem worst that you mustn't quit.

author unknown~

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-31-2003
In reply to: stoonmom
Fri, 11-21-2003 - 1:52pm
this is the first time he hasn't asked me for money.

Sarah
Avatar for northwestwanderer
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
In reply to: stoonmom
Fri, 11-21-2003 - 5:08pm

Ok, that's a fact that I didn't have.

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-31-2003
In reply to: stoonmom
Fri, 11-21-2003 - 5:34pm
For sure, sorry i didn't make that clear...but yes, I have spent the majority of my paychecks to help him with his restaurant...in return, he gives me a bit of cash during the week from his sales, and I use it to buy a carton of milk, or whatever. I am just scared that I'll end up in the hole...and I feel bad because I always say yes to giving him the money, never asking him for it back, and then I get angry about it later...

Sarah
Avatar for northwestwanderer
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
In reply to: stoonmom
Fri, 11-21-2003 - 5:56pm

Well, that definitely needs to stop (you giving him money), and you need to have a talk with him about making a plan to pay it back.

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