Justice wants airline ID case kept secre

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-23-2003
Justice wants airline ID case kept secre
10
Tue, 09-07-2004 - 10:51am

Hmmm....so what's everyone's take on this? 


ttp://seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/apwashington_story.asp?category=1152&slug=Airline%20ID


Sunday, September 5, 2004 · Last updated 8:43 p.m. PT


Justice wants airline ID case kept secret


By MAY WONG
ASSOCIATED PRESS WRITER


SAN FRANCISCO -- The U.S. Department of Justice has asked an appellate court to keep its arguments secret for a case in which privacy advocate John Gilmore is challenging federal requirements to show identification before boarding an airplane.


A federal statute and other regulations "prohibit the disclosure of sensitive security information, and that is precisely what is alleged to be at issue here," the government said in court papers filed Friday with the U.S. Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals. Disclosing the restricted information "would be detrimental to the security of transportation," the government wrote.


Attorneys for Gilmore, a 49-year-old San Francisco resident who co-founded the Electronic Frontier Foundation, a civil liberties group, said they don't buy the government's argument and that its latest request raises only more questions.


"We're dealing with the government's review of a secret law that now they want a secret judicial review for," one of Gilmore's attorneys, James Harrison, said in a phone interview Sunday. "This administration's use of a secret law is more dangerous to the security of the nation than any external threat."


Gilmore first sued the government and several airlines in July 2002 after airline agents refused to let him board planes in San Francisco and Oakland without first showing an ID or submitting to a more intense search. He claimed in his lawsuit the ID requirement was vague and ineffective and violated his constitutional protections against illegal searches and seizures.


A U.S. District Court judge earlier this year dismissed his claims against the airlines, but said his challenge to the government belonged in a federal appellate court.


Now in his appellate case, Gilmore maintains the federal government has yet to disclose the regulations behind the ID requirement to which he was subjected.


"How are people supposed to follow laws if they don't know what they are?" Harrison said.


The government contends its court arguments should be sealed from public view and heard before a judge outside the presence of Gilmore and his attorneys. The government, however, said it would plan to file another redacted public version of its arguments.


A date for a hearing on the matter has not yet been set.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 04-16-2003
Tue, 09-07-2004 - 11:58am
<<"This administration's use of a secret law is more dangerous to the security of the nation than any external threat.">>

How can we trust a government who lies and keep secrets and then asks to "just trust us".

<<"How are people supposed to follow laws if they don't know what they are?" Harrison said.>>

This is just too much common sense.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Tue, 09-07-2004 - 2:09pm
Seems George Orwell missed the title of his book by 20 years. It should have be 2004 instead of 1984.

Secret courts, secret laws, without trying to sound paranoid are we going to have secret election result too?

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Tue, 09-07-2004 - 2:43pm

I hate to say this, but we do need to let the government have some secrecy. How are they supposed to catch the bad guys if they have to do everything out in the open?


Let's just say--I'm making this up: What if the reason for showing the ID is that they know that terrorists use a fake ID made from a particular person, and that person has a calling on each ID that the he makes. A small mark, so the terrorists know eachother, or something.


Now the governement has to come out and say "We need to see your ID so we can see if you have an imprint." Now the terrorists know that the govt is looking for this and switch

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iVillage Member
Registered: 03-23-2003
Tue, 09-07-2004 - 5:41pm

Those are all valid scenarios...but that wasn't the point.


iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Tue, 09-07-2004 - 6:06pm

Gilmore first sued the government and several airlines in July 2002 after airline agents refused to let him board planes in San Francisco and Oakland without first showing an ID or submitting to a more intense search.


I don't see anywhere in this article about what they will or will not accept. I

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~ ~ Follow your passion!:&n

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-23-2003
Tue, 09-07-2004 - 7:27pm

Now in his appellate case, Gilmore maintains the federal government has yet to disclose the regulations behind the ID requirement to which he was subjected.


"How are people supposed to follow laws if they don't know what they are?" Harrison said.


I admit, I read it incorrectly (that's what happens when I read too many reports in succession!


iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Tue, 09-07-2004 - 7:53pm

yes, I actually have been searched. I just smile, since I know they are doing their job. If you don't act annoyed that they are doing their job, it's not so bad. I always leave extra time so I'm not stressed, and make their life a little easier. Imagine all the crap they have to deal with.


And I know there can be trouble if we let the gov

------------------------------------


~ ~ Follow your passion!:&n

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-18-2000
Wed, 09-08-2004 - 2:19pm

If I'm not mistaken we've been showing ID at the airport long before 9/11. It's to ensure that the name on the ticket matches the person using it. We've also been asked the question... has anyone given you something to carry in your luggage or have you left it unattened.... or some such question.


I have no problem showing an ID but I really don't like the idea of secret trials where the defendant isn't privy to the charges, therefore, can't defend themselves, against a secret law.


Frankly it sounds very bizarre & scary.

cl-Libraone~

 


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iVillage Member
Registered: 03-23-2003
Wed, 09-08-2004 - 2:41pm

yes, I actually have been searched. I just smile, since I know they are doing their job. If you don't act annoyed that they are doing their job, it's not so bad. I always leave extra time so I'm not stressed, and make their life a little easier. Imagine all the crap they have to deal with.


So do we and that wasn't really my point.


iVillage Member
Registered: 03-23-2003
Wed, 09-08-2004 - 2:48pm

I agree.