Does love conquer all?

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-19-2005
Does love conquer all?
7
Thu, 11-10-2005 - 1:17pm

If a man really loves you, would international borders or race stop him? I have a feeling I know the answer but would like to hear some opinions/stories. I have heard of women moving to the country of their lover.

I am dating a patriotic Russian, whose visa expires Dec. 1 and must leave the United States before then. If we were to continue the relationship we would have to get married to even see each other... right now that is not in our plans. For one, we have only been together for 3 months, and both of us date often so we know not to rush into things. We will both be able to date others if we desire after this episode, this is not our "last hope" though I have not felt so strongly about anyone. At first I took this as a fling since he had been an international player who women flock to. He said he likes me because it doesn't seem like I want to "possess his soul" as he says, so maybe my avoidance of "us" is good. But now he says we are lucky to have found each other and that we are a great match, that we are compatible in (nearly) every way. We are always laughing, having inside jokes, doing things for each other, trying new things and having deep & intellectual conversations. The sex is spectacular.

In terms of relationship progression, we are progressing well, and if this were not an international affair things would be promising. We've met many of each other's friends and he's met my entire nuclear family. On our first weekend getaway he said, "I hope you don't mind me dating other women." This changed to his saying last week, "I don't have the desire to date anyone else." Except, when I asked if he had a girlfriend in Russia he said he was dating two women there who he did not consider his girlfriend, and saw them 1-2x per week (I stay with him here). I guess if he said "no" I would know he was lying since I am always usually dating one or two people. I avoid talking about "the relationship" for fear of what I might discover. If he had fallen head over heels at first, then I would be very very wary. People who fall fast fall out fast too. He is a paradox: says he cannot love after his high school girlfriend broke his heart 14 years ago, likes to be alone (unmarried, no girlfriend) but wants to get married and have 3 kids, his parents, sister's family living with him. So which is it? Perhaps he is just as guarding his feelings, as I am. He is 31 and I am 24. Neither of us have ever been married.

What happens after he leaves? Is it possible to decide we really do want to be together then? We don't refer to each other as boyfriend or girlfriend because he is leaving with no plans for returning. But he did move me into his apartment here. Saying, "I love you" would be a moot point. Tuesday he joked, "You don't love me anymore!" to which I said nothing, and says things like, "All we need is love, right?" I change the subject when he says things like that, I don't know how to respond.

I have not verbalized this, but I would be willing to move to Russia and leave my engineering job, law school (I got accepted into some schools for next year)... instead I just say I will miss him when he is gone. I told him to be an jerk to me before he leaves so it won't hurt as deeply. There I would be a complete dependent on him not knowing the language or be able to support myself. I think he would be ok with this since he considered finding and marrying a random blind girl since she would be dependent on him. Also he is financially secure so if I didn't have an income for a while that would be ok. I am ok with this since I realize he is a rare gem, after 10 years of dating with relationships ranging from one night stands to 3 years, the spectrum ranging from losers to ambitious, accomplished people.

Yesterday he asked me if I would like to have his child. I didn't know what to say because we have not even established the relationship or determined whether or not we would see each other past his visa expiration date. So instead I again avoided the subject (about whether this is a sperm donor thing or if he would be involved as well) and started making crude jokes about artificial insemination and our kid being called a Raisin (russian-asian). He said, "you never answered the question" and I answered, "I really like you, I would disrupt my life for you." I wonder if that is a satisfactory answer.

I guess I should treat this like this was not crossing over international borders as 1)He has said he gets bored with women after ~1 month on average, except "so far" he finds my many facets endlessly fascninating, so if he were not leaving perhaps boredom would set in anyway and 2) If this were really meant to be it would happen. The guy is not a dope and can make things happen, when he wants them to.

I think if he really liked me he'd get me over there, since I don't start school till Fall 2006, that gives us plenty of time to bond before I go to school for several years. Point: I don’t think he likes me. Or maybe we are both afraid of taking the reins. What should I do? I am in love with this guy, and would stay with him even if he were horribly maimed in a terrible fire, incapacitated, and unemployed. Any insights, opinions, stories and advice would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

Avatar for northwestwanderer
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Thu, 11-10-2005 - 1:43pm

Did you post about this before? As I think you were advised previously, stop guessing and just ASK the man already what his intentions are with respect to you once he leaves.

Better to KNOW than to try to read the tea leaves like you are doing ;-).

Sheri




Edited 11/10/2005 2:01 pm ET by northwestwanderer
iVillage Member
Registered: 10-21-2004
Thu, 11-10-2005 - 8:07pm

Previous thread for reference:
http://messageboards.ivillage.com/n/mb/message.asp?webtag=iv-rlmrright&msg=5303.1

Bluemack,
This other post was only a little over a month ago. It still sounds as though you haven't defined anything or know where you stand, due to the "expiration date" on the relationship.

Yet, you are *considering* the possibility of moving all the way around the world? When you don't know where things stand? and have only been seeing each other a few months?

Does love conquer all? No, not really. Sometimes, despite love, timing sucks. If he was leaving a year from this December, you'd have to time to develop your relationship while he's here. But, that's not the case.

<>

You *think* you'd be ok with it. Have you ever been to Russia?

Secondly, you sound like an ambitious woman, with education and goals ... yet, you're willing to put all those goals aside ... and "disrupt your life for him" ... while not knowing where you stand or where this is headed?

Ok, head out of the clouds and feet on the ground. Fact is, it's only been a few months. Consider this statement: "I'm willing to put all my goals and ambitions on the backburner for someone I've known for 3 months."

Read it out load. Does it sound ridiculous?

<< I avoid talking about "the relationship" for fear of what I might discover.>>

Well, if you're with someone whom you don't feel you can talk to about the "tough stuff" ... for FEAR of what you might discover ... then, what you are doing is trying to make decisions based on fantasy and assumptions, not truth and reality.

<< Saying, "I love you" would be a moot point. Tuesday he joked, "You don't love me anymore!" to which I said nothing, and says things like, "All we need is love, right?" I change the subject when he says things like that, I don't know how to respond.>>

Ok, so you've never exchanged "I love you's" ... do you love him and are just afraid of saying so?

When he says things like that, and you change the subject ... how does he respond? Do you think he might be saying things like that to get closer to you, keep you "hanging in" in hopes that PERHAPS he can get you to marry him so he can stay here. I mean, in a situation like this, you have to be very clear on what his intentions are ... if he's aligning with you for YOU or if he's aligning with you and telling you what you want to hear so that he can get a foothold here in the states. Unfortunately, I don't think you have TIME on your side for that to happen.

<< What happens after he leaves? Is it possible to decide we really do want to be together then? >.

If your relationship continues after he leaves, and he remains interested and wants to keep it going ... I think that's the ONLY way to know whether or not he's really "into you" or into your citizenship. Sorry I couldn't be more encouraging.

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-06-2004
Fri, 11-11-2005 - 8:10am

In a word, NO!

No , love does not conquer all, it never has and it never will. They only people who actually believe that are little children and adults who haven't grown enough emotionally to not be little children on the inside. They still believe in fairy tales and knights, and that movie plots like "Pretty Woman" and "Maid in Manhatten" could actually happen in real life.

Welcome to the real world... where true love is real and wonderful but in order to find it you have to work on being happy with yourself first and then finding someone you are compatible with who loves you just as much as you love them.

You have no idea if you're even really compatible with this guy because you're terrified of confirming what you're instincts and your brian are telling you are true. Which is that this is just a fling. He doesn't take you seriously because you've never given him any reason too. He gives you what you want, which is a romantic fantasy. You've never asked for anything more.

And your instincts are probably dead on. This isn't love. He's just giving you what you want and you're lapping it up like a teenage girl. Gather up your good sense and reason and USE THEM!!! instead of shoving them into some deep dark corner every time they come up and say, "Hello, remember us good judgement and sanity. We're you're friends we're here to protect you. Stop ignoring us. We keep trying to tell you this is a fling but you wont listen. You keep squishing us back into this moldy dark corner and listenng to all those sappy mushy feel good horny chemicals and all that romantic crap that's been crammed into your head since birth. Stop it!!!!!!"

You clearly have good sense and good judgement you just aren't using them at this moment. I don't know where you've put them but it's past time to find them and start using them again. It happens to all of us. I took leave of my senses for about a year and let an abusive jacka** move in with me and mouch off me for a year. Hey, at least you haven't done anything that dumb, YET.

I mean seriously, you're obviously normally a strong, intelligent, self-assured woman. What is goiung on with you that you would even CONSIDER doing something like leaving your friends, your family, your career, and your education for a guy you can't even have an honest converstaion with about how you feel?

I know you're smarter then this. So what's up have you completely lost your mind or are you maybe going through what we all do... Maybe on the logical side you KNOW that this isn't the last guy you'll ever love or be attracted to and he problem isn't the best match for you BUT, on the emotional side maybe it's been a while since you've been serious about anyone... you miss waking up next to someone, you miss the daily reassurance of your attractiveness and loveableness, you miss the physical contact, you miss having a boyfriend. Maybe logically you understand that this isn't your last chance but at the same time it kind of FEELS like maybe it is. Maybe it's scary to keep starting over and over and you'd like to just take a break and check out of the dating scene for awhile but still get to have all the cool stuff that comes with having a steady sex partner.

I understand. There was a time I felt the EXACT same way. Don't do what I did. Don't let your feelings and emotions keep shoving your friends good judgement and sanity into that cold dark moldy corner of your mind. Let them tell you what you need to hear. No, you wont like it; but, eventually you will be glad you listened.

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-19-2005
Fri, 11-11-2005 - 9:50am
You're right, the man is leaving the country so I shouldn't be afraid of scaring him away. We do communicate perfectly on all other subjects.
iVillage Member
Registered: 09-19-2005
Fri, 11-11-2005 - 10:01am

Hi starbuck70, thanks for your thoughtful response and bringing up questions I may not have thought of. I like to consider all angles and possibilities.

Yes, it does sound ridiculous that I'd leave all "this" for a guy I've known for a few months. I am logical but I can also be... a dreamer, and adventurer and a diehard romantic. However, logic actually helps me here: if things don't work out, I can always pick up where I left off. School and jobs will always be here waiting for me. I can always make that happen. I wouldn't want to live my life wondering what "could have" happened.

Law school doesn't start till Fall 2006 and I thought I could try Russia out for a few months before then. I do have a job which I have been at for 2 1/2 years and am pretty tired of and wouldn't mind a vacation before school. I figure if we can cement the relationship in that time then the 2-3 years of school wouldn't matter. I don't believe he is out just for citizenship because he wants to settle down in Russia.

I decided to write a letter yesterday to him to lay it out all (almost all) on the table and leave the rest up to him.

Again, thank you for taking the time to respond, I appreciate it greatly.

iVillage Member
Registered: 09-19-2005
Fri, 11-11-2005 - 10:07am

Wow, thanks for taking the time to write that fun piece of "get your head on straight" post.

I will ask for more and see what happens. What do I have to lose? The guy is leaving the country anyway. Everything is "perfect" except for that one keystone/archstone, the most important stone of all upon which if it is not there everything else crumbles. That is the "talk".

You're right, I don't like to get my hopes up in fear they will be crushed. There is definitely a conflict within me with the logical and emotional side. Thank you for being there for me and sympathizing.

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-06-2004
Fri, 11-11-2005 - 4:03pm

Thank you for taking my post in the manner it was intended. :)

It would seem I came up a dollar late and a day short though. You seem to have come to a very sensible conclusion all on your own.

I have an expresison I like to use when friends stress over taking chances because of what it might cost them in financial secutiy, "It's only money. You can always make more."

There's a great quote by Rodney Smith: "Life responds when we risk."

The cold logic of your mind should never control your life's path only prepare for the consequences should things go wrong. That way you are ready to pick up and try again without regret holding you back. If you can make a scary choice and take a risk and know that you wont regret it because you were glad you tried in spite of how it may turn out, well that's the way to live a happy, fulfiling, and courageous life.

Best of luck to you.