Men think the world revolves around them

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-01-2006
Men think the world revolves around them
16
Wed, 02-22-2006 - 10:17pm

I've been accused in the past of being a workaholic so at age 40, never married, I set about sticking to specific work hours (starting at 8am and getting home no later than 7pm, no lunch, and working flex hours from home on weekends) so that I could have my evenings free. Even though I work in the suburbs, I also elected to stay in Manhattan to facilitate dating (a rather expensive proposition, I might add). I have been spending upwards of 20 hours per week dating in addition to this rather demanding work schedule.

Now I must take some time off from dating and going out to meet new people because I am very busy at work for the next month (I will also be working weekends at work, not at home, 1 hr commute each way). I'm finding a guy that I'm dating currently keeps calling me at the last minute...last time he called was Sunday 1pm to go out to brunch that day...but I was at work and planning on spending the rest of the day there, possibly into the evening hours. I told him later in the week would be better, and the following AM I emailed him and told him Thursday evening would work, re-emphasizing that it was a busy week, and thanking him for inviting me to brunch even though I couldn't make it. Just to be on the safe side I also responded in great detail to his earlier email requesting some medical advice (I do medical research) and I also forwarded him an amusing article that was pertinent to a previous conversation and additionally sent him a text about Thursday...so he wouldn't think I was blowing him off (possibly...overkill??)

Suddenly now he is very vague. Although he thanked me a lot for the med advice, Thursday won't work, although he doesn't have any set plans (just helping a friend move one day this week). He was polite, but it was obvious he was a little put out, if you can believe. I feel like despite my very best efforts, even if I have a short, intense period at work (I'm working against a specific deadline, then things get back to normal, and he knows this) I lose out because I have a career that matters to me, and I can't just drop everything and go out. I usually plan social activities days in advance but I find once guys in particular get to know me better (not so much my female friends, who tend to want to plan things in advance too), they relax and feel like last minute is acceptable. Again, I'm feeling like I'm being pigeonholed as a workaholic and I really try so hard to balance everything now...but I just can't win!!

Anyway, if anyone in a similar situation has any ideas, I'd appreciate it. I'm exasperated right now, and also way behind on my work fretting about this stuff. Seriously thinking about changing careers...but I love this one. Waaah. I guess life has to be about choices but somehow everyone at work with this crazy schedule got married or has significant others. Mostly men though. A lot of the women are single now come to think of it. I don't mean to sound sexist, but the evidence is all around me. Is it that men are less flexible or that women are expected to be moreso? I mean, these guys must be getting positively reinforced for this last minute stuff by women, otherwise they wouldn't keep doing this. Is it possible I will never win?

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iVillage Member
Registered: 10-27-2005
Fri, 02-24-2006 - 5:15pm
Clarification: I am not generalizing about the whole male gender: I am just sharing experiences with certain men I have met; hence the "Tough luck, guys"! " phrase, which only refers to the guys I have met... Sorry, didn't know how to edit my post.Thanks!
iVillage Member
Registered: 01-01-2006
Fri, 02-24-2006 - 8:51pm

Yes, when I said it was "crunch time" for me, he replied that it should be also crunch time for him, since he's running out of money, but he doesn't seem to be doing anything about it. Adding to this problem is that he is bipolar (diagnosed 20 yrs ago) and currently on meds, so I am realizing now as I read through some websites on bipolar that I might have to take his behavior with the territory and just hang loose a little.

I'm not losing out on anything b/c he says he's really not ready for a relationship right now due to his illness and the resultant financial situation...which I agree with, and he knows I date other people, and he's cool with that. But interestingly, we still carry on like we are in puppy love with each other (just without the physical stuff). We have very intimate conversations and it's clear we enjoy each others' company...

So the main point of response to you is that he is def comparing himself to me and feeling down. It may be a good thing though...in a way I feel like without prodding him too much, I am prodding him by setting some sort of example. But really he badly needs to talk to a therapist, that's the bottom line...to get things moving again. He has a couple of high school friends in town he's still in touch with...I wonder why they aren't steppping up to the plate?? It may need to be me...

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-01-2006
Fri, 02-24-2006 - 9:26pm

OK, let me explain more, b/c this is not a typical relationship...

We have together decided not to get physical yet, mainly his choice, which I agree with, b/c he is in the throes of a bipolar depression and out of work, although he's on meds and when he's with me, seems very happy. In fact, I relayed a bad dating experience to him and he was comforting me!! We have been seeing each other on and off for 2 months and it's really a unique relationship for me...we are basically in love with each other but he can't express it physically or is afraid to I think b/c he has been bipolar for 20 yrs and knows himself well enough that now is not the time to get deeply involved with someone...but he is really so caring and sensitive, not something I take lightly. He says he just has an inability to plan ahead (I'm reading now, common in bipolar depression). This post I know sharply contrasts with my first post b/c I'm realizing I can't generalize with this guy and I've been subsequently doing a little reading on BPD.

We have discussed all the relationship type stuff...his choice of conversational topic, not mine...we both agree that someone should stay at home with kids, (I tend to be kind of traditional that way, and would be willing to take time off work) and much to my surprise he said he thought so too, and would be willing to play that role b/c he has so much difficulty holding a job!!! That knocked me for a loop. I had never considered that option, and also, I was thinking...this is kind of a deep conversation for such a casual relationship!!! Whoa!! I've gone out with guys in regular old sexual relationships for twice as long and never even *approached* this depth of intimacy (we're talking about kids????)

But I would feel better if he had some sort of structure in his life...he needs it, he's so analytical. I don't know what the answer is, except what I said to gingersnapple....that the current dire $$ situation of his + me working a lot is getting him down. Clearly he needs some therapy (his shrink doesn't believe in it, just gives him meds). I suggested seeing a rabbi or something and agrees with me wholeheartedly. He has 2 very good high school friends here who are not stepping up to the plate so I'm thinking NYC is replete with free social services, I should look into something and even maybe offer to go with him to the place since he can't seem to get it togther to go on his own....sigh. He's really a nice guy, I know I painted him as a jerk in my earlier post but I'm realizing he just can't help it right now...honestly. It's IS all about him right now, for him, and at least he has the decency to recognize that that wouldn't do in a 'real' relationship, unlike a lot of less self-reflective guys I know!!! Guess if I want to remain friends with him I have to take this kind of behavior with the territory.

I often play this role, helping people out in situations where others might just not want to bother...and I'm pretty good at it b/c I can compartmentalize more than most. Anotherwords I've been successful in helping people help themselves. I'm not sure this one can help himself though...needs more than just a pep talk. But right now it's all about me and my head cold and this grant I'm trying to write, unfortunately. And he hasn't called, emailed or texted so whatever. Hopefully he's out having fun and not sitting at home ruminating...I feel like he wants me to leave him alone until he's ready to call me, but after reading about BPD that's exactly what not to do as a friend...so confused. I'll probably just let him be.

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-01-2006
Fri, 02-24-2006 - 9:52pm

No I totally agree. Ultimately, I usually dis the guy that makes such suggestions...that I do less rigorous work to accommodate his career. To me that's kind of an old-fashioned view. Usually it's the older guys who are like that and I'm not attracted to them. Guys 45 yo and younger don't seem to be this way...at least that's what they say.

I'm thinking now that with this guy I have a unique situation, since he's out of work and struggling with his own demons. In a way, I may remind him of his younger sister, who does well financially and in life is very successful, and is a constant source of irritation to him. He feels like she got off scott free, since his parents were divorced when he was only 5 yo and his biological mother was apparently very erratic to live with and he left to live with his father at age 12 (what a choice), and his Dad then remarried (someone normal, I take it) and had the sister and her life was comparatively smooth sailing.

Subseqently he was diagnosed w/ bipolar depression and is currently taking meds fine and with meds managed to go to good schools through the Masters level (Harvard no less) and is clearly quite gifted both intellectually and artistically (plays piano). But cannot seem to hold a job at the moment, and compares his plight to his sister's rosy life, as well as to my rosy life. So sorry I came to that conclusion after thinking about it for a bit, this board helps me to think things out, but I realize I didn't tell a complete story in my first post.

In the sciences...yes I'm thinking about it more...it is SO COMMON to see women in science holding academic posts in the same department as their husbands...it's the only way they would see each other!

However I notice another interesting trend, that women seem to do fine w/ family aspects if they manage to get engaged or married BEFORE they finish grad school. Something, obviously, I can't go back and do now. Sigh. Then right before they finish their graduate work in the lab for the dissertation...oops! Got pregnant! And their mentor facilitates a hasty exit, and they write their dissertation while on 'maternity leave' (usually for a year or more). Great plan, right? Although they tend to dump the kid in day care ASAP (something I couldn't bring myself to do...ever).

My noble plan was always to take off 5 years as soon as the kid's born, take out loans or whatever it takes to swing it (well, most people take out loans to go to school, so why not for your kid) and then embark on a career in scientific writing once the kid's going to kindergarten during the day (I love writing too). But nobody's sold on my plan as much as I am, obviously.

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-01-2006
Mon, 02-27-2006 - 8:39pm

OK, update: he texted me today with a theater ticket he can't use, he wants me to go to a show with his woman friend in place of him (another attempt to find me a female friend, nice).

As it turns out I've already seen this particular show, but intrigued, I call him anyway...the explanation is he can't go b/c he's sick and she's pregnant and afraid of contracting the plague from him. Well of course I am sick too, so we trade symptoms, etc.

He says he's going on a job interview tomorrow and wants to get together sometime soon. He always says things like, "Gee, we haven't seen each other in a while", in a wistful tone.

This is a bright boy, I wonder when the lightbulb is going to go off in making the connection between him calling me at the last minute and me never seeming to be available at the last minute!!???

To give some perspective, he overslept his last job interview...and it was at 5pm. OK, enough said, I will have to spell it out or buy him a day planner or both.

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-01-2006
Sat, 03-04-2006 - 2:03pm

So next episode...he never gives up...

Friday night, 6:30 pm he's calling to see if I want to go to a 9 or 10pm movie, I cave...

OK fine, I say...how about Transamerica (no), how about History of Violence (OK)...he says how about 16 blocks (no), how about Paradise Now (OK)...so he says he'll look up History of Violence and Paradise Now while I am on my way home from work.

Paradise Now not playing anymore, but History of Violence is, he reports, calling me at 8:15pm, when I am home just out of the shower. However 8:30pm he calls back, and, typical of Manhattan on a Friday night, it's sold out. It's only playing in one theater now (since it's a special run due to its Oscar nomination).

He says, do you have any other suggestions? Me, with my hair sopping wet and no clothes on yet, reply, I haven't looked at the listings lately...you don't have anything else you want to see? He says no...so I'm like, how about tomorrow night? He says he has a party to go to...and I have a date with another guy Sunday (but I just said I had PLANS...heheh), so he says he's tired anyway, so let's just play it by ear.

I congratulate him on his new job (he's starting Monday) and start to say goodbye, and he's like, if you get a SECOND WIND, and find a movie you do want to see TONIGHT, please give me a call...I'm like, I'm not the one who's tired...it's just this is so last minute...can we really make a movie now? I mean, nothing good's playing (I've seen like every good movie, pretty much, and some really bad movies have been coming out lately), he's East side, I'm West side, at 8:45pm, how are we going to get tix, get there in time, get seats together? He is late for stuff often...I don't know, I just don't operate that way.

We each feel totally dejected and sad, say goodnight, I continue to blowdry my hair, sighing...I send him a movie idea later around 11pm that night, knowing full well he's not going to respond to it. I've got to talk to him about the last minute stuff...this totally sucks!! This is the 4th time he's asked me out at the last minute in the past month...haven't seen him for a month...you might think he would get the message, although I'm not intentionally sending a 'message'...he really just always catches me at a bad time or it just doesn't work out...

Whenever I've suggested getting together at a specific time, he can't make it, and prefers to leave it open...so tried that already...I'm really just ranting, I know what I need to do, talk to him about planning ahead and then just let it be. I don't think it's that unusual...needing more than 2 hrs notice to do something...but I guess since he has a lot of friends, other people must be able to swing it...

I just need to ask, am I that weird? Is this a weird request? All of my friends plan ahead...it's just kind of second nature to us. I don't know how to get into good restaurants and good movies in this town at the last minute...it just doesn't happen. Am I spoiled? Also, even though we aren't dating, I like to look nice when I go out. The work I do involves working with small animals, so I need to take a shower when I get home. Even though I often wear scrubs, still the dust and stuff gets in my hair...I can't go out like that!! Sigh sigh sigh.

UPDATE a while later...

He just called and totally APOLOGIZED for his inappropriate behavior asking me out at the last minute!! No prompting from me...just figured it out on his own!! It's always better this way, I hate like heck to have to tell people stuff like this b/c I figure if they really wanted to be a certain way voluntarily, they would...he says he does a lot of things last minute with some of his friends, but not all...some prefer planning ahead. He said he sensed I was a little upset last night...good...I wasn't even that bad so he must be pretty sensitive...good...so we set a date for later this week for a movie I want to see, and he sounds interested in...all good...

Of course I totally thanked him for calling...I'm so relieved...I can't tell you.

Edited 3/4/2006 2:57 pm ET by goddess_juju




Edited 3/4/2006 3:03 pm ET by goddess_juju

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