Mars & Venus

Avatar for ddnlj
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Mars & Venus
10
Mon, 04-04-2005 - 9:06am

I just started reading Men are From Mars/Women are From Venus. I know it's been around for a while; hey, I never see movies when they first come out either. LOL

Very few self-help books ever impress me, but this one has. The author has an uncanny understanding of women, and if he has figured out women that well I'm certain what he writes about men has to be right on the mark.

Because of the emotional and communicative differences between men and women I'm surprised we ever get along at all. I'm learning things about men I never realized. As I'm reading I'm highlighting things that I know SO has misunderstood about me simply because I'm a woman. When I'm finished I'm going to give it to him and ask him to read it and highlight things that I misunderstand about him because he's a man. I see so much of him and I in that book we could have been the models for it. We are the epitome of the Martian and Venusian, and we've never understood each other. As I read through the book I can see all kinds of mistakes we've made because we each expected the other to think and act and communicate according to our own gender.

How many of you have read this book and did it help you? I think it should be required reading for all men and women in relationships. It is an eye-opener for me.

Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket
iVillage Member
Registered: 09-30-2004
In reply to: ddnlj
Mon, 04-04-2005 - 10:41am

I have read bits and pieces of it...and I've read a book on relationship in general by the same author.

Steffy
CO-cl of Is It Meant to Be?

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-19-2003
In reply to: ddnlj
Mon, 04-04-2005 - 11:00am
I to have read bits and pieces, but I am not much on self help books or reading about relationship differences. I guess I see enough around me, and experience enough plus I know my self well enough that I haven't had much interest. The book seems to fit but you will always come to those that are an exception. Continue reading and let us know how it works for you.
Photobucket
iVillage Member
Registered: 04-30-2003
In reply to: ddnlj
Mon, 04-04-2005 - 11:24am

I too have read bits and pieces and well, I think it hits on the mark for many men, however, I also noticed most of the men I dated, it didn't fit at all. Strangely, most guys I've dated were emotionally open and able to talk. However, I think current dbf fits the mold of Martian more so than I fit the mold of Venus.


Another good book you may think about reading is Surrendered Wife. It's weird, but interesting. It's basically, how you can "surrender" and basically get what you want from your man. It's talks about how if you ask a man to do something, he won't. but if you "play" him, he will. I personally didn't like that type of game and I felt that if a man won't do something w/o that game, what good is he to me. lol. Meaning...I hate having to play games to get something done.


I liked how that book (Mars/Venus) explained why




my pet!

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-06-2004
In reply to: ddnlj
Mon, 04-04-2005 - 12:56pm

I've read it and I found it to be VERY helpful. One thing I realized after reading it is that if I wanted my relationships to change I was going to need to change my approach. Not who I am or what I want or need, not learn to make sacrifices for love. I just need to learn how to approach things differently. How to "ask nicely", if you will.

It wasn't always easy, it still isn't easy. But it's amazing the difference it makes. One of the biggest things I learned was to just give the guy the benfit of the doubt. IF he didn't take out the trash after I ask him to or he's still levaing his socks on the floor, I no longer assume it's because he doesn't love or doesn't care about my feelings or how hard I work. I assume it's because he forgot. I always assume he loves and is doing his best to show me that, even if I don't always see it.

I don't know if you've got to the part where he talks about getting the guy to stop and get milk on the way home, but when you get there pay attention. It works like a charm. It takes some patience, but if you've already established a nagging pattern it's hands down the best way I've found to reverese the pattern and get what you want.

Because let's face it a LOT of us, bite our noses to spite our face when it comes to our SOs, myself included. We think they should notice the house needs to be vacumed and get hurt and angry when they don't notice and we refuse to ask them to because we think if they loved us enough they would notice it OR we nag and nag and nag, which actually has the exact OPPOSITE effect on them that we want. It just makes them more resistent to doing it. So we just continue these cycles and play these parts until we LEARN how to actually get what we want by asking and not nagging.

Avatar for ddnlj
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
In reply to: ddnlj
Mon, 04-04-2005 - 3:12pm

This is exactly what I'm learning. I'm really bad about assuming the worst, and this book is putting that into perspective for me. It's not making me feel like I'm wrong; it's actually validating this as simply being a woman. Women do have a tendency to "assume" and think the worst. We also think that men read minds. I'm very bad about thinking SO knows exactly how I feel, what I think, what I want to do, when I want to do it and then get mad if he doesn't follow through. That's a woman thing. We're simply wired that way. Men aren't.

So, I'm realizing it's not my fault, and it's not his fault. It's a matter of gender miscommunication. I never realized how emotionally vulnerable men are until I started reading this book. They rarely show it; but they are so easily shot down. They so much want to be the hero, but so many times we women find so much fault with them they just give up. While reading and remembering some of the times I've chewed him out about things because we were arguing, it made me want to crawl under the bed.

Reading this book I can see how relationships fail. Unless two people have exception communication skills it would be hard to make it work. Right now SO is unemployed again, and in a round about way I feel responsible for that. Even though he didn't like the job, he didn't want to end up unemployed and with no prospects for anything else. So, maybe finding this book is a miracle right now. I'm learning how to be supportive of him without being demanding or treating him like a child (which I can also be guilty of. Another woman instinct). Yesterday he didn't call or seem to want to do anything, and my first reaction was "here it is...a beautiful Sunday and he's not here to do anything with, blah, blah" and then last night I read the chapter about how men go into their caves when they have problems. That's what SO was doing. He wasn't avoiding me, he was trying to figure out what he's going to do.

Not right away, but once he's gotten things back on track, I want him to read the book and see what HE recognizes about himself. I think both of us are guilty of many of the miscommunications it talks about because we don't understand men/women as well as we thought we did.

Isn't it great when something falls into your hands like it was meant to be? :-)

Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket
iVillage Member
Registered: 01-06-2004
In reply to: ddnlj
Tue, 04-05-2005 - 8:28am

Yes, it is. I can't even tell you how much my realtionships and my ability to date and be COMFORTABLE around men changed after reading that book.

It reassures you that they aren't the enemy and that they really are trying to love us, they just don't always know how to do it in a way we can understand. I also found it reassuring that I wasn't crazy.

Theres something about coming to the realization that men AREN'T really that different from us, it's only how they express themselves that is different, that is VERY reassuring. Once you learn how they DO express what they feel it makes things soooooo much easier.

It's like men have two ways of expressing themselves 90% of the time. Anger/frustration and going to the cave. The sad part is how often we think they aren't telling us how they feel when really we just don't understand, men don't cry when they're hurting, they get mad. They aren't even mad at us. 95% of the time, they're mad at themselves for letting US down. It's really ironic and very sad.

I know what you mean about the Mom thing and the mind reading thing too. I actually learned both watching my Mom and Dad. Mom treated Dad almost like he was one of us kids most of the time. Growing up I used to get frustrated because Mom would expect me to help her do things around the house but she'd never ask and then she'd go into "martyr mode". Sulking and getting hurt and angry because no one would help her but it was because we didn't know what to do TO help her.

Mom was VERY passive-aggressive and I became that way in my relationships. I was mothering and overbearing and then I read that book and started realizing some of the mistakes I was making and ways that in reality I could make things a LOT easier for myself AND my partner.

Doing the, "Well, if you don't know what's wrong I'm ceratinly not going ot tell you thing" only hurts everyone involved. It's sooooo much better to talk and be open and learn to communicate your upset in a constructive way. Learn to ask for help. In essence learn to be a true partner instead of an indentured care giver.

Men really DON'T want another Mom. They want a partner, just like we do. They want someone who will be there for them, someone they can count on, someone to help them laugh when they're down. All the same things we want and they want DESPERATELY to be those things for us, if only we could tell them how.

It's hard to learn to be a partner how to communicate, how to be honest and open, how to focus on finding solutions instead of bickering about the problem and who casued it. It's hard and requires a good deal of work and being really honest with yourself and having those, "Oh my God, I can't believe I did that and that must have REALLY hurt him", sort of realizations (I've had PLENTY of those). And unfortunately we all have bad days when all those skills we've learned break down and we revert to having temper tantrums and being borish, but, hey, we're human, so we had a bad day. That's why there's make up sex, right? And there is nothing a man finds MORE reassuring when he's feeling insecure then sex with the woman he loves.

Man they're weird!!! :)

Avatar for ddnlj
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
In reply to: ddnlj
Tue, 04-05-2005 - 2:02pm

My mother always treated my dad like a child. When she passed away I was certain he wouldn't be able to do anything for himself, but amazingly he's very self-sufficient. I guess he just let my mom be that way to keep peace. LOL

I finished the book last night. I feel I have gotten so much from it. I couldn't believe that with men and women there is a difference between the words would and could. Woman have a tendency to say "could you do such and such?" Men hear the word could as a demand, not a request. They are much more likely to be cooperative if they hear "would you do such and such?"

Simple things like this I never knew. To me, would and could are interchangeable, but that's not how men interpret it. And I love how the author explained it by saying "a man asks 'would you marry me?' he doesn't say 'could you marry me?'" It made perfect sense put like that.

I think if every man and woman read this book and put it to work for them there would be far fewer relationship problems. Poor communication skills are a huge obstacle to a good relationship. This book literally teaches men and woman how to communicate and understand each other. It might have even helped my marriage if my ex-husband would have been receptive to it, but I know he wouldn't have been. He was not into self-improvement because he was already perfect. LOL

But I'm sure SO will read it, and I'm sure he'll see things that relate to us. This is only the second book I've ever read in my life that's been an eye-opener for me. The first was "The Verbally Abusive Relationship". That book changed my life; and I think Mars/Venus is a life changer, as well.

Photo Sharing and Video Hosting at Photobucket
iVillage Member
Registered: 04-30-2003
In reply to: ddnlj
Tue, 04-05-2005 - 4:07pm

I just wanted to point out to anyone reading this....that although that is a wonderful book and how it truly does describe men, to realize that it's not all men.

For some reason, most men I have dated do NOT fall under the "normal guy" catagory. And therefore, all those books, The Rules, Why Men Love Bitches, Mars/Venus, just doesn't seem to work . lol.

I know The Rules and WMLB would NOT, absolutely NOT work on current dbf, however, he does act like your typical man when it comes to emotions.

You know I'm always being difficult, but although wonderful book, don't generalize and think all men react and act that way. So, for nick and dd, the men you have now, it works, and that's great to understand them....for others, the book may be WAY off.

Just an FYI. Same thing goes for that whole, "he's just not that into you" book. lol. I just wanted to remind everyone of that. I hate that I find the guys that books don't work on. lol. It'd make my life a whole lot easier, that's for sure.




my pet!




my pet!

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-06-2004
In reply to: ddnlj
Tue, 04-05-2005 - 4:33pm

I know what you mean about the whole "could"/"would" thing. Once I thought about it it made sense to me.

I mean, of course, he "could" take out the trash. It's not he's disabled. Of course, he "could" help you with the dusting and vacuming. He "could" pick up hamburger buns on his way home. Sometimes he just doesn't want to.

Asking "could" implies an expectation because you already know he "can" do those things. Asking "would" leaves him with an out to say he doesn't want to as apposed to having to make up an excuse as to why he "can't" do it.

It took the book to make me think about it. Actually, I appreciate the remind. That's one of those things it's easy to slip up and strat doing again. In know it may sound like a lot of work for not much results to some, but for me it has made a big difference. It's really not much to ask when you consider the amount of results you get for that little bit of consideration and extra effort.

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-06-2004
In reply to: ddnlj
Tue, 04-05-2005 - 4:36pm

While your absoluetly right, there are exceptions to every rule, in my experience the ONLY man I have dated for a long period of time this doesn't hold true for was my abusive emotional midget of an ex.

That's not to say abusive emotional midgets are the ONLY exception, but I wouldn't through out the baby with the bath water if you know what I mean.

There's a lot of really good stuff in that book that applies to 90% of men or more.