Maybe controversial question BUT (m)

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Maybe controversial question BUT (m)
34
Thu, 08-19-2004 - 8:45pm
it has to do with living together.

When I was younger, I was all about living together to see if things "clicked" but now that I am older/more experienced I really don't see that as being anything to experiment with. Especially with a child. Now I realize I might be upsetting some people but I don't think it is the right way to go.

My view now of marriage - like I was telling my mother today should be based on the fact that you both love and RESPECT each other and you believe that you can "stand" the person forever. I know that sounds unromantic but I don't mean it so. I guess I am saying that you realize the persons faults and can accept them and you are comfortable that person can respect your views and goals in life and love who you are. I really REALLY feel that if you are going to live together you have made that decision and are going to stick with it.

Jack asked me today why people get divorced. A kind of 3rd grade question that does not have a simple answer but am I the only one who thinks if two people get in a relationship possessing what I mentioned above and the desire to make a FAMILY (even when it is only 2 adults) that divorce wouldn't happen so much. I did tell him that I felt many divorces were the cause of one person in the marriage most often than not. But who knows.

Maybe I am off on this but living together without feeling marriage is the next step which you are clearly going to make unless some horrible inconsistancy in expectations occurrs, is just not the way to go.

Any takers on this? I think that time spent communicating to each other what you want is better spent apart and living together is as serious as marriage and when child are involved is very important.

One more point I want to make on this is that in the beginning of a relationship it has momentum...you can just go along with the FLOW which can go all the way to getting married and even having a child. But until that momentum stops and the relationship becomes a choice, it isn't reality based. Maybe that is the BIG issue.

I would love to hear opinions on this. Go ahead and flame me but I will say that I have had the view of living together and changed my mind for very good reasons and in this case I don't believe anyone can enlighten me to change my mind.

Laura

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Registered: 03-27-2003
Fri, 08-20-2004 - 4:33pm
Maybe rebound marriages - mine stunk. But I think if you really give yourself time and learn from your mistakes you would have to have an upper hand.

I know that woman see things more as choices but I will tell you that is is proven men don't think the same way and they do just go with the flow. But they are also prone to status quo. Basically they will go along withthings but if something makes them take action then it can slow up. But I will tell you they don't really THINK about their decisions. This I know is a proven fact for most men. There are entrie books written on this topic and books written on how to make choices and not just go with things so I kinda think that what I am saying is true in more situations than not.

The point isn't who is right or wrong. And in time you may find that I am right. I have been at your decision and had experiences that changed my mind. Maybe you will too. Maybe not buit if not then that is good! We all have our own decisions to make based on our own experiences.

Laura

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Registered: 03-27-2003
Fri, 08-20-2004 - 4:39pm
He still may not have changed until the marriage actually happened. And why the heck did you stay for 7 years. I feel once it is obvious that a person had lied/doesn't respect you and doesn't care about changing that I would have bailed and cerainly not had kids. I know though - hindsight is 20/20/. Like I can talk. What a jerk you ex was! ((((HUG)))

L

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-25-2003
Fri, 08-20-2004 - 4:40pm
If men just go with the flow, why hasn't Jack introduced you to his parents? As that would be going with the flow. And your argument "men don't think about their decisions" - if that was true - surely Jack would have no issue introducing you - as he wouldn't be thinking about his decision - he would simply be going with the flow.

I'm happily married to a man I lived with before I married. I seriously don't see myself in a dating position ever again in my life - and if I am - it is because TT has died (not to sound morbid - but he is 11 years older than me and women do typically have longer lifespans than men anyhow). And I would never hesitate to live with someone again. Since I view living together as successful, since it worked for me, and since I married someone once before that I did NOT live with and that was a complete catastrophe - I am confident no one and/or nothing will change my mind.

And "The point isn't who is right or wrong. And in time you may find that I am right." LOL - that assumes you ARE right!

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-25-2003
Fri, 08-20-2004 - 4:44pm
I stayed 7 years because I took my vows seriously, whether he did or not. I believed that since I was dumb enough to marry him, I had to "earn" my way out of the marriage - and be able to say "I did absolutely everything I could and then some" and mean it, because I meant it when I said "until death do us part." I had a child because I seriously bought into the theory that him becoming a father would force him to grow up, and because we both wanted one.

And yes, hindsight is definitely 20/20.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Fri, 08-20-2004 - 4:44pm
Interesting. Trav is the man with the plan...no "flowing" for him...that's MY department. I'm the one who works on intuition. So that's just not the same for us.
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Fri, 08-20-2004 - 4:46pm
OH man - I have been there! I think even married though they shouldn't have the right to bank accounts that are only in your name or anything, My ex wiped me out by stealing checks and my bank card. It was so hard. Being with a drug addict is a terror/hell of its own (((((((((HUG)))))))))) You will get a date! Have you tired on-line dating? I know it is hard but maybe that is they way to go? Or maybe this parents without partners kind of thing? There are plenty of single dads out there too! Mayeb that would be better luck? How long have you been apart. I know after my ex I needed time to really build myself up again to be OK. It was so tough.

If you ever want to talk about it feel free to email me OK?

studio_blu@hotmail.com

Laura


Edited 8/20/2004 4:47 pm ET ET by sweet_peas_mum

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Fri, 08-20-2004 - 4:56pm
(((HUG))) I know. :( I am just sorry it took that long for something to show you that. I am glad that mine tanked quickly LOL! I suppose there is no formula. Wish there was. But I hope that our past helps us have a better future.

I am just curious....I hope this isn't offensive but what religious and ethnic background is your ex? I am sure that this can happen to anyone unfortunately but I live in an area there there are a lot of very diverse (and slightly fanatical) ethinic/religious groups and I can remember hearing their philosophies on woman and saw how they treated them like princesses until all of sudden they had the yoke of marriage on them. Seeing these things happen made me very learly of certain men because of it. SO sad. I felt so bad for some friends of mine that ended up in situations like you because they didn't understand how these men would be.

Many ((((((HUGS)))))) for so many years :(

Laura

(really no point to the question - just curious)

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Fri, 08-20-2004 - 5:00pm
I wrote more - that was careful editting! Maybe just time made you wiser to him - and the living together didn't mean anything. who knows.

As far as Jack - he is ANYTHING but typical. He is not a common guy on most levels and he thinks about things too much. Generalizations don't include everyone ;)

iVillage Member
Registered: 04-02-2003
Fri, 08-20-2004 - 5:06pm
I am going to assume that you mean marriage or a relationship leading to marriage when you use the word “commitment” in your last sentence, based on your earlier post.

I don’t agree that living together necessarily equates to a “trial marriage”. There are so many variables. I also don’t agree that a couple that has a life together and raises a family full of love and happiness has to be bound together by a legal contract.

When I chose to live with my SO, I made a commitment to him. I am not “trying him out” to see if his silly little habits annoy me, and I am not using him to pay half of my mortgage. If I was, I would have kicked him out by the third month when I realized that I can’t stand the way he leaves all the lights on in the house, or the way he leaves dirty dishes in the sink for days and creates his own science experiments, or the way he leaves empty boxes and cartons in the cupboards instead of throwing them away! I love him. We are learning to live with each other and work out our differences and compromise. We are settling in and making house rules, and defining expectations. We are in it for the long haul. I do wish to spend the rest of my life with him, and the feeling is mutual, but I have to be fully comfortable with what marriage means to me before I take that step.

But I know for certain that married or not, if he ever turned and did something that I considered severely violent, oppressive, or dangerous to me and/or the kids I would be gone. That’s what I mean by no guarantees. Anyone who has been through a divorce, can surely understand that sentiment. When you marry, you make a promise to stand by that person for better or for worse. I made that promise once and I broke it. I realized that there are degrees of “worse” that I am not willing to live with. So I am hesitant to make that promise again.

Does that mean I should never share a happy life with a partner who is willing to live with me and build our family together without a marriage certificate?

Avatar for comountainsprite
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Registered: 03-26-2003
Fri, 08-20-2004 - 6:04pm
I have to emphatically disagree with the statement that men don't really think about the decisions they make with a relationship and just go with the flow. Men do think differently than women but I can tell you, my dh definitely did not just go with the flow. He analyzed every conceivable angle in his mind of being involved with me. And then did that again before he proposed to me--he'd been analyzing it and trying to make sure he'd thought of every possible consequence both intellectually and emotionally (for months before I even knew he'd decided he could even consider getting married again)and that he had his head and heart wrapped around it before he proposed.