Can Men & Women Be Friends
Find a Conversation
| Fri, 08-06-2004 - 6:20am |
My XMM and I started out as co-workers. We were just co-workers though. I knew his family, his parents, his hobbies, everything. During the nine years I had known him, I had gotten to know a lot about him, some information I'm sure he didn't share with other people. Seven years into our friendship it turned into something more. That's when we crossed the lines and became more than friends.
One thing happened though when we became lovers. We stopped being friends. We were so busy being paranoid, that we stopped being friends. We didn't have long talks anymore because we were so worried someone would think something was going on. I stopped bringing lunch to the office for us. We stopped discussing things that were bothering us. We only thought about sex. Looking back I realize how much I missed the friendship part of our relationship.
That made me start wondering about my other relationships with men. There were two other men that I had started to form a friendship with. In both cases I found them wanting more than I did out of the friendship.
So, can men and women be friends without the sex thing getting in the way? Or, are we only supposed to be close friends with our H?

Pages
It's possible but I think it is rare. I have one good male friend that I've known for over 20 years. He was actually one of my high school teachers. He's close to 70 now, me over 40. We are still friends. I don't call him often because over the years he got married and now I am best friends with his wife and talk to her more. But I have called him to discuss personal issues, etc.
I started out as friends with a co-worker, too. Over a couple of years of happy hours, it turned into something else. I was hanging out with another guy too, but 'sensed' that he might want more from it so I actually have been avoiding him. I am not interested in him whatsoever.
It's a fine line - I do have other friendships with guys, none as close as the one who I ended up in a A with. And now I am ready to tell him that I need to go back to being just friends. I hope we can.
Were you able to go back to being friends with your MM?
IMO, once the fine 'sand' line has been crossed....there is no going back because that once comfortable level can never be reestablished. xMM and I certainly tried every angle but after 6 years all we had were regrets and wishes that had we never crossed that fine line, our friendship would have been in tact.
I've always had male friends. For some reason I've always gotten along well with men better than most women. I grew up being around a lot of men and only a few girlfriends. Then when I started working, I worked with mostly men. Now I work for an office where I'm the only female. Part of me likes knowing that men will tell it like it is, no games, no pulling any punches. When we "fight" are argue, things are fine the next day because no one holds any grudges. Men don't get caught up in the drama like women do...like I did with MM.
I know now that MM was a friend, but that was it. He didn't have any deeper feelings for me, or at least none that he will ever admit to. I, on the otherhand being the female, fell pretty hard for him. He wants to stay friends, but I'm not sure I can. I don't think I'll be able to move on and get over him if he is constantly around.
"Why You Don't Have to Have Sex to Cheat": http://www.ivillage.com/relationships/debate/emotional/articles/0,,368365_368488,00.html
"10 Rules for Avoiding Emotional Infidelity":
http://www.ivillage.com/relationships/debate/emotional/articles/0,,166973_368496,00.html
"11 Rules to Make Your Marriage Infidelity-Proof":
http://www.ivillage.com/relationships/debate/emotional/articles/0,,368365_368490,00.html
Ultimately though, I think in many instances men and women can not be friends. I feel that once you get to know someone better an attraction develops even if it wasn't meant at the beginning. You come to depend on each other too much.
Another question I have thought about is once the A is over can you remain friends with the X. I have been NC now for over 8 months. I do miss his friendship terribly. But I really do not know how you can go back to being "just friends" once that line has been crossed. We tried to be friends at first but it was weird becuase we kept straying back to conversations that friends wouldn't have. One day we would be on the friendship route and the next it was more of a lovers route. I think that if we were to remain friends the attraction would remain and the line could be crossed AGAIN.
I just started reading this board this week. This will be my first post.
MM broke our "relationship" off May 20th (sad I know the exact day huh??). He proclaimed profusely he wanted to remain "friends". I would love nothing more then for him and I to remain friends. He is the one person in my life I truly feel close to...that I could tell anything to and not be judged.
The first week after we talked about a lot of things..friend things and lover things. I was looking to mend the hurt he was feeling. He was looking for answers to things I had said or done.
We talked everyday the first week, more then we had talked in the last 3 months of our A. The following week it went to a few times a week. We talked just mainly day to day stuff, stuff friends talk about...I found it extremely difficult. I wanted to say so many things to him. He SEEMED to be at ease with it. On occasion we talked about our A but we tried to "avoid" the issue all together, at least he did.
Its been almost two months since he ended the A. In the last 3 weeks I have heard from him maybe 3 times if I am lucky. I have emailed at least 4 times asking how he is doing, his job search, his family. I have IM'ed him saying "hey" or "how are you". I called and left a few VM's saying "Havent heard from you in a while just wanted to see how you were and if everything is okay.". I called once needing a real friend to talk to and asked him to return my call.
He sent me an email explaing why he couldnt call and asked if he could help through email. I gave a few details of what was going on but I needed a friend to actually listen, to hear his voice, get his advice, his view on the situation. He wrote back a very short email. Four or five sentences. We have since emailed two or three times. In one email I told him that I was trying to keep our friendship from fading but he was not giving any effort and that I would no longer email, call or message him but I would respond to any effort he made to contact me. That if he truly wanted to be my friend he would have replied and if he wants to contact me he will find a way to come back into my life.
His response to me was it was hard to by my friend. I am not sure what that is suppose to mean. He always told me that I was the one who concentrated on the sexual aspect..If he looked back, really looked back..that is NOT true. He lives 2 hours away from me. When he had a bad day I would take the day and drive the 2 hours just to see him. To SEE that he was okay. To let him talk to me. To BE THERE.
I never wanted more from him then the friendship we had, what I did get beyond that was GREAT! I do miss him. I miss his friendship more then anything. It has been two days since my reply to his last email. He has not replied back to me. I am not going to keep emailing and trying to keep a friendship that he no longer wants..
I think there can be friendship after the line has been crossed. I think in the beginning after it ends it is very strained. Each person is trying not to say something that may be construed wrong.
I do believe it is easier for women to remain friends after they resolve their emotions, heal their pain then it is for the men. Men seem to pick themself up, dust themself off and go on about a normal life. I thought XMM was one of the "unique" men in the world that treated a woman with respect. Wanted her for her mind, heart and body. That could maintain a friendship with a woman after being sexual with her. I really shoudl have known better. His previous affair should have shown me that..I am being treated exactly as she was...he did not respond to her unless HE felt like it...unless something was "wrong" between he and I...When he thought we would not work out..How sad is that??
Its even more sad that I sit here hoping that he wants to still be friends...but also with some hope I dont hear from him again. I am not sure what I want...I do know my life was great with him in it.
Sorry to ramble. I have to say I am so glad I made it to this board. I think it has helped with with a few things and can only continue to do so!
Smiles
MB
I am sensitive, however, to how their W may feel about me. I try to tone our friendship down around the spouses and develop a friendship with the spouses. I don't want to make them feel uncomfortable and realize it is hard for them to understand that there is no hanky panky going on. (In case you're wondering, my A was with someone who was not a friend; it was a LDA). Unfortunately, I'm not sure they all are thrilled with me and this troubles me.
As for being friends with your ex-OM... Very difficult! We try, my OM insists that he wants to stay in touch, but I know he is not capable of keeping his emotions in check. I have backed way off and want him to get on with his life.
Pug
"So, can men and women be friends without the sex thing getting in the way? Or, are we only supposed to be close friends with our H?"
- Interesting question.
I hope that my Ex OM and I can remain friends because we have been friends and coworkers for many years and have been through lots of experiences, nonsexual I mean, together. I just don't know if it can be or not. Most people seem to think not, but I hope mine can be the exception to the rule, becuase even though the sexual attraction between us was very strong, we enjoy one another's company just as people too and we always have. Maybe we have gotten the sex thing out of our systems with each other? Maybe??
Guess we'll see.
IP
I have one very close male friend other than my boyfriend (I'm about 18 mos. affair free, I'm divorced and am involved with an available man for over a year) -- we've been close friends through his GF putting a stop to our spending time together by staying in touch with occasional long email spurts over the years. He's no longer with that GF and we have had dinner since they split.
Neither of us is looking for anything other than advice, support and friendship. And we're both attractive, healthy, sexual people -- just not with each other! I have other male friends I won't spend alone-time with, only in groups because I know they'd like to take our friendship somewhere else. I'm firm & honest that I'm with my BF and not interested in anythign else!
My XMM started out as a buddy -- but he "fell in love" with me & pursued a romantic/sexual relationship with me after my divorce. I definitely volunteered for that gig, but in time knew it wasn't enough for me and left him.
He's very bitter toward me but never considered leaving his W (thank God!). I no longer consider him a friend and feel that our affair ruined any possibility of a friendship. I no longer respect him or want to see him or talk with him.
So I guess, if you keep things above-board & in perspective and use good sense about how you relate to your male friends, you can definitely stay friends. If either party has something "else" in mind and isn't honest about it, the friendship can be ruined. If either has something else in mind, but is honest about it & mature enough to accept that it won't happen & can still be friends, you could even get over that.
I think staying honest & open and accepting where each friend draws the line is the way to go.
Pages