Clarifying Men's Actions vs. Words
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| Tue, 08-02-2005 - 2:18pm |
Hopefully this helps,
Here's the 411 on "ACTIONS SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS." So Pineapple, and all women, please listen up. This is important. There are a few crucial notes to take here. Let's examine what you just said in your previous message:
"he treats me like a queen, does anything for me, is always there for me, cares about me, etc, but he _______________ (fitb)"
~won't marry me
~can't say he loves me
~doesn't want to be with me in a r'ship way
~is willing to marry me, because I want it"
What do all 4 of those blank fill-ins have in common? Can anybody guess? Don't look ahead at my answer, just stop and look at them and think.... Let's sum those 4 up: No marriage, no verbal "I love you", no exclusivity, and will marry only if forced to. So two on marriage, one on exclusive, and one on "I love you". What do all 4 of those things apply to? Drum roll.... it's the big "C"-word ladies. Yup, commitment. Guys are big and strong and muscular (well some of us), but when it comes to committment we run for the hills.
The 2 on marriage and 1 on exclusivity are clearly saying to you exactly what you women want to hear us guys say to you, "We are committed to YOU and none other." "I love you" is just a form of saying, "I'm committed to you". Guys would rather jump in a pit of asps then commit to a woman before they are ready. Now there's the key. "BEFORE THEY ARE READY." You can force him earlier into commitment by making threats, but usually taking away sex (which is more evil than anything a woman can do) or just threatening to up and leave all together will get him to the altar, but for the wrong reason. Don't allow yourselves to do that, you are just setting your relationship/marriage up for failure. That's not a healthy way to start out something so important to you. Unfortunately you have to wait it out and just keep allowing the natural process to take it's course. You should still bring the C-word up to him etc, just don't force him into it. I know none of you women want to hear this but when it comes to commitment, guys are very sssssllllllooooooowwwwwwww......... So you have two choices: either dump him or wait for him to catch up to your level of commitment. I suggest the later, though it is hard.
Getting back to actions vs. words, just know that it IS TRUE. Sorry, I know you don't like it, and I know most women all respond more to verbal forms of love then physical. However, I believe the adage is very specific when it says, "Actions speak louder than words". The adage does not say,"Actions are the only important things to watch in a man, and therefore don't listen to a word he says." Com'on, you still gotta at least give a little validity to what he says, just not as much as his actions. Yes, his actions are more important, but they aren't the only thing. When I guys says something clear and serious to you, you need to seriously consider believing what he says. Yes, men lie. Guess what, so do women. Believe me, they lie to me everyday. It's diciphering the words with the actions that make the message clear to you.
For example, if a guy has been dating you for a while and he says, "I'm not looking for a g/f", then girl you had better believe him 100%. He wants to be FWB and nothing more. If a guy says, "I'm not ready for a commitment with you right now", that means he isn't ready to be pushed into one right now, but if things keep going well, his feelings will change. So when the relationship talk comes up, listen to what he is saying. He might stil lie or speak "man-ese" to you, but you can always ask another guy what the translation is. Plus, don't be afraid to ask a question or three when you two are talking about your relationship. Ask him what that means. You might find what you initially thought he said isn't really what he was saying.
Last key note: When you are in that moment of discussing the relationship (even if it's for 30 seconds as he is trying to sneak it by you via text message or just in passing), know this: he may be lying to you, he may be be partially lying to you, he may be trying to tell you the truth and doesn't know how, he might be speakin' man-ese, or he may be giving it to you straight up. Regardless of how much truth there is to what he is saying, remember he is definately saying something to you (in one form or another) and you had better perk up all 5 of your senses and your 6th one two before he starts, cuz believe me, it's important. Unfortunately it's your job to translate and understand (ask a guy).
However, most guys are mostly honest most of the time (no we ain't perfect, neither are women), and if he says he loves you but doesn't want a commitment, that's exactly what he means. Let me explain: I know women associate love and commitment as something that goes hand in hand, but men would love to separate the two things if they could. And they do in their head. Believe me, he does love you, he just might have feelings for somebody else too at that time. His love isn't mature enough yet. It needs to marinate over time.
Here's the key though: try not to stress about it, because if it's meant to be, then over time he will naturally be drawn to you, as you act yourself around him. Then he will add commitment to his list for things he wants with you... right under where he wrote "love" before. There is an order and timing thing to remember with guys. They love before they commit, not at the same time like women do. Sorry, we are just built that way. So do your best to just love him back and be yourself, all the while still watching out for yourself not to get hurt by him. Sorry ladies, love is a dangerous game. It involves risk like none others. If you don't risk, you can't gain anything, and that definately includes love.
-MFG

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I loved this post. and thanks for posting. I have to say, I did read somewhere about how men see things, and they basically pidgeon-hole everything, whereas, women, clump a lot of things together.
As you said, LOVE for women, include sex, intimacy, passion, desire, commitment. For me, it includes, well, LOVE. And the rest are all separate catagories. Well, hearing it frmo you, I guess it's mostly true then (can't go off of only ONE man's opinion, you understand, right?)
I just wish then, I could understand MY bf's thoughts/actions. Cuz I'm all confused. lol. But it's too in depth and too long to go into. And trust me, right now, his actions and words are all conflicting. hehehe. And yup, here's poor little me, trying to decipher it.
~pineapple_girl
I hope that everyone reading your message sees the HUGE difference between "I don't want a relationship/girlfriend/commitment/whatever" and "I don't want a relationship/girlfriend/commitment/whatever RIGHT NOW" (emphasis added). In the first instance, if a relationship is what you want, staying involved with that person, regardless of their actions, would be a mistake. In the 2nd case, you'd have to decide, "how long would I want to be with this person if he NEVER is ready to make a commitment" and then stay with him for that long and no longer (which may be no longer than you've already been with him). It is a calculated risk, because he may NEVER get to that point, and each person has to decide for themselves how long they are willing to take themselves out of the dating pool and wait.
And FWIW, not all guys are as slow as you describe to commit. It's probably more common in your age group (you're mid 20s, right?) but it's not universal. No one man can speak for all men, just like no one woman can speak for all women.
Sheri
True, I'm not every man, and I certainly can't speak for all of them. That's the disadvantage of making generalizations. There are definately exceptions to every rule AND every man.
Yes, I'm 27, and I usually start out slow in a relationship, and then as she opens up and I get to know her, then I decide as time goes on if what I'm learning about her is what I'm looking for. If it is, then my pace in the relationship is usually picked up rather quickly. More and more in fact as time goes on.
I am NOT all men, but I believe in being as open and honest as possible, but many men AND women take advantage of that a lot, so it's sometimes dangerous to be too open. I have found usually the game playing, being closed, and going slow in a relationship tend to fade as people get older. I have to get to know them before I can trust them. Trust is everything in a relationship. IMHO more important than even love. In a way, trust is love...
-MFG
Amen Midwest guy! Men are so slow to commit to anything. You have to give them time. But sometimes they do awful terrible things to their gals to indicate "back off" instead of sitting down and talking! Will men and women ever understand each other?
Hanna
http://grapevinesofunderstanding.blogspot.com
HB pie,
Hey I agree with what you said except when you said,
"But sometimes they do awful terrible things to their gals to indicate "back off" instead of sitting down and talking!"
Yes guys can be very slow (especially to commit), and they can do horrible things (they can be jerks with raging hormones and few brain cells). But usually they don't do those "awful terrible things to their gals" to indicate anything, meaning they don't do it to send a message to their girl. Usually IMHO, men do those horrible things because they are either horny, stupid, bad communicators, or all of the above. In my experience men don't usually do things just to piss their girl off or to send them a message, that's usually what women do to men and each other. Women, from where I'm standing, sometimes love to show men they don't f-ing care (but they do care, they're just getting revenge on their man) by screwing other men or something along those lines.
Men and women are both awesome and horrible at the same time. That's what makes us all human. We are capable of such beauty and yet such destruction. And yes, men and women are capable of clear harmoneous communication, but only when both the man and woman have unconditional love for each other. Until then, sometimes we will understand and other time we just won't. Both parties need to be kind, humble, and still quick to forgive, instead of lashing out when we get hurt. Sometimes though, you run across someone who is just a bad person, and you're wasting your time and love (see above) on them. Or maybe not, all people can change and loving them might help them change, but you might get seriously hurt in the process of them making those changes... but I digress...
-MFG
***The adage does not say,"Actions are the only important things to watch in a man, and therefore don't listen to a word he says." Com'on, you still gotta at least give a little validity to what he says, just not as much as his actions.****
I have a few questions/thoughts for ya. 1) How does the adage apply when contradicting actions are there, and the words follow both? 2) What thoughts do men have when they ask to be "exclusive" and should that phrase automatically change their actions? 3) What's your take on why, or how, "the talk" becomes an issue after he has asked to be "exclusive"?
IMO, I am important to him because of the time he spends with me and the daily calls he makes, however he has not introduced me to his family. Now maybe after 40 this is not an important issue, but it has me doubting what I see. I tried to bring up the subject but he interpeted it as "the talk" and he side-barred it.
Masco,
I'm a little confused as to some of the things you are asking, but I'd love to help, so please clarify. First I need more background on the relatioship: How old are both of you, how long have you been dating? Have you been intimate? Have either of you been divorced/had kids?
1.) Your first question was about contradicting actions. These are the worst to experience because it leaves you literally dazed and confused. One minute it seems like he's very into you, which makes you feel good. The next minute he doesn't seem that interested, so you are stuck wondering, "What the heck?" Men (in general) are tough like that. To really give you my opinion I'll need to know in what ways he is showing interest, and in what ways is he doing the opposite?
2.) Your 2nd question asked about thoughts men have when THEY ask to be exclusive? Wow if you got the man to ask to be exclusive first, the woman did something very right. Every woman is now very jealous of you. How did you do that? :) So you asked what are his thoughts? Ugh, I'm not sure what you are getting at here again, but his thoughts are he likes you so much he wants to be exclusive. No man is going to bring up "the talk" or ask to be exclusive for any other reason than that he really likes you. However, I'm not sure what you were exactly asking?
3.) This one confuses me the most. From what I can understand, he requested to be exclusive, but now it's become an "issue"? How and why has it become and issue? If he asked to be exclusive, is he now saying he doesn't want to be? Yikes! Definately need more info on this one.
Lastly, if he spends lots of time with you and calls you "daily" that's a big plus sign. He hasn't introduced you to his fam yet though? Hmmm... How far apart do you two live? Where do you two work? Where does his family and your family live in relation to where both of you live? I need more specifics on your relationship before I can give more specifics on my opinion. Looking forward to it.
Thanks,
MFG
So I feel funny and a lot stupid writing this, but I'm all eyes at this point.
Both 40ish; Dating less than a year, friends for several; intimate after dating; divorced/kids yes to both for both, all kids young adults.
Your reply to contradicting actions was perfect. He's a typical man and details aren't going to help because he has given me some explanations, however, the actions get messed up in my brain because I tend to overanalyze (or so I've been told by many friends).
He mentioned exclusive first - farthest thing in my mind, so yes he blew me away? I guess I expected him to continue wanting to 'talk' and I assumed that after some time I could bring up "us" (aka "the future"). One of his greatest attributes is his ablility to talk about his feelings on any subject (never knew a man who talked so well) so I didn't think "us" would be an issue after being exclusive for five months. I brought up "us/future" because I needed confirmation that I wasn't misinterpreting the contradicting actions. Although he did address/acknowledge what I was asking and my feelings, he never directly answered my main question (what role do I play in his life) and now I feel it's a taboo subject.
average 3 calls daily; see each other 3-5 times weekly. Distance from his family about 2 hours (one-way). We live about 45 min apart. FYI-my family is out of state, so no issue there.
As I type this, I'm now wondering how much 'us being friends for years' plays into this. Since being intimate, when he does talk about us he blows me away and I guess I'm having a hard time believing that he's here, he's mine and he's always been there. Maybe it's more a female self-esteem/over-anaylzing issue than his actions/words. (what a concept?)
Thanks for the reply!
When you first started dating and made the switch from being friends, did you ask him what type of relationship he was looking for in order to make sure the two of you were on the same page?
Sheri
Masco,
So he's been dating you for nearly a year, sees you plenty, calls you plenty, asked to be exclusive before you could even bring it up, and he's an all around great guy? If that is all true, you have nothing to worry about, and yes as your friends say, you are over analyzing it.
I wouldn't worry about him meeting parents still. Do your parents know him from before when you guys were just friends? Does his parents know you from before when you two were just friends? That could have something to do with the meeting the parents problem. Regardless, I think you are right about you two being just friends before having a role now in your current "more than friends" relationship. It's probably a little weird for him still, so give him some allowances for that. Plus, reread my first sentence whenever you get questionable about where the relationship is heading, because if any man is doing all of that, it's definately going in the right direction... until it gets to be so long that it's definately time to get married. If you have both been divorced and have kids, then 99% chance his going a little slow is linked to that. He of course doesn't want to go through another divorce, so maybe he wants to really take his time and really make sure there is a future here. Even though "less than a year" is enough to have a strong exclusive relationship, in many cases (not all, some people get married very quickly) it's simply not enough time to let him know if that is where this is headed.
I know that it's tough to wait and see, I myself sometimes seem to have this problem. I want to know where the relationship is and where it's going, and it's tough to just be happy were I am in the relationship. However, if I take myself out of my own shoes for a moment, and step back and try to look at the relationship objectively, I usually arrive at the same conclusion: things are going well, and there's no need for me to hurry or push things along at an unnatural pace. Maybe this doesn't apply to you, but I find myself feeling that way sometimes. Especially if I really like the woman.
Good luck.
-MFG
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