DS - Kindergarten problems - help?
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| Fri, 08-20-2004 - 9:18am |
What should be expected of kids in Kindergarten as far as behavior goes? And when does it warrant special services/something more than the teacher's classroom discipline?
I am asking because since ds started K August 9th, he has come home almost every day with a note that he has gone into "yellow light" for one reason or another. The reasons started out fairly simple and not too big a concern for me: talking when he was supposed to be quiet, mostly. Then he started having trouble keeping his hands to himself. Last week he and 2 other boys had to go sit in the prinicipals office for 15 min for getting into a tussle (from what I understand, it was not real fighting, just friends playing around but they have a no hitting policy). Yesterday the note said that he is having trouble staying in his personal space, he is disturbing the girl sitting next to him (they are on seating change #3 for his partner), got into trouble on the playground for grabbing other kids even after being corrected by the teachers, and so on. And his worksheet had a note on it that even though he understood the concept of the work, he kept asking questions and having the teacher re-explain it to him over and over again. She had mentioned at a parent meeting the other night that she might move his seat away from right near her desk because he has her constantly going over to him to individually re-explain directions to him, while the other students are working.
And of course every note says to reinforce the class rules at home and talk to him about how important it is.....For years we have been trying to teach him to keep his hands to himself, follow rules, etc.... He went to preschool at the same school for 1.5 years.
And before you start thinking "hmmm sounds like ADHD" - he's got that diagnosis if we want to use it. We are not medicating him, and have him in private school (no special ed services in private school). We would have to move him to public school and they are ready to make an IEP up for him if we do so (we had a planning meeting last spring).
I'm just starting to wonder if at some point the teacher or school is going to say something like "perhaps he would be better off in a different setting where he could get services". I honestly don't want to roll over and agree unless that is the right decision. I chose the private school for many reasons, smaller class size being a major one, since I knew he needed a little extra attention. Now the grade is consolidated into a class of 20 in a classroom better suited for 15.
And so, I wonder, how much should you really expect out of a kindergarten child?


But I do think it can be really damaging to a child's self-esteem if he is seen as constantly not making the grade.
We happen to have a friend whose child had trouble keeping his hands to himself, not talking at times, etc in kindergarten at a small private school. At times his behavior and work were exceptional. But there were periods almost daily where behavior was called into question by the teacher. So, despite having excellent behavior 80% or 90% of the time, he got slammed for the other 10% again and again. The poor child got perpetual yellow light cards, and occasional reds, despite his making it through maybe 5 hours per day without ANY perceived misbehaviors.
Is there a way to work with the teacher on a system that rewards these positives, instead of just focusing on the negative? Is there a specific privilege at home (computer or game boy time, time with dad playing catch) that would be a real motivator for your DS? If yes, maybe the teacher can give your child a sticker for every hour during which he keeps his hands to himself and another sticker for every hour when he remembers not to monopolize adult attention, etc.
This could help in a couple of ways - first, even on days when your DS brings home a yellow light card, there may also be a note announcing that he still earned four stickers (maybe when he earns 50 he gets a bionicle??). This way, you can sit down and help him set a goal to earn at least 4 again tomorrow. Or maybe to try for 5. This way, you are congratulating him on the positive aspects of his behavior and cheering him on to earn enough points to get a privilege instead of perpetually focusing on the negative.
Second, if the teacher sets up a sticker chart by hours, she might be able to see a pattern with respect to which hours he perpetually earns stickers in and which hours he rarely does. With respect to our friend's child, after many months, they finally figured out that the behaviors were much more likely to occur on days when their DS had chocolate milk in the cafeteria at lunch. The fact was, the mom didn't know that the cafeteria SERVED chocolate milk, so she never even considered that it was a factor. It's possible that your DS gets stirred up by song and dance activities and has trouble calming back down afterwards. You know?? The more the teacher figures out about any subtle things behind the scenes that might influence behavior, the more likely that she will be able to manage key transitions better.
I hope the school is willing to work with you on this. I definitely wouldn't consider switching schools just yet. There's probably a lot that can be done. Best wishes and many good thoughts - Suzanne
the only thing i'd add is to ask exactly what ds's class is doing? right now alleria's class is just going over the basics and focusing much more on learning the rules and behavior than they are on doing actually schoolwork. for school work they're just going over the easy stuff that everyone knows like days of the week, numbers 1-10, shapes, colors, and abc's. they've not started on anything that requires a whole lot of concentration, and i think that's the way it should be. there's too much to handle behaviorally and emotionally to start right in on reading or math, they have to take it one step at a time kwim?
right now they're only expected to sit still during circle time and arts/crafts time, the rest of the time they're active. if ds is in a private school that is really academically focused early on, you really might want to rethink things. my ds has the same sitation as yours, there's an add diagnosis on his chart and if we need it we have it, but we don't nned it right now. but when he starts school i will be puting him in a montessori style classroom that focuses more on fun than academics for a few grades at least. he's just not going to do well in a class designed to create pre-k geniuses, kwim? he's smart as a whip don't get me wrong, but he's never going to be able to hack the sitting still with your hands in your lap thing. so if it's a high pressure school i'd really honestly consider switching him. not necessarily to public, but perhaps to a private school with a different agenda. whatever you do, be sure that like bigmighty said he doesn't get a failure complex at 5. he needs to feel like he's succeeding and doing well, and if he's not then you have to find some other solution.
hth,
Kindergarten teachers expect that the children will be able to function within a cooperative learning environment in which the child works both independently and as a member of small and large groups. Children are expected to be able to attend to and finish a task, listen to a story in a group, follow two or three oral directions, take turns and share, and care for their belongings. They are also expected to follow rules, respect the property of others, and work within the time and space constraints of the school program. It is important that children learn to distinguish between work and play, knowing when and where each is appropriate within the definition of each.
Well, that is probably what a kindergarten teacher would tell you. First so you know up front I am a homeschool mom and am a homeschool advocate. Teacher training now is a lot different from long ago. Now when teachers are taking classes to earn their early elementary degrees, the classes they are required to attend are more geared for how to manage the "masses" and not geared for teaching individual children. I have first hand knowledge of this, as I myself have taken many of these classes.
A lot of the time when children do not fit into that "box" that teachers are trained to keep them in, they can really start to damage a childs self esteem. Not everyone learns best sitting at a desk doing worksheets. Some children are auditory learners and some sensory learners. Teachers are not taught anymore to accommodate different learning styles. God forbid that a KINDERGARTNER should have repeated questions about learning? That is ridiculous!! He is expected to "get it" on the first try? I would ask very politely why it is such a problem for him to ask questions...especially about learning! Shouldn't it be okay for such a young age to ask questions? Curiosity is usually considered a GOOD thing with learning. Now I would worry more as a teacher if I had a student who was not doing well and then just sat and did not ask questions and was content not to do well. It sounds as if he is trying his little heart out and because of time limits/ and various other factors that he is being labled as disruptive.
Because most teachers now are pressed for time and are attending to the basic needs of kindergartners, these children are being rushed instead of nurtured.
It could also be that he is just one of those children that feel the constant need to be reassured by an adult. Some children want approval so badly that it hinders them in their school work.
Sometimes teachers can start to get annoyed when there is one particular child who does not fit in that "box" as they are taught. Instead of accommodating the child they end up feeling as if every little thing the child does is disruptive.
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I am going to give him a couple more weeks to see how the pattern settles out. We are in kind of a quandry because the teacher is due with a baby in 2 weeks. Her sub will be in for 6 weeks then she will be back. Lovely, huh?
Anyway, I wanted to thank you for the sticker idea. If he stays in green light all day today I told him I would take him to the dollar store after school.
*crossing fingers*
New and improved siggy coming soon (which could mean after Christmas)
Thanks for your response.
They are doing a lot of academics. I have to take another look at his class schedule - the teacher sent it home the other day - but I belive she does 40 min of classwork at the beginning of the day after circle time and another 20 later on. Right now they are working on tracing lines (handwriting skills) and learning basic pre-math concepts, and review of letters. They also have Spanish, PE, library time, and journaling time. Next week they start Accelerated Reader (in K, the books are read to them 3 times then they are tested orally on the comprehension). Just wait til they have to go to weekly school mass next week (45min long!).
I live in a state where PreK is state funded so just about every kid gets it, so by the time they get to K, its practically like 1st grade. Amazingly the state still is not an educational shining star, but they push the kids in all of the schools.
New and improved siggy coming soon (which could mean after Christmas)
and hon, a 45 minute mass sounds like torture to ME, and i'm 23!! i can't imagine puting a 4 or 5 yo through that. are you sure you like this school? lol
I'd lose my mind homeschooling him but I do agree that not every kid learns the same way and unfortunately for him, traditional school style is not quite his fit.
He loves to learn - I have a college level Anatomy and Physiology book that he loves to read and ask questions out of. His IQ is in the 95%ile but his academic skills are average to low average. He can tell you where your patella is but he can sit in front of a worksheet for 20 minutes and not do it because he claims to not understand it (even though he definitely knows the concept).
Fortunately for our family, his dad is in a job where thinking outside the box, selectively applying and ignoring the rules, and being high energy and rambunctious are good qualities (Dad is in special tactics rescue in the military). Because of his father's success, I can look at some of the qualities in my son as more than what the school would view them. Unfortunately he still has to get through the formal education system. So it is a balancing act for us.
The teacher had a worksheet the other day to teach the concept of before, middle and after, and it was visually confusing, so she had the kids get up and they did a physical activity to teach the concept. Personally, I think that would have been the better first choice over the worksheet. Of course, I am not the teacher with 20 kids to control!
Oh, and on the whole medication thing - I am not 100% convinced he has ADHD. He can focus on things for long periods of time when he wants to. He's got a lot of impulsive behaviors, hyperactivity, anxiety, .....We are having a neurologist evaulate his motor tics and I know that kids with tic disorders sometimes have impulse control problems. The school psych for the district was pushing us to get a medical diagnosis over a psych one and I agree. We'll see. I know the school will view a kid with a tic disorder (medical) differently from a kid with the ADHD label (psych/behavioral). Of course the tics are another reason not to medicate.
Thanks again!
New and improved siggy coming soon (which could mean after Christmas)