A couple of questions

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-22-2006
A couple of questions
21
Sat, 01-06-2007 - 1:24am

Remember this post:

I asked for his support on helping overcome being unaffectionate. I mentioned to him if I initiate holding his hand, maybe he could give me a squeeze letting me know he likes it or if I initiate a hug, maybe he could say "hey, this feels nice". However, he said that would be too hard on him to do this. I asked him why. He said, being affectionate should come naturally. He said he shouldn't have to work so hard in getting me to be more affectionate just to make him happy. That was his quote. Therefore, I was left shocked, confused and hurt.

Question #1:

How would you word it different if you were me?

Question #2:

How would you fill in the blank when you speak about yourself, keep the statements from you about you, not about him. . . sample and follow precisely: I feel ________ when ___________ happens.

What would some of your examples be?




Edited 1/6/2007 1:28 am ET by casey0201

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iVillage Member
Registered: 08-04-2003
Sat, 01-06-2007 - 1:28am

::However, he said that would be too hard on him to do this. I asked him why. He said, being affectionate should come naturally. He said he shouldn't have to work so hard in getting me to be more affectionate just to make him happy.

So in order to get what he wants, he wants you to get no feedback, no encouragement and he wants you to be a mind-reader?

Have you read the book 'Five Love Languages' by Gary Chapman? I highly recommend it. It will give you some examples of ways to show love to someone whose primary love language is Touch.


Carrie

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Sat, 01-06-2007 - 3:21am








"Ignoring the facts
does not change the facts"
iVillage Member
Registered: 01-13-2006
Sat, 01-06-2007 - 2:16pm

casey0201,

I think that you and him are trying to FORCE it to be natural all the time that it's making it impossible to be natural. How can it be natural if you have to tell him what to say or what to do and he has to tell you what to say or do before the affection actually is shown??

Best of luck,
defleppardgal

Defleppardgal

iVillage Member
Registered: 08-04-2003
Sat, 01-06-2007 - 3:33pm

Thanks to cl-2nd_life for posting all your threads.

Casey,

WOW. These kinds of things have been going on since 4 months into your marriage and it doesn't really sound like they are improving with all the threads I read.

I'm going to be very blunt, my intention is not to offend, but to help you become more aware. From reading your other posts, I got the following:

You take nearly every thing he says personally. He may be joking or stating a fact and you are offended. I see criticism in your conversations with him:

Me: Why can't you do a better job in remember to put your ring back on after work (CRITICISM)

Hubby: I forgot

***I'm getting annoyed
Me: We've almost been married a year and you still forget (CRITICISM)
Hubby: I'm sorry

Me: Forget it (IS THIS POUTING?)

In addition to the criticism this conversation, you are badgering him AND changing the subject to have a platform to blast him for all wrongs, then you are both sarcastic:

Me: You forget your ring and I don't feel your not attracted to me anymore
***We are both yelling by this time
Hubby: What makes you say this
Me: Because you don't want my affection

****I'm taking a couple of deep breaths

Me: So many times I want to reach out to you more but I'm afraid you just aren't attracted to me anymore.
Hubby: ***SILENT***
Me: I've been very affectionate with you for a while and eventhough you don't reject my affection, I feel you don't want my affection either.
Hubby: ***SILENT***
Me: I wish you were affectionate with me because I want/need your touch. I miss it.
Hubby: Sorry, you miss my affection.
Me: Forget it. Sorry I wasnted your time. You don't want my affection...plain and simple.

Sometimes you read more into what he's saying, like the hand washing comment - He was only asking, you jumped to conclusions that he may be implying you aren't clean enough. Stop doing that. Take what he says at face value. I can't decide if the two of you engage in this matter because it's the only way you can have a conversation with him and get his attention (negative attention is better than none) or if you just expect things to be perfect and when they aren't you are ready to jump in and fix it instead of going with the flow.

Are you two in counseling yet? If he won't go, go alone. He also has a great need to be RIGHT, both of you do. Instead of working together you are sabatoging the relationship. Both have the mindset "Oh, look at all I do for you, why can't you just give a little more by doing X."

Here's some additional reading:
The Last Word on the Gentle Art of Verbal Self-Defense – Susan Elgin (There are examples of how to mirror someone and how to really hear what someone is saying)
Relationship Rescue, Dr Phil
Getting the Love You Want, Harville Hendrix
The Four Agreements, Miguel Ruiz
Loving Men More, Needing Men Less, Judith Sills

I didn't give examples of his behavior because the only person you can change is YOU. You can change how your 'react' and the changes you make could quite possibly make a change in him. But that isn't the goal. The goal is to change you, so you can be happier.

I really wish you the best and I hope you will go to counseling to work on the issues.

I'm also adding Ten Rules for Fighting Fair

It's great if both partners will follow the rules, but these really help even if you're the only one following them. It's amazing how just one partner doing this can de-escalate things in a marriage/relationship.

(1)Discuss only one thing at a time. No dragging in other issues, events or people – that’s certain to escalate the discussion into an argument.

(2)No hitting below the belt. Declare certain topics, historical events or comments “off limits” because they’re sure to cause pain or start a fight. Then LEAVE THEM ALONE. Agree to discuss those issues, if necessary, only for a specific purpose and under safe conditions, such as in the presence of a third party.

(3)Only one person at a time gets to talk. The other gets to listen – not debate, defend their position, or counter-attack. Then take turns. MAKE SURE YOU UNDERSTAND YOUR PARTNER’S VIEWPOINT before you talk about your own.

(4)Take a time-out, with a guaranteed time-in. When you feel things escalating, take an immediate time-out and try again in a half hour. If you can’t do that, you must commit to talking about the issue later, at a specified time. The purpose of the time-out is to stop the escalation, not the discussion! If you call a time-out, you MUST call a time-in. If your partner calls a time-out, leave him/her alone – don’t follow your partner around trying to continue the discussion.

(5)No character assassination. Talk about specific behaviors, not your partner’s personality. “I’d like you to pick up your clothes” is appropriate; “You’re a slob” is character assassination.

(6)No “mind reading.” Don’t jump to conclusions about what you THINK is meant by what is being said or done. Stick to what is actually said or done. The responsibility for revealing meanings and motivations belongs only to the person who has them.

(7)Don’t try to re-create history. Too many people argue over historical details – exact words, who did what first, in what time frame, etc. – instead of identifying actual problems and solutions. Stick to real issues you can do something about NOW, and stop fighting about whose memory is more accurate.

(8)Take responsibility for your own feelings, desires, needs and behaviors. Use “I” statements, not “you” statements, as in “I want you to…” instead of “You should…” “I’m angry that you were late” is talking about your feelings; “You’re always late” is blaming.

(9)Look for resolution, not agreement. Partners don’t have to agree on things, arrive at the same conclusions, or see things the same way; this is not only impossible, it’s boring! Individuals are allowed to have their own opinions, interpretations, feelings and thoughts about things. Trying to win a “Tastes great! Less filling!” argument is fruitless and unfair.

(10)KEEP THE RULES EVEN IF YOUR PARTNER DOESN'T. Your partner fighting dirty doesn’t give you permission to do the same! Fighting dirty is a character issue – don’t compromise yours.


Carrie

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-13-2004
Sat, 01-06-2007 - 5:07pm

I agree with deflappardgal.

In answer to your original question, I wouldn't be saying it at all. When you try to dictate someone's reaction, they have to think about it all the time. And yes, it IS too hard. I can't imagine having to remember to react in a certain way each time my husband did something.

Dress Up Games, Doll Makers and Cartoon Dolls @ The Doll Palace
iVillage Member
Registered: 05-22-2006
Sun, 01-07-2007 - 4:27pm

<>

No this isn't pouting. Its call being FRUSTRATED.

itwinflame - I very much appreciate the time you took in writing your post. This was not the intention of why I created this thread. The people on this board have already made their comments/suggestions in all my past threads, therefore, it is the past.

Maybe I wasn't clear with my first post in this thread. I simply want a suggestion on how to re-write my paragraph to not sound like I'm dictating.

Also, I just want a couple of suggestions for my 2nd question. (Please read my first post)

I have my reasons for the suggestions.

Thanks in advance.

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-13-2004
Sun, 01-07-2007 - 7:03pm

Back to the first paragraph in your post. You said you felt shocked, confused and hurt....but I can't understand why you were at all surprised.

All along, he's told you that he doesn't believe people should have to change in a marriage. Therefore, he won't help you to change and will not be willing to change his own reactions. He accepts you as you are and expects you to accept him how he is.

What you are asking of him goes against his beliefs.

Quite frankly, if the subject you wish to discuss is how one of you can change, you'll be wasting your breath. He has never had any intention of changing. And you having difficulties with changing and needing his support will only serve to irritate him and remind him why people shouldn't have to change in the first place.

Anytime you raise the issue of you or him changing or adjusting your reactions, you will only alienate him further.

Dress Up Games, Doll Makers and Cartoon Dolls @ The Doll Palace
iVillage Member
Registered: 05-22-2006
Sun, 01-07-2007 - 8:30pm

<>

The paragraph in the "first" post was back in May...when I first joined this message board. Instead of doing a copy/paste, I should have re-phrased the paragraph. Therefore, I have re-phrased:

If you wanted to become affectionate with your spouse and you needed their help, how would you ask for their help?

Also, if you have any suggestions for filling in the blanks for question #2, I would appreciate it.

Thanks

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-13-2004
Sun, 01-07-2007 - 8:59pm

What I would do or say in my relationship would be of no use to you. Mainly because the two relationships are not comparable.

Therefore, I can only reiterate what I've said on two earlier posts on this thread. If I were you, I would not raise the issue at all.

Your husband has made it very clear that he does not want to change. Period. Asking him to change his reactions (even if it's to help you change) will only serve to drive him further from you.

He will not change for you no matter what you say or how you say it - therefore, you have to accept him how he is or leave him.




Edited 1/7/2007 9:02 pm ET by iv_aisha2004
Dress Up Games, Doll Makers and Cartoon Dolls @ The Doll Palace
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-30-2006
Mon, 01-08-2007 - 5:13pm

You said:(If you wanted to become affectionate with your spouse and you needed their help, how would you ask for their help?)

I wouldn't. I would do it myself. Hug him goodbye, kiss him hello, sqeeze his hand once in a while, etc, etc. Just DO it. I would just give him lots of affection.

Casey, my sister and her husband lost a son due to suicide recently. Now they are getting a divorce. My brother in law does NOT want a divorce. In fact he checked into a hospital for serious counseling to help him deal with it. I was talking to him the other day when he got out of the hospital. He said the couseling was life changing. Do you know what he learned? He doesn't like the situation and can't change it, but he can change himself. He started working on that and now they are talking about trying to work things out.

That's how I would try and tackle your issues. If you want more affection think about how YOU can change to create more affection, and asking nothing of him in return. If you want more hugs, hug him more, more kisses? kiss him more. I know you might feel that's not fair, but if you make life changes in yourself I would bet that he will respond. It's certainly worth giving a try and what can it hurt?

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