My $.02 about whats been going on here

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iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
My $.02 about whats been going on here
5
Fri, 08-08-2003 - 8:42pm
Deena...

I may not have always agreed with you.. but I truly value your posts. I may not agree with you all of the time.... but I respect how you say how you feel regardless of how other people take it.

This is not high school, girls.. Why even bother with saying.. yeah.. you said this, and only 3 people agreed with you, so I am right.. More people agreed with me than you, so I am right.. etc. etc. (I am paraphrasing here) Come on... Alot of people may have agreed with Deena, but didn't post. I know I did and I am just posting now. Why tell everyone to drop the subject, that it is water under the bridge, and then keep on posting about it?

Why bother Deena about her personal life? She has posted things of her life. Maybe she doesn't want all of her information online. To each their own.

To everyone.... If you don't want someone's true opinion.. don't post on a public board. Take it to email.

It seems like alot of times, this board can be all "bubble gum" meaning that alot of people like to say things to make other people happy.. Ohhhh you just met someone 2 days ago and you are already in love? WOW! Congratulations!! I am sooooooooo happy for you! and then the next week, the same person says.. I met someone else!! I am in love! Wow! Congratulations!! I am soooooooo happy for you again.. Come on, please.. I like to come on here and read that someone is telling someone their true feelings.

There are good and bad things about online relationships. Who are we to judge people on how they feel? But when you are constantly living thru the internet, and not trying to have a life outside of it.. you might need some help. Yes, there are good people online. Yes, there are bad people online. BE CAREFUL OUT THERE!!!

Some people are here because they visit dating sites, and meet a guy, take an interest, and meet up as soon as possible. They use the internet as an avenue. Why waste time online and meet someone and have no attraction? I can understand that.

Some people are here because they have met someone in a chat room or messaging service, and they have fell in love that way. Good for them too.

I met Willy in a chat. We talked online for over a year before we met in person. Why judge me? We are totally in love, and we were before we met in person. And it has worked out great for us. We are engaged, saving for our wedding and have been living together for over a year.

I have met people previous to Willy from the computer. I met another guy in a chat room, I met him in person and I got sexually assaulted. Did I ever want to talk to a guy online again? No way.. but it ended up happening. I met a guy on yahoo personals before Willy that I thought I could totally be into and when we met in person, NO CHEMISTRY. If we would have met sooner, we would have saved some time.

I have alot of friends that have met people on dating sites. I know one girl that meets these guys, has maybe a sexual relationship with them.. and it lasts 2 weeks or so.. That's her perogative.

A girl could pick up a guy in the bar, and take him home for a "good time", and a girl meets a guy online in her area, and decides to meet him for sex. What's the difference? One meets in public and can tell right away that they are attracted to the other person, and the other doesn't know for sure but takes a HUGE chance. I wouldn't want to put myself in either position. If you need sex that bad.. in my opinion, (note that I said my opinion) take a trip down to the local sex shop and stock up on AA batteries and a "special friend".

"Some people only read/hear. what they want to. Its called selective reading/hearing. I can see Deena will never try and see my point of view. " I guess you don't seem to see hers either. This is a 2 way street around here. She has a right to her own opinion, and you have a right to yours and you can go and sleep with whomever you want... If you don't want to hear what other people think.. don't post it on a public board.

Done...

Sorry for the babbling.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-19-2003
Fri, 08-08-2003 - 11:44pm
Thanks Nikki, for your post. Maybe I have been sitting in the back to long. But I thought the fuels of this flame would die down soon. I am sure many are thinking of how I feel about this whole situation. Well, when it began I thought things would go like it did when you all (women.com) joined up with Ivillage would. A bit of a rift in the tide but all came together greatly. I know this will do the same.

Please all read CMZanna's post so you are familiar with TOS. Then we all need to think of online safety. I know with the situation at hand I have done, and was blessed nothing has happened. But, as I say many times, I talk to everyone as I would any friend or family member. To each thier own and all. I am not agreeing or disagreeing with the posts because my personal opinion is that of its own. They are mine... *smile*

I respect everyones opion and I hope it is settled that it is to agree to disagree... How about a dejavoo.... But all in all we are about the online safety of all as stated in TOS and presented in TOS. Personal information is just that and it is many times said not to give off to much online. I know we would like to have the whole story it helps in giving your opinion. But, without differences who would we be. If I didn't get both sides, good and bad then how would we be able to make the right decision that fits our personal life.

I ask that we all give it as it seems to be dying down right now and I am late but Nikki made me want to post also. We are all in one way or another tied intogether and that is the good of the board. If we all agreed who would come here? Then those who are in a different situation wouldn't feel right coming here (it has happened before) as to why i have now asked for a cl then before. I want to shake things up... I have even asked a specific member (only one) personally to host it because I am usually the one who smoothes things over. But the difference is good.

This whole situation has brought our posts up so high *smile* that I am so proud of you all. But, I did want to say to not lose it all on the one. Let us all focus on helping the others of this board also. Because the insight we have is something of greatness.

Marie

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iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Sat, 08-09-2003 - 1:15am
Thanks for your input - I have always been careful to say that for me certain types of online interactions do not work, and when asked for an opinion to give it. I refuse to do the bubble gum thing - this is not the wedding board after all, LOL. If I posted that I was madly in love with a man 5,000 miles away who I had been chatting with for a week I know I would want a dose of reality and fast!! There are certain things I definitely take a firmer stand on - they are, adultery, poor treatment of children, and truly unnecessary risks to one's life (no need to repeat, LOL).

There is a place for bubble gum, a place for a dose of reality, a place for everything in between - and it all should have a place right here.

I am glad things worked out for you and Willy, by the way! To me, being in love, being head over heels - can be thrilling, exciting, a lot of fun - at the same time I have lived long enough to know that it is important to me to stay grounded, to keep my life going full speed, not to neglect my work, my family, my friends, working out, myself - so that if it doesn't work out I have those things intact and moving on will be that much easier. I made absolutely sure years ago that I would have a career where I would always have a job and typically make a conmfortable living and I sacrificed so that today if I wanted to stay home with a child, or if I got fired, I could probably last years if I had to even with no income. I chose to avoid illegal drugs (although in high school and college had plenty of friends who did many drugs), promiscuity, etc - I have close friends who are and I do not judge them although often they judge themselves. I have many friends here in NY who are artists - struggling artists - am I supportive, a good friend - of course - would I date one - of course not - it doesn't fit in with my goals.

I have done many things to give back to society - I got political asylum for a haitian man and represented him in front of an INS person during a severe snowstorm, helped a widow of an artist who was scammed by an art dealer get a judgment against him, I read to children at a homeless shelter every other week just about, I give to charity, etc. I believe strongly in giving back to society because I am so fortunate to have had the opportunities I have - and while my family was very psychologically supportive, I had to make my own way financially. And because I did, I feel I must give back. And I work hard to do so.

I think many women who meet men through the internet who end up being con artists or liars, etc are women who are vulnerable to that and they are vulnerable because they have not created a secure, stable fulfilling life for themselves, making a man who represents himself as handsome, dashing, rich, "classy" seem like heaven, like nirvana. If you get an education, a stable career, a sense of self, a life filled with friends and hobbies and love and warmth - that kind of man is likely not to be appealing because you likely will search for someone that is on your level - because you are happy with the level you have reached - the man who types "just the right thing" and speaks of a better life you could have with him - some of it materialistic, has little relevance. Similarly, the man who claims he is a struggling artist or person and needs the right woman to "save" him also will not appeal - because if you have reached a stable point you probably want someone who is similarly stable.

I am not generalizing (note all the caveats!) just putting forth a possible theory about the internet - might be right or wrong - I don't know - just sharing!

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Sat, 08-09-2003 - 2:03pm
I for one also value your posts and appreciate the way you phrase your opinions as what would or would not work for you. I give your posts high credibility because of that phrasing.

Perhaps it is my background in science that makes me highly suspicious of people who claim that a particular method will not work or certain types of relationships are not real. In science, as well as in life, there are very, very few things that are absolute. The rest are up to interpretation. Some methods may have more supporting evidence than others, but that does not make any more valid for a particular person than any other. I sincerely doubt anyone can claim that the 'rules' always work, just as I will never claim that online relationships always work. It is recognizing that fact, and making sure that you always preface your opinions as such, that makes someone credible.

I did not come here for advice on my relationship. I, from personal experience, know that online relationships can be real. When we met in person all of our feelings were confirmed, so I know that the online part of our relationship was very valid. I also know that I met much resistance from others who had not been in such a relationship and that made things more difficult. I hope to give others the benefit of my experience.

Part of the success in our relationship comes from our age - knowing what we want out of life and a partner. And also the willingness to realize that we might not always be aware of what we need. He has brought out sides to me that I didn't know were there and I am so happy with the person I have become because I have known him. Much of that I learned before we met in person, and I think I was more open because of that fact. That is why I am a firm believer that online relationships can be very real.

I particularly enjoyed the last part of your post and completely agree. Although I do think that it holds true for women seeking romantic relationships anywhere, not just online. Kelly is fond of saying that he needs me because he loves me, not loves me because he needs me. We were both self-sufficient, led fulfilling lives and had plenty of confidence in ourselves, so we were looking for someone who didn't 'need' someone. I think anytime anyone is vulnerable or desperate to find a partner, they leave themselves open to someone who will take advantage of them. With online that might be easier, because if you are particularly susceptible to creating fantasies, internet dating can make for some dangerous illusion. Fortunately I have always been solidly grounded, so there was never any danger of me creating a fantasy, but I do realize that may be a problem for others.

Thanks for your post - I am thoroughly impressed with all you have done and all your experiences. And I definitely agree that there is a place for all opinions here - bubble gum or not!

-Debbie

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Sat, 08-09-2003 - 4:19pm
Thank you Debbie - if I didn't say it before, I love the way you write. i will say this - this past year i have developed friendships purely on line and the phone - sometimes just on line - with women - and yes they feel real to the point that if I don't hear from one of course I worry about what could be happening, if she is ok, etc - to me of course romantic relationships are a whole different thing.

I look forward to studies being done 10 years from now to see how marriages like yours - are working out - of course of course I am sure yours will be just as blissful - loved your description of your relationship and way of relating - but it would be interesting to see. For example, I think if Gail had known Mark in person his neediness would have come through in 3-4 dates and she wouldn't have needed months for it to be revealed on line - just a hunch and just the most recent example I can think of.

Nice chatting with you, Debbie. I am not a scientist but specialize in intellecutal property law so you can bet I deal a lot with "your kind" - i.e. the right brain kind - not always easy when you're a left brain type like me! ;-)

iVillage Member
Registered: 04-16-2003
Mon, 08-11-2003 - 9:12am
Thanks for all the posts here on this thread. Thanks Marie, and all others who commented. I agree totally. Happy posting to us all!


gail:)