What are the chances??

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-19-2004
What are the chances??
17
Mon, 09-20-2004 - 2:52am
I am soooo confused. And I feel too old and a little stupid...ok, ALOT stupid...to be in this situation. I am 40. He is 29. I knew his parents fairly well through a professional relationship. I adored his Dad like he was my own. Then, I met HIM. It is such a long story. But in essence, I couldn't tell him how I felt because I was working for him. And then I ended the professional relationship rather abruptly because I thought the situation was hopeless. (I left him a note that basically said, "something came up." I didn't leave him in the lurch. We were done with the work.) But I couldn't stand seeing him all the time and not being able to say anything. So I left. Maybe it was the absurdity of the situation. Maybe it was PMS. I don't know. Not too professional but the emotions were overwhelming at the time. Well, when I left I forgot a few of my things at his house (where I was working) that were irreplacable. (Family heirlooms that would be of no use or interest to him. Sentimental value, not monetary value.) It took me three months to finally call him to get them back. I left him a message at home when I knew he would be working and asked him to mail them back and I would reimburse him. No response. Three weeks after that, I called and left another message explaining that the items were irreplaceable and I really would appreciate it if he could send them back with a bill for shipping for which I would reimburse him. (IE: It would have taken him 2 minutes to throw the items in an envelope and it would have cost about $5.00 to return them priority mail.) Still no response. Three weeks later, I called and left another message with my Federal Express number and asked him to please return the items. (I was very nice in all three calls.) I finally got a call back from him saying he got the messages and he would return the items and that I didn't need to call him again. (He was very pissy.) So...three weeks passed. Still nothing. Finally, I decided to call him at work directly and talk to him. I got him on the phone and told him I wanted to come over and pick up my things. He was really nice...I think because I caught him off guard. And he said he would be happy to leave a key for me and I could stop by and get my stuff the next day. As I had decided perhaps I needed to finally fess up and tell him why I left, I asked him if he was going to be home, I would just swing by and get them. He said sure. I was so nervous, but I went over late the next night. (Almost chickening out.) He was really nice when I first got there. He offered to show me around at all the changes he made in the house, etc. I declined politely, I was just too nervous and wanted to get it over with. He went up to get my stuff, came down with it, then disappeared into the kitchen while I was talking to him. So I waited. When he came out, I started to talk a little about my leaving. And he kept walking away. He was uncomfortable I think. And then he'd come back and started talking a little. (I know he wasn't cooking. He doesn't cook. I know he wasn't eating. I had been in the kitchen when I first got there.) Well...Before I could even say much, we got into an argument. Actually, he yelled at me and asked me why I was trying to start an argument. (I wasn't. I just asked him why he didn't mail my stuff back. Nicely, not maliciously.) I honestly think he did it on purpose because he was mad that I left, and I thought that would prompt me to explain. But instead...we got into this big argument. And I ended up picking up my stuff while he just stood about 15 feet away at the end of the hallway and watched me walk out the door. I said, "Say hello to your parents," and left. I sat in his driveway for a couple of minutes in awe. I just can not believe, I came over to finally tell him how I felt and before we even got anywhere near the topic, we ended up in a big fight. I don't get it. And I can't believe it happened. Anyway...a few months later, under some really weird circumstances, I had a personals ad placed on-line. I thought I needed to get over this. I had been thinking about it and thinking about it. And I needed a diversion, so I placed an ad. NO WAY would he have known it was me. And what are the odds?? We live in a major metropolitan area. And HE responded to MY ad. (I KNEW it was him immediately even without a picture!! I didn't have one posted either.) And I was right, out of the thousands of people on line. It was him. I was so surprised. He just never struck me as the kind of guy who would respond to an ad. But I never let on it was me. And when we exchanged photo's I distorted mine so it was fuzzy and you couldn't tell it was me. So...We talked for a couple of months before I finally told him it was me. I was feeling guilty, plus he wanted me to call him. FOR SURE, he would know it was me then. Anyway, he was shocked. And then I told him how I had felt, and why I left, etc. And he said. "Wow. Don't worry about it. No biggie." I could have died. "NO BIGGIE??" I alienated his entire family, had been driving myself nuts over it for months and that's his reaction?? I was upset. And I told him exactly what I thought of his reaction in an e-mail. And of his attitude in general. And we haven't spoken since. Problem is, I still think about him. That was 8 months ago, and I just can't seem to move on. It feels like "unfinished business." I feel awful over losing the friendship of his parents in the process. I feel awful the way things ended up. I never see him or his family. And the chances of us running into each other are slim but possible I guess. Hey!! He answered my very annonymous ad. My question...What would you do if you were me?? I can't seem to move on. It just feels like a mess. And I hate the idea that I know now his parents, who I respected and loved, will never speak to me again because of all this. And worse yet, I still want this guy. I KNOW, that the law of the world says to forget it. But I also know that every situation has some hope. And I have heard of relationships starting out on a worse note. But how do I proceed?? Why didn't he return my stuff?? How can I mend the relationship with his family?? WHAT AM I GOING TO DO?? Please help.

Pages

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Mon, 09-20-2004 - 10:02am
elle55407...

Pianoguy thinks you've played this scenerio out to the max...AND NEED TO DROP IT!!!

It's clear that the relationship the 2 of you might have had together WON'T happen. You might have had a bond with his family at one point...but it's no longer there. The man YOU are crazy about...DEFINITELY ISN'T CRAZY ABOUT YOU!

As a matter of fact, your over-aggressiveness might be making him a little paranoid whenever you're in sight? I suppose you could blame PMS? But frankly...men are powerless when a woman goes through this "chemical experience!" It scares us! We don't know how to respond or even if we should. All we want to do is keep our distance from you until everything subsides!

But the most important issue is this:

The man you've been "in love" with...doesn't want to return your feelings!

Please find yourself a hobby, take an enrichment course, or do some volunteer work. You need to do something to release that 'excessive adrenlin' from inside your system!

Pianoguy

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-19-2004
Mon, 09-20-2004 - 12:42pm
Thanks for the note. However, kindly define "over agressiveness?" I don't get how you would consider my actions "over agressive." He had no clue how I felt until the final e-mail, months after I went over there. So....one e-mail is overly agressive? I wasn't calling him for romantic reasons or to see him again. He had my grandparents wedding photos. (originals) If I had been calling him to hook up, I could understand your statement. But that was never the case. I gave him easy opportunity to mail them back to me. Three times over a nearly two month period. (WHY would you not send back someone elses wedding photos?) The point is, I didn't want to see him again. I wanted to get over it. Hence, I asked him to mail them, not call me or drop them off.

Personally, I think it's almost the opposite. Had I let on how I felt without trying to maintain a professional ethic to begin with, I wouldn't have fallen apart in the end. I would have known in person if he was for sure feeling the same and moved on from there.

But I would still like you to point out what I did that was overly aggressive? Besides the fact that I eventually went over to get the photos instead of rely upon him to mail them...which I think we can both agree was pretty unreliable. That's the part that's sticking with me. Sorry, but it is. Not like I'm planning to call him. It just bothers me as to why he never returned them to begin with. That's what I asked about. (That and repairing the relationship with his parents. But...mainly that.) And if I could get a solid answer, maybe I would stop thinking about it.

While I am sure your quip about getting a hobby was meant constructively, I would have to interject that, you don't know me. But idle time is not my problem.

Elle

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-19-2004
Mon, 09-20-2004 - 3:09pm
One more thing, pianoguy. I guess I didn't explain my "PMS" excuse very well. I left the house BEFORE he came home so he WOULDN'T see me in that emotional state. My fear was, if I didn't leave before he walked in the door, I might do something embarrassing like start to cry, which was what I was already doing when I realized the mess I was in, or worse yet, let on to him how I was feeling. So your huge scenerio on the PMS issue is really unprecidented. He had no clue it might have been PMS. I left him a polite and courteous note instead of subjecting him. (We left each other notes frequently, so not too odd, I guess.) I basically said, I had finished up early...which was true. And that something came up so I couldn't wait around to say goodbye personally. But I thanked him for letting me come in and work. And told him if he had any comments or questions about any of the work I had done, he could certainly give me a call. All EXTREMELY professional, except I did leave without saying goodbye personally. But after hearing your comments about how men feel about a woman during PMS, I'm now glad that was the decision I made at the time.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Mon, 09-20-2004 - 4:43pm
Elle, there are a lot of men (including myself) that do not want to mix business/professional relationships with personal relationships. In his specific case this might be even moreso given your professional dealings with his dad. We will essentially contain and restrict our interest in these circumstances. In my line of business I have a number of female associates and clients. Its a line that I choose not to cross. If you were a professional associate or client of mine, you could be the most wonderful woman in the world - but I still would not cross that line as its my professional integrity that is at stake and I take that very seriously.

There is another point that I think many women miss. When dealing with a man there are 2 key parts - him as a person, and his agenda & timing. Many women will become attracted to the "person" yet fail to consider what is going on with his "agenda & timing". For a true connection to occur with forward progress, BOTH must be in synch. So with him, something is missing in one or both of these parts along with the professional association aspect.

I have no idea why he took so long to return your things. It doesn't make sense to me at all and I can't figure out any reasonable reason for him to do so. Sorry, I just don't know how to address that part of the issue at all. I'm stumped there.

When you went to get your things and talk, he probably noticed something different in your attitude. We men can often see that something is different or wrong but we do have a hard time in figuring out what exactly it is. Maybe he figured out that you do have an interest in him and he was trying to find a way to ignore it so that he wouldn't have to deal with a sensitive topic face-to-face and risk your association across his family. Being 29 he may not have had the maturity to deal with it. I'm 43 and I'm not sure how I would have dealt with it as I don't like to create turmoil in other people's lives.

Then you hook up again over a date site/internet site. The truth is as soon as you figured out it was him you should have said something rather than stringing things along. Sorry to say this but you made matters worse by altering your picture. When the real truth came out, he may have come to the conclusion that he was played to some degree.

Bottom line is that there is a mismatch in interest and agenda/timing between the two of you. This is very common and not something to take personally at all. There is a positive in all of this - you have a great learning experience that can be applied to your future. Keep your eyes and ears open for both the "person" and the "agenda & timing" for your future prospects and interests.

I wish you well.

ps. I received your email and wanted to respond to you here. Have an awesome day!

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-19-2004
Mon, 09-20-2004 - 5:05pm
Thanks for the input spice.man. The maturity thing I have considered before. I am sure I probably threw him for a loop. But you made a couple of points I never considered. The biggest one was how unfair I was in "playing him" on-line. You're right. It never occurred to me, but that's what I did. Though not on purpose. I honestly thought it was just an opportunity for me to ask him things I couldn't ask him before. I never meant to let it go further than that. But when he pushed me...I felt I had to fess up. Which I think in retrospect was really stupid. Now that I think about it, that wasn't very nice of me. I can see that now.

Though I do wish someone could answer the question about why he never returned my stuff. He's actually incredibly motivated, organized, etc. A bit of an over-achiever. Which makes it all the more confusing. And to be honest, that one issue alone is at the root of my thoughts. It was my intention to walk away and never think about it again. That's why I left. So the fact that I felt like I had to go over there if I ever wanted to see my things again really made me wonder about it. If I had been in his shoes, and wanted nothing to do with me...or at the very least, wanted to stop the phone calls...I would have dropped them in the mail immediately, just to get me off his back.



Anyone reading this who could give me a clue about the unreturned possessions, would contribute to my peace of mind immensely.

Thanks again, spice!! I appreciate your well thought out answer and insight.

Elle.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Mon, 09-20-2004 - 6:48pm
elle55407...

Pianoguy's only "guess" as to why he didn't return your stuff sooner was because the man was 'caught up in his work' and possibly involved with other activities that prevented him from sending your stuff back.

Was this careless and thoughtless...absolutely! But you eventually retrieved your possessions.

I still get the impression that your "personality" (or perhaps your attitude) was something that the man DIDN'T WANT TO DEAL WITH...so he ignored you.

Pianoguy

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-19-2004
Mon, 09-20-2004 - 8:25pm
Well. I don't really agree, but I am trying to figure this out. Why are you now putting "personality" in quotation marks. Before you said I was being aggressive, which you never did explain. Now it's my "personality" and attitude?? I am just asking because I really want to know what you mean by these things you are pointing out may be the problem. We knew each other for two years. I was hired to do some extended work for him TWICE, because he liked me AND my work. (5 years with his parents and extended family.) We got along. So, I am not sure I understand what you think I did to prompt him into holding my pictures hostage. Please explain. Or explain the aggressive thing. If I sound pushy to you, it's because you are a stranger on-line trying to help me out and not explaining your answer too well. I was not pushy with him. When you like someone like that, no matter what age, you tend to walk softly. Anyway...Please be specific. What didn't he want to deal with? He didn't have to talk to me. Just drop them in the mail. I would have never called him again. I didn't want to call him to begin with.
iVillage Member
Registered: 12-23-2003
Mon, 09-20-2004 - 8:40pm

He didn't return your things because it probably seemed like a big imposition on his time, especially after you abruptly quit your job.

 Start

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-19-2004
Mon, 09-20-2004 - 9:05pm
Technically, it wasn't a JOB like you go in and punch a time clock. More like a plumber would consider a "job". When it's finished, it's finished. I doubt a plumber would have hung around to wait for the homeowner and say they were done and goodbye to them, either. I WAS finished. I thought it was unprofessional of me because I would have normally waited. I think. HE MOVED my things, which I didn't realize until I got home and found out they weren't in my box. I left my stuff there, because I did not know that it wasn't where I had personally left it. And I never bothered to scour the house. And this was not a JOB per say, I was at his HOUSE working. "The BOSS?" He is the only one who lived there. Who else could I have talked to about getting my stuff back? Based on our relationship, I assume he was taken aback and thought it was a little abrupt. Probably insulted. But thanks for your input.

Do you think his parents will ever talk to me again? Seems like such a small thing to happen to alienate friends you've known for 5 years. I don't know why they would be sucked into this as well, but apparently they were. And I have not heard from them since. (Yes. We all talked on a friendly basis, off the record of work stuff too.)

iVillage Member
Registered: 12-23-2003
Mon, 09-20-2004 - 9:47pm

Ok, I did not understand that you were not a real "employee"... but more of a home repair serviceperson.

 Start

Pages