Have we "ruined things" for men?
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Have we "ruined things" for men?
| Tue, 08-08-2006 - 11:27am |
I was reading Shy's response to one of rebainmi's posts about men being big babies, scared of rejection, even when they know a woman will say yes.

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When I look at my experiences, there are several factors why I am so hesitant before a girl:
1. I was the painfully shy kind, but I think I am improving on that.
2. The environment can be a factor. There are times when I cannot think of a way to approach the girl....
3. Once, I told a girl that I like her, and she turned me down by ignoring me. That was immensely rude. At the time I did feel hurt and I think she had to take some responsibility for it.
I would hate to think that we've ruined it. Women are just cautious and we have every right to be.
I think the guys that are overly pushy on women ruin it for the nice guys. We're so busy avoiding those types that some of the nice onces get stuck in the middle of it.
I've noticed that guys just don't ask women out, or take forever to do so and it drives me nuts. My theory is that a guy needs to take control, part of the whole man, provider, protector thing. As a woman, when I ask a guy out directly I feel like I'm taking the upper hand and demeaning his role, especially if I know he's interested but just isn't taking the next step.
I wonder if it's always been this way? I think we have a tendency to believe that back in the 'olden days', guys actually asked girls out.
I agree with you...with all of the "self help" books on the market, it's hard to know what we are supposed to do and how we're supposed to act when we like a guy or he likes us. Do we play hard to get or are we up front about our feelings? Then, you have to look at the kind of guy that you are involved with (or want to be)...what is his personality like? The boy I've been having the issues with, he seems to be very shy and I think part of it is that he is still hurting from his past relationship, but you know what? I've been hurt too, and I hold back a bit with a new person because I don't want to give everything to that person if my heart is going to be broken in the process, so then what do we do?
I've read HJNTIY and at first, I hated it, but I re-read it and it made sense. Like you Stacey, I do agree that there are exceptions, but I think I need to read that book again, because it's common sense, at least to me. When I like someone, I tell them. I'm not into playing games or hard to get, it seems like a waste of time to me, but then we come off as needy and demanding, it's so stupid!
If a guy is interested in me (or not), I would much rather hear the truth then have him be all wishy washy (like the current one is), but I am removing myself from the dating pool for a while....maybe I'll write a book ;)
My guess would be that she wasn't interested, in general or she was taken. If she would have started up a conversation would you have thought she was equally interested? My perspective is I don't want to lead a guy on, inadvertently and sometimes just being friendly ol' me does that. Then it gets to the point where you have to let him know you're not interested in that way, he feels led on, etc. I think that's probably why I'm not as receptive to male attention, because I fear having to let a nice guy down.
This is the stuff they should teach you in school, haha, how to make your intentions crystal clear from thwe beginning. :)
You should write a book! There are so many out there like, "Why men love Bitches" and stuff like that and I don't feel like it's 'normal'. But then again I guess everybody is different, every rule has an exception.
But sometimes being completely honest and upfront can scare a guy or girl off. Case in point, I met this guy and he was really nice but he came on SOOOO strong and was like instantly 'in love' with me. That's a lot of pressure, especially for a first date. I think in an instance like that it's good to hold back til you guage the other person.
If I was head over heels about a guy (which I am at the moment, but I just know him through work) I wouldn't make it painfully obvious, I'd downplay it until I knew he would be comfortable with me expressing those feelings to him.
I didn't read anyone else's response but when I first read your subject line of have we ruined things for men?, my first reaction is yes, we did but I did not agree with the guy who said when he's talking to a woman he feels like she thinks he's raping her or something like that. My idea of ruining things for men and making them slow to approach is that women are doing the whole approaching and quick to sleeping around very easily and literally making it easy for the guy to take the laid back lazy approach.
I think by women pursuing men and some of them literally almost chasing them, it makes the men feel like well hey? Why should I put myself on the line? Women are getting bolder now and they're asking me out and buying me drinks and taking me back to their place for sex. Why should I put myself on the line when so many women are offering?
That's where I feel like we're ruining them and maybe alot of women do not agree with me on this and I know it's a whole new generation but come on.
I am never going to make it "that easy" for a guy. I'll give him a rope and he can swing on it from there but if he's not taking it, I'm not going to ram it up his you know what.
That's my theory of ruining it for men. They never had it so easy.
Yes you have…, and although I’m in the 40’s age bracket I feel exactly this way.
Let see…, where to begin? Why not a top ten list of the reasons why I won’t even bother to approach a woman anymore:
#10…, I’m tired of paying for everything on dates. This includes but is not limited to: coffee, drinks, dinners, lunches, movies (with soda and popcorn), mini golf, ferry rides, horseback rides, concerts, gas, museums, dinner trains…, I could increase the list ad infinitum (actually to be honest one woman did pay for her half, but very few even offered)….,
#9..., I have had enough rejection already. It all started so long ago…, (flashback to a junior high dance)…, the young lad walking up to some girls in a group and asking one to dance, but simply having them all giggle and say nothing until you’re walking away…, (imagery now returns to the present day) the new dating arena known as Match.com and the like has us all getting rejected multiple times…., it gets old fast….,
#8…, I don’t like 20 questions. It’s like a perverted job interview…, why ask so many personal questions? Why not talk about current events, the state of the union, or crisis in the Middle East? But no…, it’s always about where you work, what type of car you drive, if you own your own home, how many kids you have, what your relationship is like with your ex….,
#7…, I’m tired of trying to keep everything upbeat and fun. Guys have a lot of pressure on them during a date: they have to sense if you like them, get your phone number, ask you out, then try to set up a date which you will like, all the while trying to fend off any awkward pauses in the convo or taboo discussions e.g. religion, sex, money, etc…., which brings us to number six…,
#6…, I’m sick and tired of trying to read a woman’s interest in me…., you know…, you say hi and smile, she says hi and smiles…, so you think wow I think she likes me…., so you ask what her name is and she’s like “Pam”…, but then doesn’t ask what your name is…., you talk a little but she still doesn’t ask…, so you say good bye and figure she just doesn’t like you…, only to find out later from people at work that she liked you…, of course this is after she transferred to a new position elsewhere…,
#5…, I’m tired of e-mailing. I want to hold hands and walk on the beach…, you know the one…., that beach that everyone mentions online about taking moonlight strolls on?..., I want to smell a woman’s perfume…, feel her hair brush past my face…, the touch of her hand on my arm as she moves to look at something…, I’m just not getting that trying to entertain women online….,
#4…, I’m tired of women always being on the cell phone. I mean…, half the time I’m getting coffee, looking for a good book, relaxing at the park, walking down the boardwalk and I see a woman who I would like to say hi to…, she is invariably on the phone yaking. I’ve even been on dated where women have said they “had to answer this” only to hear some BS conversation. I turn my cell off when I go on dates….,
#3…, When I try to just talk to them, they act like I’m trying to rape them (this was posted on this thread)…, yeah…, I can relate to this. Also, they always have their “bytch shield” up…, like the other day I’m getting coffee…, nice looking lady in front of me…, I say “So what sounds good today”…, I get a scowl and she turns away…., who knows, maybe it was the 4th time someone had asked her that…, I was just being friendly…,
#2…, Way too much baggage. Yup…., you heard it here. Maybe it’s just my age group…, maybe it’s just the women I’m attracted to…, but we’re talking kid problems, financial problems, work problems…., I’m just not into all the drama. Yeah, I’ve got problems too…., I just don’t hang them out to dry for everyone to see…,
#1…., and finally…, in the number one spot…., drum roll please….
If you don’t get involved with them you can’t get cheated on…., this can also be phrased: if you don’t marry them they can’t divorce you and take half your assets…,
Don’t believe me…, how about the woman I was going to marry had sex with her personal trainer…., that’s so wrong on so many levels I don’t even want to think about it…, or how about the courts giving my ex wife part of things I owned before I met her!
Adrastos
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