women's 2 cents needed
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| Thu, 03-11-2004 - 10:43pm |
After much frustration,I figured I better come right to the source to get my answers.
The reason I am here requires some explanation, so here goes. I'm almost 40, divorced a few years ago, have 2 kids, nice house, job, all that kind of stuff(read: not a deadbeat or unemployed, etc.) Here's where I thought y'all might jump on this one: I am also completely frustrated with my lack of dating success over the last couple of years.
I have been called drop dead handsome many times, I am in great physical shape, but I cannot seem to date even marginally consistently. We are talking probably less than 10 dates in approximately 3 years. I would consider myself to be on the shy side, but by no means an introvert or a wall flower, so I'm not really one to just wantonly walk up to anyone on the street and strike up a conversation. I think the problem is deeper than that. What I have found is I think women look right past me all the time. It didn't really bother me or get on my nerves for quite a long time, but there's only so much rejection and total ambivalence a guy can take before he has to take a good hard look at himself. I say hi to women at the gym, at the store, at the mall, at bars, etc.. Most times I just get this look back of complete disinterest rather than a smile that says she'd like to talk to me.
I dress very nicely when i'm out so I know how to put myself together.
So, I have narrowed it down to a couple of things:
I know there's a million answers, but what does a guy do to have some sex appeal? I have a couple of friends who I go out with alot(guys) and women are always hitting on them, leaving notes on their car, writing little messages on business cards or the check when we go out to eat, stuff like that. I don't think i've been 'hit on' more than maybe once in the last 2,3 years that way.
Second--if any of you can remember, what has a guy said and done to-pardon the phrase- pick you up in various places?
gym?
restaurant or bar?
grocery store?
mall?
on the street?
any other place?
I have heard the old standbys many many times like being yourself and being confident, etc.. but for whatever reason that's not working. I have a lot to be proud so I don't really have a confidence problem, and as far as being myself, well, I have been and my results have been poor at best, so there has to be something in the delivery or something? for instance if i'm at a bar at a table with my friends enjoying myself, how would a woman know I wasn't confident or myself..all she'd have to go on is how I look from across the room. that boils down to raw appeal right?
all input is very much appreciated!

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I say this because I have a girlfriend who is drop dead gorgeous, size 6 perfect, beautiful skin, eyes, dressed more than stylish and even has a brain and personality to booT....yeah..sometimes I hate her!..lol. She NEVER got dates but lil ol average me had no problems. We would go out for drinks and guys would look at her, not make eye contact and not come over. She couldn't figure it out. Soooo, I told her I thought she was too intimidating! Next time, I dressed her! In a pair of jeans and just a nice normal sweater. Her hair was long and just looked normal instead of all curled,etc. Her makeup was light..almost just totally natural. Walla!...guys came over. She looked more approachable and less "gee, I don't have a chance so why bother". Look in the mirror and see if this could be it. Ask some of your married friends wives. Just my opinion based on assumptions I made from your email...I could be way off.
>>or myself..all she'd have to go on is how
>>I look from across the room. that boils
>>down to raw appeal right?
It's all about EYE CONTACT. Raw appeal is secondary -- as long as you're not doing something horribly wrong in the grooming dept. (i.e. in dire need of a haircut, dire need of dental work, dire need to trim the unibrow, etc), you should be doing much better than you are.
It sounds ridiculous, but eye contact pretty much conveys all sorts of information -- and it is how women can tell how confident you are with just a glance. If you don't have "the eyes" down, you're basically flying blind -- you'll be approaching women already in relationships, women not interested in you, lesbians, etc. And the women you do approach will assume you're not confident (and thus you'll already have a strike against you). Needless to say, you'll have terrible 'odds'.
That's probably the mistake you're making.
I'd also agree with the advice women have given here - about joining clubs, etc, and I'd also add that "becoming a regular" at a certain place on a certain day is helpful too.
I'll also add that country-dancing places are fairly popular with the women (and less so with guys), so there's often an abundance of single women that hang out there (more so than other clubs/bars).
However, finding the right audience is not as important as the eye contact issue; Even where the ratio of women:men is bad, if you've got the "right eyes", you'll still be fairly successful.
- My $.02
I am definitely at a loss on how to answer that other than to say thank you(really) for even considering something along those lines. I am confident enough in my own appearance to know i'm an attractive guy, but I would not consider myself in the type of category you have described. Of all things, one thing I honestly don't project is being completely aloof that way. Yes, my women friends have very flattering things to say about me(thats what friends are for right?), but honestly thats not whats happening here. They know what I want, the type of person i'm really looking for, and know that I hold people to high standards, but all that kind of thing is really way down the road..i'm just having a devil of a time actually getting past Hi how are you at this point.
I'll let you in on a secret here, and that is if I see really stunning women around here and there, I do the same thing..why bother? I would be intimidated by a serious bombshell now matter where I was..thats the shy guy in me. The initial contact is a really difficult thing for me to do, after that its smooth sailing, on the rare occasions that it has happened.
I'll take this another step then too..IF there was anything like what you have suggested going on, why do people just stare at me blankly when I say hi while i'm getting coffee or in the produce section or at the gym? I know if a really beautiful girl, or really any girl that I thought was attractive said something nice to me that way I'd reciprocate with some sort of response that would open the door for something beyond just hello.
I will ask my friends wives, as you have suggested. It is certainly an interesting proposition..I know its not true, but would be a very nice thing to hear I guess.
Do I look at them, hold their glance for a few seconds and see if they look away(and down), do I look back again a few minutes later and smile or wink? yes.
what else would you add to that?
When you're "scanning the room" or looking at a woman you might be interested in from across the room, if a woman "catches you looking", she will either look away very quickly, or she'll hold your gaze.
If she looks away quickly, it generally means she's not interested, not available, etc -- in other words, you have very poor odds if you approach her.
However, if she "Locks eyes with you", that's generally a good sign - and while your eyes are locked, you should SMILE. If she smiles too, you're doing good.
One of the important things about this is you should almost NEVER be the first to look away. If you're not used to this, it can be somewhat uncomfortable to do the first time. This "eye lock" can last a pretty long time (well, at least it will feel that way no more than ~10 seconds though), but the sooner you look away the less confident you will seem.
When she looks away, & she is still smiling, that basically means "You should come over & say hi within the next few minutes". After the "eye lock", you shouldn't keep looking at her -- you shouldn't be staring at her.
There are quite a few guides on the internet that explain this behavior (probably better than what I've done), but you should get the idea. What's interesting is that you can pretty much try this out anywhere -- women who are "willing to gaze into your eyes for 5+ seconds" are typically willing to at least talk to you, whether you're at a bar, the grocery store, etc.
;)
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