For the older women on this board

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-13-2005
For the older women on this board
6
Fri, 01-12-2007 - 8:29am

Bachelors for Life?
Excerpted from Why Men Marry Some Women and Not Others
by John T. Molloy
http://www.enotalone.com/article/2817.html

Not Your Average Joe

Joe's experience was not unique. An attorney, he told us he had been going to a restaurant-bar for three years on Friday nights. It was a hangout for attorneys, judges, and others who worked in the court system. Joe explained that the restaurant was usually full, and on Friday nights the bar area was crowded with young singles, while most of those seated at tables were older and married. When he showed up one Friday night, there was a new hostess seating people. Without asking, she seated him at a table, assuming he wouldn't want to join the singles at the bar. Joe was too embarrassed to contradict her, and he realized she was right-he no longer belonged at the bar.

Most of the men we interviewed, however, asserted that they hadn't become convinced they were too old for the singles scene because of one incident. It was a series of small incidents over a period of time that turned them off-usually comments made by one or more young women that made them realize they no longer fit into the place they had frequented for years.

One of the focus groups composed of men about to marry said that if a woman wants to know whether a man is ready to get married, she should ask him how much he enjoys the singles scene. If he says it isn't as much fun as it used to be, he's a very good prospect, because he's ready to move on to the next step. They were right, but there's more to it than that: The woman should also ask the man a number of questions, including his age.

Bachelors for Life?

It's easy to spot a confirmed bachelor. He's so used to living alone that he will list the pleasures of the solo life-coming and going as he pleases, not answering to anyone-as reasons for not marrying. But there's still hope. Thousands of former "confirmed" bachelors get married each year, usually to women they've known for less than a year or whom they've been going with for many years. Once men reach age forty-seven to fifty without marrying, the chances they will marry do not disappear, but they drop dramatically.

Please keep in mind that I'm talking about men who have never been married. Men who have been married before are open to remarry much later in life. They have entirely different relationships with women.

If a woman in her forties or older who has never been married is dating a man who has never been married, the chance of him marrying is still good. But at that time in her life, most eligible men are either widowed or divorced, and their chances of marrying again are substantially higher than those of men of the same age who have never married. In other words, if a woman meets two men in their late forties, one who has been married and the other a lifelong bachelor, she should choose the one who has been married before. Although the first man may on the surface appear more cautious, he's far more likely to marry than the second. Many single women say divorced men are often bitter and defensive, so they don't date them. That's usually a mistake.

Handling Stringers

If you're dating a man who has had one or more long-term relationships with other women and didn't marry them, there's a real possibility he's a stringer. A stringer is a man who strings women along. He likes having a woman, sleeping with a woman, eating with a woman, possibly sharing his life with a woman without ever making a real commitment. He often tells women, up front, he never intends to marry, so if and when he decides he wants to cut out, she has no reason to complain.

If you think you may be involved with a stringer, establish a deadline. If he doesn't commit to you within six months, get rid of him. Pay no attention to his excuses. He may tell you that you're coming on too strong. He may complain that the two of you haven't been going together long enough, that he doesn't know, that he hasn't made up his mind. In fact, he is likely to tell you anything that will get you to stick around without his needing to make a commitment. Don't fall for it. The chances a stringer will marry are very slim; he is simply not the marrying kind.

Earlier I mentioned those men who went with one woman for a time, then shortly thereafter went out and married another. This was the pattern, in fact, that initiated our research.

So we questioned the couples in which the man had gone with one woman for years and was marrying another. The women who married these men insisted they commit early in the relationship. If you meet a man who has had a long-term relationship, make it clear to him that if he dates you for a certain length of time, you'll expect a ring. If he doesn't understand that, you haven't done your job. Don't think his affirmative response to such a declaration is a precursor to his making a commitment. He's strung many women along, and he may try it with you. If after six months you don't have a firm commitment, leave.

We ran across at least fifty men we could identify as stringers. They can be very dangerous. I estimate each one is responsible for at least two women remaining single. They are destructive because they con women into wasting their time during the years when they are most attractive and most likely to get a proposal. They stay with women, live with women, promise them marriage, and string them on and on indefinitely.

There is one surefire way to identify these men-they are usually repeat offenders. If a man had even one long-term relationship with someone else, he's very likely to be a stringer. If he does not set a firm date, be on your guard.

Biological Clocks

We spoke to 121 men in their forties who were marrying for the first time. Their reason for marrying was different than that of the younger men we interviewed. Many of these older men were eager to marry because their biological clock was running. Obviously, a man's biological clock isn't the same as a woman's, but men are often in just as much of a hurry to have children. They're not worried about physically being able to father a child, but about being a father to the child. Men forty-two and older who were about to marry looked forward to having children, and they almost unanimously pictured themselves as fathers of sons. They want to be young enough when their sons come along to teach them all the things fathers traditionally teach their sons-to ride a bicycle, to fish, to play ball, and so forth. The most important reason these men had for marrying was that if they waited much longer, they wouldn't be able to be active fathers. So if you meet a man in his forties who tells you he's eager to have a son so he can do those male-bonding things, know that these things are very important to him, and they'll dramatically increase his readiness to marry.

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-30-2003
Fri, 01-12-2007 - 11:46am

That's a good article. The one Stringer I dated did say that he wanted marriage and kids though. He made a big deal of that in the beginning. He was not trying to deceive me. I think he thought that's what he wanted, but the longer I knew him, the less and less he talked about wanting to get married or having kids. He would make offhanded comments about how difficult it would be for him to live with another adult.

It's my impression that some of these Stringers are unintentional stringers and it's not active manipulation on their part. It's more of a personality issue. They do enjoy having a woman around for companionship. I think they can be deeply lonely. But, they can not make that leap to commit. A woman can't help or change them. Their affection dies off for any one particular woman and they go off looking for perfection again.

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-04-2004
Fri, 01-12-2007 - 12:50pm

I read these articles on the DASP board (I assume that's where you got them, too) but haven't commented because I can see stuff like that happening (for both the older and the younger set)- but at the same time, I've seen the ones who DIDN'T fall into any of these generalized groups, either! The ones who would 'blow the curve' of the statistics. So while I find the articles interesting (just like the one I posted on the DASP about the 5 guys all women should date)- there are so many things there to 'take what you need and forget the rest'...

I think in a way, I could end up being called a "Stringer" in the terms of the article, since I am dating Hiker (51; I'm almost 42) and want the relationship, the fun, the companionship, the sex, the dates... but not looking for marriage. One day maybe, but for right now, I can't imagine trying to blend families with anyone or trying to blend incomes and figure out who keeps whose house, who moves in with whom, what to do with all that... Just considering it makes me head spin, so I know I am NOT ready to jump into marriage again. But I do like the commitment of a secure relationship, the feeling that I "belong" to someone, while still having my own life and control over my own affairs. Does that make me "one of them"?? Maybe. Does that make me "wrong" or "bad"? I don't think so- because Hiker and I agree and know where we stand.

Maybe Hiker and I are 2 "stringers" dating each other, but not with the intention of stringing anyone along "until something better comes along". Neither one of us are looking for anyone else. We're just not in the place where we want to blend finances and family members into one household. But we want to be with each other and we want to be exclusive and we want the intimacy, friendship and closeness of it all. It's a sort of limbo I suppose, to those who think that everything needs to be on some kind of timeline with marriage being the ultimate goal. I think my goal is to just spend as much of my life enjoying him as I can, and for now, that's all I want. And to be married, my goal would STILL be to spend as much of my life enjoying him as I can... so the only difference is the whole blending of everything. My heart (IMO) feels the same.

I have 3 older brothers who are eternal bachelors. My oldest brother (47) just doesn't date. I think he is very intelligent, but socially, he doesn't understand how to interact with women. He can be with them as coworkers, but I have never heard of him having a female friend, or a girlfriend (not his whole life). He would be someone I would think would be a 'red flag' to date just because he is totally clueless about it. Although I think of him as a great person and caring and kind... he does miss something socially that is required to have a successful romantic relationship. But I've never tried to date him (ewww) so I don't REALLY know. This is just what I see from the sister side of the picture. He's not even trying to make himself dateable material, and doesn't seem to have any interest in it. He is a very nice person, but I think he'd be very hard to live with.

My second oldest brother (46) has dated. He likes the company of women, but he tends to want the "perfect woman" and that gets in his way. So he remains unmarried at this point, even though he has dated some to the point where we thought we'd hear them announce an engagement soon... but then they'd break up instead. But at least he keeps on getting himself out there and trying to meet new people. He does have female friends, and I think he is the most social of all my brothers. Works on making himself more marketable in the dating scene, and gets out there. Voted "most likely to get married" (of the males in our family) but so far, no such luck. I think it's because he is still looking for "the perfect woman".

My youngest (44) is least likely to pair up, IMO. He hasn't yet 'grown up' and I just don't see it. He acts like he's a teen emotionally, and still lives with my parents (and doesn't pay rent or pay his way there). He would be a total dead-end for dating! Sorry to say, my brother- but man... I wouldn't set him up with ANYONE I knew. SO not ready, and probably never will be. But he makes comments about how he'd like to have a girlfriend... but he just doesn't make any effort to make himself good catchable boyfriend material to start with.

But as far as being tired of the singles scene and then getting married?? I saw that in myself when I was nearing 30. I had fun just going out and meeting a ton of people, but once I started getting that feeling like I was "out with kids"... I had that feeling too. It was time to settle down. But with who??? And sadly, I grabbed the first opportunity that came around (my ex) and went too quickly into marriage for the wrong reasons. Looking back, I see it, but at the time, I just felt like it was TIME. It just wasn't the right person!

So with the bachelors we date... I fear for the one who might be out there prowling just because "it's time" and they are not thinking about taking time to find someone who is RIGHT. It's something to watch out for, definitely- and to not get caught up in their whirlwind.

~shrimpy, who will probably never be a true Aunt

~shrimpy

"A man who wants something will find a way; a man who doesn't will find an excuse." ~Stephen Dolley Jr.

~<

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-13-2005
Sat, 01-13-2007 - 8:12pm

Hi Shrimps,

Thanks for your reply. I had a chuckle at the description of your brothers. You must have had your hands full as a child - how was it to be a sister among 3 brothers? You will have to share stories!!

I don't think you and Hiker are Stringers. Stringers would imply that you are dating and playing the field when you KNOW you will NEVER commit. I think you two are comfortable - and at the age and stage where you can take your time - because you both have kids and families and houses and do not want more children. Some rush the blending thing without much thought and with disastrous results and I do not advocate this. And in your situations I think it is better that you think and not rush.

My purpose for posting this was because we had a great thread in the 5 month update from rlch - and I had been reading a lot from the enotalone site - that is where I did get it (hence the link at the top for further reading as well). And I wanted to post what I had learned from that book - about mindful dating so none of us waste our time - I thought that our two age groups - young and old - would benefit more if I split them up that way.

I think I am like you that I am not in a rush - but I know I wouldn't want to date someone who would never want to be married. I would like to have that option at a later point if it is in our best interest.

I was just perusing DASP - have not been on there regularly because I have been so busy and want to give me time to this board. But I do see mention of the Helen Fisher video and just watched it - will put some notes up about that in a bit. You will have to keep us posted if you see something good we should see there.

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-07-2003
Mon, 01-15-2007 - 12:25pm

Molloy's book is totally bogus: for example, he tells women to practice walking around with bricks on their shoulders - to improve their posture and gait; didn't that sort of advice go out with finishing schools about 100 years ago?

What women really need to know is that marriage confers no substantive rights on men, only obligations. A lawyer would call it an adhesion contract. The "marrying kind" these days is of necessity a chump or a dolt, or has nothing to lose in divorce court. Sorry to have to break it to you.

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-30-2003
Mon, 01-15-2007 - 5:33pm

I don't think you and Hiker could be considered Stringers. You're two people who have already paid your dues and are taking it easy for a while.

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-04-2004
Mon, 01-15-2007 - 5:54pm

"You're two people who have already paid your dues and are taking it easy for a while."

Thanks, fivesense! I'd never heard it put that way before- but that IS very much what it feels like! Like we're both just taking a break from the whole "being married" thing, or marriage-hunting thing but still wanting to have dating company. And not wanting ALL SORTS of dating company (such as playing the field) but wanting just one-on-one exclusive dating company.

~shrimpy

~shrimpy

"A man who wants something will find a way; a man who doesn't will find an excuse." ~Stephen Dolley Jr.

~<