His past

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
His past
16
Tue, 08-10-2004 - 1:07am
I know this has probably been on your board before, but I recently found out that my SO frequented strip clubs at one time. I am devastated because 1) he lied about it and 2) he knows my feelings about this issue. It has been discussed several times in our relationship. I know it is his past and his past cannot come into play now. But here is our situation. I married my high school sweetheart who ended up leaving me for another woman after 16 years of marriage. I was a goody-two-shoes somewhat because of my then boyfriend/husband. I was kept in a whole. He threatened to break up with me if I went away to college. For some reason, I listened to him and didn't go until after we were married. I have many regrets about not "living" a real life like most and hate that I missed experiences that I think young people should experience. I'm not talking sleeping around, just doing the normal things young adults do. I look back and hate my past life even though I can say I have no regrets about sleeping with only one person. I am morally satisfied with that. But my SO was a party animal who has fun stories to tell about his college life and after. I love hearing most of his stories, and am not bothered by the drinking/partying he did. I am sure he had fun and am happy for him. But it kills me to know that he has seen up close and personal probably 50 naked women and I can't help but feel that I would never be able to measure up to these women. Only two men have seen me naked and one of those left me for someone else. I am attractive, but not perfect. Since being with my SO (2 years) it has bothered me that we do not make eye contact when making love. Now I can only imagine he is thinking of being with a previous lover or one of the women whose perfect body he has seen. To top it off, his ex-wife was a knockout. I'm also one of those women who cannot orgasm thru intercourse and I have always felt I was not a good lover. I remember one of the first times we were together, I told him that and he seemed surprised. So of course, his previous lovers have been able to. I feel so inseure right now, you cannot even imagine. I am also so disappointed in him. I now look at him as a different person. It just isn't the same and I don't know how to let it go. I feel cheated even though it was in his past. My thoughts about strip clubs is that, hey, a decent guy is going to do it a few times for a bachelor party or because of peer pressure. But at some point your morals need to take over. I now feel like we probably aren't on the same page morally. Please help. I am crying as I type. I am a mother of two young boys and am now at an age and time in my life that I will never have the sexual experiences that others have or have had. Frankly, I'm not looking for that now. I just want the guy back that I thought I had. Why am I seeing a different person? Is it because he lied? I've been lied to before and it hurts deeply. Thanks for the patience in reading this.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 05-27-2004
In reply to: onmyown3
Tue, 08-10-2004 - 1:33am
This is not about him, or his past. It's about your own insecurities, and your inability to trust him. As you said, you can't change HIS past, and you can't change your own. You opted to give up your "youth" to get married, although being threatened to be "broken up with" hardly sounds like it was an option. It's unfortunate that you feel "cheated" out of your past, but again, there's nothing you can do about that, but you can have a good present and future, if you'd stop thinking about things that happened long before he knew you.

If you can't put his past out of your mind, then it's YOUR problem, and you'll either have to do that, or you might as well give up on the relationship. He didn't do anything that most guys don't do. So, he was up close and personal with some naked women. So what? He's not comparing you to them, so why are you comparing yourself? Do you think you're nothing more than a naked body to him? So his ex was a "knockout. Big deal. He's not with her anymore, so I guess "knockout" wasn't enough for him.

A relationship is in the here and now. The past has nothing to do with it. If you want a man with no past, then you're going to have to look long and hard. You say you don't make eye contact when you're making love. How do you know HE's not making eye contact, if you're not looking at him? You say you're "one of those women" who can't have orgasms from intercourse? Join the crowd, because about 80% of women are the same. So, you'll have them from clitoral stimulation, before or during intercourse. How does that make you "not a good lover"? A good lover makes their partner happy, and that has nothing to do with you having orgasms, or HOW you have them.

You focus on the strip clubs he went to, but yet you say the "drinking and partying" that he did doesn't bother you. How are they any different? Chances are, he was a lot MORE close up and personal with women when he was drinking and partying!

Many of us made mistakes when we were younger, but we can't undo them, we can only learn from them, and not make the same mistakes again. Stop worrying about what you didn't do, and focus on what you can do in the future. Start doing something about your own self esteem, and if you can't do it on your own, then get some help. Until you feel better about yourself, you're never going to be happy. Your first marriage was a mistake, and it's over now. You've been given a second chance to have a good life, don't blow it.

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-18-2001
In reply to: onmyown3
Tue, 08-10-2004 - 1:50am
<<<<< HUGS >>>>>

This is something that we can give you all the advice in the world about, but at the end of the day it's YOU that have to decide things for yourself and put it to rest in your own mind.

Why did he lie? Because he knew that you wouldn't like knowing. He'd figured that it was in his past, that you had hinted or even mentioned at some time early in the courtship that it wasn't something that you liked. He knew that you would react badly, so he avoided telling you something about himself that he didn't consider to be a major part of his earlier life anyway. He didn't lie. He felt that the drama incurred by talking about it wasn't worth the trouble.

You already know that you are feeling very insecure. Because of that you are viewing some things in a negative light that should be seen in a positive light.

You feel bad that he has seen 50 women naked and that you couldn't compare - well, for starters, you'd probably be surprised how well you compare to the strippers. Secondly, he chased YOU and found you more attractive than any of the strippers. Thirdly, if he's a sociable guy, going to a strip club with the guys is more of a social activity than a sexual one. They're there to have fun and a few beers and a few cheap thrills. Fourthly, you are a whole package - personality as well as a body. Strippers are just a body.

His ex wife was a knockout. Yep. And she's the EX wife too. You know that you are attractive. If he could attract a knockout ex-wife then the odds are that he's going to be attracted to another very attractive person - you. Feel good that he's chosen you over other attractive women.

You don't think that you are a good lover. He didn't notice. You had to tell him. He was surprised. Does that tell you something? You're a whole lot better than you think you are. And don't agonise over not cumming through intercourse. You are CERTAINLY not the only woman in the world that can cum during intercourse. There are plenty of women out there like you and they have perfectly awesome sex lives and great orgasms. It's a small thing really. Don't blow it out of proportion.

How many times to visit a strip club before the morals kick in? Well, when do the morals kick in? After one visit? Three visits? A half dozen times? You're not really on different pages. How different morally is going to a strip club once or twenty times? And of course, if he was there socialising then isn't that morally different again?

I can understand that you are hurt by this but I don't think that you should blow it out of proportion. Especially as it happened in his past. He obviously didn't find the clubs terribly entertaining as he doesn't go to them now.

Best wishes and good luck.

iVillage Member
Registered: 04-23-2004
In reply to: onmyown3
Tue, 08-10-2004 - 7:54am

His past is his past and that is where it should be kept.


bounxh0a-1.gif picture by dillbyrd

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-15-2003
In reply to: onmyown3
Tue, 08-10-2004 - 10:37am
Dear OMO,

You have received wonderful advice here especially from Greenteabag. It's helpful to remember four things in a relationship that will set you free.

1) Be impeccable in your word: never allow yourself to use your words to blame, accuse or judge him, or yourself (notice that you have done both of these...especially judging yourself).

2) Never make assumptions: Always ask questions. Don't create a story in your mind. You assume that he doesn't make eye contact during lovemaking because he's fantasizing about other women. SOme men are so into the physical sensations in their bodies that the other senses tend to shut down (happens to me all the time).

3) Never take anything personally: whatever someone says, does, or projects on you is not personal. They are playing out their own dramas etc. from within.

4)Always do your best: Your best will be different from day to day and from moment to moment. You and he are always doing your best, so just be aware of that and don't judge him or yourself.

Take a moment and re-read your post. It seems to me that the past you are most upset about is not his at all, but yours. Remember, the past is not a thing...it doesn't exist other than a memory. Let it go, it was exactly the way it was supposed to be. Live in the moment, because the past is death...it's dead, it cannot bring any joy or change, just pain and/or desire to go back or change it. If you really need to change your past or his, just make up a new one...the made up one is just as real/unreal and the one you remember.

DOn't forget to love yourself...your husband does.

Love to you both.

Scott.

PS - Most guys have been to strip clubs...it's really no big deal.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
In reply to: onmyown3
Tue, 08-10-2004 - 1:15pm
I do look at him when we make love. He never looks back. How is that supposed to help any insecurities I have? It only hurts them. How can I not be insecure when the only two men I've loved have lied to me? One picture I have in my head is of my former husband with his lover instead of me. Now I have a picture of my current lover hooping and hollering at naked women who are far more attractive and sexual than I am. I want my insecurities to go away and I try. But it seems I just keep having setbacks due to selfish men in my life. I'm just ready to be alone.
iVillage Member
Registered: 05-27-2004
In reply to: onmyown3
Tue, 08-10-2004 - 2:40pm
Your "setbacks" are because YOU refuse to move on. This man is NOT your ex husband, and I'm sure that he didn't LIE as much as he kept his mouth shut, and it's too bad he ever opened it. It's NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS what he did before he met you! Do you think that all men in the world must keep themself pure, just in case they might meet you?

If he doesn't look at you during sex, it's probably because he doesn't want to see the anger in your eyes! What are you supposed to think when he doesn't look at you? NOTHING. Some men and women keep their eyes closed during sex....so what?

Maybe you are meant to be alone, if you're making such a big issue out of what it essentially NOTHING in a man's past. Again, I don't understand why it was ok to drink and party at college....do you honestly think there's no sex during the drinking parties? If you do, you're deluding yourself. You think that's ok, but it's some horrid earth shattering behavior to go to a place that essentially allows a man to LOOK, but NOT TOUCH!

I will repeat what I said before, GET PROFESSIONAL HELP, because your feelings are NOT rational. You cannot blame all men for what your ex did to you. If you continue like this you WILL be alone. No man is going to put up with this kind of carrying on!

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-15-2003
In reply to: onmyown3
Tue, 08-10-2004 - 3:01pm
Dear OMO,

Your insecurities are not because your husband has a past. You are insecure because you are insecure. Essentially you are upset over a story...something that doesn't exist. If you do not take responsibility for your feelings you will be a victim forever. There is no one that does not have a past...no one. There is no man that has not seen a naked woman. There is no human being on the planet that is pure and perfect. You are asking him to change something that he can never change...his past. Nor can you change yours. You can't change what your ex husband did, you can't change that you didn't go to school. You can only change your perception of it...that's it. Don't get stuck in this idea that other people cause feelings within you. Your husband looked at some strippers before you were married. If that causes the feelings of insecurity that you are having, than it would cause those same feelings in everyone. What causes feelings is your interpretation of the events. You've made a story out of this. You've made him looking at a naked woman before you were married some kind of reflection about you (if I were married to you and knew how insecure you were, I wouldn't tell you about my past either)...step outside this rage and for just a moment consider how completely illogical that is.

As Greenteabag said, if this is such a blow to your self-esteem that you are willing to throw away a relationship, you need to see a counselor and you need to see them now. You need to work on yourself, because this is NOT about him or anything that he did in his past. This is about you. This is about letting go of the past, his past and your past. THat means letting go of the anger and hatred of your ex-husband (forgiveness), that means letting go of regrets about school, it means letting go of the idea that life "should" have been different...it wasn't different. Can you see that your obsessive worrying about the past is poisoning your present? The present is all that there is and you are missing it...don't miss it. Find a way to move one. See a psychologist...but don't miss out on life and love because you are stuck in the past, in the case of his past, it's a past that you weren't even involved in.

Good luck.

Scott.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
In reply to: onmyown3
Tue, 08-10-2004 - 4:24pm
I agree with your responses and those of greentea and you are probably right that these are all my insecurities and I need help with them. I regret so much in my life and to know that others had one that I always wanted because of mistakes I've made is something I need to get over. He absolutely has no idea about these insecurities, as we haven't discussed this issue since my finding out. He thinks I'm as strong as an ox. He has no idea my feelings about this so our lack of eye contact while making love has nothing to do with this. Actually we haven't been together since my finding out two days ago. I'll seek help, but it doesn't mean I have to like that he did it. I'm still devastated mainly because he lied. I'm glad there are women out there who could care less, but I have feelings about strip clubs and those who go to them. I guess my father respected my mother more than most men respect their significant others. That is how I was raised. Maybe I have too many hangups. My brother played college baseball and the bus would take them to clubs and bars and allow them to leave with women for awhile and come back. My brother is definitely not a prude, he's had several women, but we were raised by the same parents and he knew it was wrong, so he didn't act. Mutual respect for your loved ones is something I treasure. I've decided that noone can make this decision for me and thank you for your responses. I will take them all to heart. But at the moment, I realize that morally, we differ. What we did in our past makes us who we are now. I could never trust him. I could never give you all the details of our lives in such a short message so I realize it is hard for you to pass judgement. I respect that you were able to decipher what you did out of my message and give me the best advice that you could. It was all good and I realize that my problem is MINE. So, out of respect for him, I will allow him to find someone who has a similar background and they can enjoy telling all the things they did in their pasts. It is obviously fun to talk and be proud of and I don't want to hold him back. I'm sure he would love to hear all the stories about his girlfriends trips to guy strip clubs when she was younger. He seemed pretty proud of himself. I'm a little too boring.
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
In reply to: onmyown3
Tue, 08-10-2004 - 5:05pm
So I'm confused about why you posted here. Greenteabag gave you wonderful advice. Sounds like you already had your mind made up that he is a scum bag because he looked at naked chicks in a club. Big whoop.

What did you want us to say? That he must be a real sicko for enjoying looking at naked girls? Sorry but I think it all sounds completely normal. Actually pretty tame.

Also, your past doesn't "make you who you are." I've done things in my past that have nothing to do with the person that I am now. Good and bad.

Your issues are way bigger than you current man looking at boobs 20 years ago. You need professional help with your low self esteem and getting over the poor life choices that YOU made in your life. Really, I am not saying that in a mean way. I really do think you should get help, it'll change your life.

Sara

Avatar for luvmylittleones
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-25-2003
In reply to: onmyown3
Tue, 08-10-2004 - 5:10pm
I agree with everything greenteabag said and wanted to add that I think the OP needs some time out of relationships to work through these problems.

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