Dump Cheney?

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-31-2003
Dump Cheney?
13
Thu, 07-08-2004 - 1:09pm
It's probably just coincidence, but three things caught my attention in today's Wall Street Journal. First, on page 1, just under the blurb about Kerry / Edwards kicking off their campaign, was this brief newslet:

"The White House set a meeting with McCain to resolve a dispute related to the Boeing tanker-lease issue and get him to drop a hold on Pentagon nominees, clearing Francis Harvey's path to become the Army secretary."

(sorry I can't provide links, the WSJ makes you pay for their online edition.)

Then the op-ed page carried an editorial which outlined all the reasons why Bush would be wise to drop Cheney from the ticket. Here's what they're saying:

"This is not your father's Dick Cheney, a bright, principled conservative, respected on both sides of the political aisle for his prudence and civility. Instead, Vice President Cheney has become a rigidly partisan ideologue who shuns relations with Democrats and even some Republicans who don't toe the party line."

"He once was held in high public esteem, but polls show that has changed; he's particularly unpopular with independents and swing voters. Although a virtual certainty to remain on the ticket, this week there's widespread speculation in the capital, among Republicans as well as Democrats, over possible Cheney-dump scenarios."

Does Dick Cheney feel a massive coronary coming on? Is Bush secretly feeling McCain out for the #2 slot in a second term? Would McCain give up his seat in the Senate and service to the people of Arizona for the chance to be in the chute for 2008? McCain has recently said "I will not be vice president of the United States under any circumstances." http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/04/11/mccain.veep/index.html If Bush really is asking, and McCain turns him down would we ever find out about it?

All interesting questions...

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iVillage Member
Registered: 06-09-2004
In reply to: metrochick
Thu, 07-08-2004 - 1:23pm
....Does Dick Cheney feel a massive coronary coming on? Is Bush secretly feeling McCain out for the #2 slot in a second term? Would McCain give up his seat in the Senate and service to the people of Arizona for the chance to be in the chute for 2008? McCain has recently said "I will not be vice president of the United States under any circumstances." ....

I think Not. As pointed out by Rush today on his show overnight polls give Kerry a 2-4 point bounce for picking "Silky Pony" ie John Edwards.... As compared to Algore getting a 17 point bounce when he picked Lieberman and Clinton got a 19 point bounce when he picked Algore. With the flip flopping Kerry being capable of, Edwards isn't the VP choice until it's official in Boston.

Avatar for baileyhouse
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
In reply to: metrochick
Thu, 07-08-2004 - 1:39pm
In the back of my mind I keep thinking that if he isn't booted from the ticket and Bush/Cheney manage to squeak out another victory, with all the Halliburtan stuff and other corporate scandals possibly in the wings could this turn into another Nixon/Agnew situation?? But pulling him can also make the party appear worried about the already in place Admistration...That won't bode well for them either.
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-24-2004
In reply to: metrochick
Thu, 07-08-2004 - 1:41pm
Perhaps it is more along the lines of people waiting to here issues Kerry/Edwards bring up together. Those "bumps" in polls or lack thereof, could just mean people are waiting it out. The other side to this is that almost everyone knows what Bush/Cheney stand for, and he is not in the lead. There may be a close tie between them both but Bush is definately not in the lead. That tells me that most Americans know and do not like him and either going for Kerry/Edwards or waiting to see what happens after the debates. Bush should be scared. He has had 4 long years to prove what he is about and the only thing he can prove is that he can send us to war twice during his presidency. So Bush is going to have to fight even harder than he did the first time to retain his job.
iVillage Member
Registered: 02-23-2004
In reply to: metrochick
Thu, 07-08-2004 - 1:44pm
Personally I respect Cheney-I think he's getting a bad rap mostly because he used to work for Halliburton, a company which has been getting huge wartime government contracts since World War II but according to some owes all of its success to Dick Cheney. It's interesting how the article seems to claim that Cheney used to be bright and principled but is now an unreasonable ideologue-seems to me that has more to do with how the other side is trying to portray him than it does with any facts about the man.

In any case, I think it might have been a good idea politically to dump Cheney before Kerry was the firm nominee, and especially before he picked his VP. If Bush dumps Cheney now he's only going to look desperate. I don't think it will happen, I think the conversations with McCain are probably only about McCain campaigning to bring in some of the swing voters. I don't think it would be a good idea for Bush to dump anyone pre-election, he'll only give the other side ammunition.


Edited 7/8/2004 1:48 pm ET ET by liveanew

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-29-2004
In reply to: metrochick
Thu, 07-08-2004 - 1:47pm
Generalizing it as if there wasn't a 9/11 that happened under his term is a bit narrow minded no? Let's take all things into consideration before generalizing about Bush's decision to go to war. There is only contraversy over one war-Iraq and that is debatable as to the timing and appropriate measure that should have been taken. You make it seem like Bush became President and out of left field sent our troops to war...twice! I can see how some people like to state such things without accounting for all the facts involved. BTW this response isn't about why I feel the Iraq war was a good choice...I am just stating the generalizations made in regards to Bush without accounting for the whole picture.

On another note I would have liked to seen another President cope with the aftermath of 9/11 and how they would have handled other issues then such a monsterous one as fighting terror. I'd rather pay higher oil charges, contribute to the teaching of my children for lack of education, and cut back my driving to help the environment so that more attention could be focused on fighting the war on terror. That's a priority to me as a USA citizen.


Edited 7/8/2004 1:51 pm ET ET by britogal3

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-24-2004
In reply to: metrochick
Thu, 07-08-2004 - 1:56pm
What is the whole picture? We are giving so much to Iraq and in comparison nearly nothing in help to Afghan. Generalizing?? Oh please! The word "terrorists" has been so over used that they had to resurrect the word "insurgents". "Terrorist" now means anyone against the ruling party. Even China is claiming they are in a fight with their own "terrorists".

Did I ever say that the Afghan war was not justified? You may assume that if you like, I just said he proved he can take us into 2 wars during his presidency. Come to whatever conclusion you like, but do not act as though you knew what I was talking about. IT is what IT is, or are you denying the fact that we went to war twice under Bush?

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-25-2004
In reply to: metrochick
Thu, 07-08-2004 - 2:15pm
I agree completely. And all evidence to the contrary, one of the main mantras of this admin has been that they don't lead by polling data, which probably says dump Cheney (I don't know about this - is there a poll on this out there?). Also, Bush doesn't want to be labeled a flip-flopper!

I think he'll stick with Cheney, but I am also bracing for a surpise dark horse (McCain, or maybe even Arnie!) in the 11th hour.

Tangent question to anyone - Could Arnie run for V.P. even though he can't run for President? I was wondering that but have been too lazy to check it out.

Also, I agree that it would have been a good move to dump Cheney a few months ago (I mean have him bow out for health or family reasons, of course) but it's quite late now and would definitely look like a dump. I have to say I'm surprised how well Cheney has held up physically given his health history.

Glassy

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
In reply to: metrochick
Thu, 07-08-2004 - 2:17pm
I hope they keep Cheney! LOL I REALLY want to see a debate between Cheney and Edwards! I think they will dump him though. They know the dems will have a field day with his Halliburton connections. I think if it looks like Bush is gonna lose he will not think twice about dumping Cheney.....


MCCain has said repeatedly that he is not interested. He said once that he spent years locked up in holes as a POW and he did not want to continue that by being VP?!?!?! Something like that...I heard he was on TODAY this morning. From the clips I saw he did not say that he did not want the position. He just said it would be a cold day in some parts of Arizona before Bush dumped Cheney...

**Edited to add the part about before Bush dumped Cheney. Just realized that what I wrote seemed like he said that about being VP but he said that it would be like that before he dumped Cheney. He was talking about how close they were..etc.


Edited 7/8/2004 2:43 pm ET ET by happy2beamom2001

iVillage Member
Registered: 02-23-2004
In reply to: metrochick
Thu, 07-08-2004 - 2:26pm


http://pollingreport.com/wh2004.htm#Misc

It's from back in March, but actually most favor keeping him, especially Republicans:

<"Thinking about the next presidential election, do you think George W. Bush should keep Dick Cheney on the ticket as vice president or do you think Bush should consider replacing Cheney with a different running mate?"


KeepCheney ConsiderReplacing Unsure

ALL 47 30 23

Republicans 66 22 12

Democrats 34 35 31

Independents 42 33 25

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-29-2004
In reply to: metrochick
Thu, 07-08-2004 - 3:07pm
Hey you can get in a frenzy about the word "terrorist" but I happen to think that word is as serious as it gets. What are you complaining about anyways? A word? You don't like for the news to discuss the issues involving such people that have the world all in a jumble due to their hatred and extreme thinking? So I gather you want to blame the current administration for the use of the word? What do you call them? Never did Bush and Co. refer to anyone else other than actual extremists as "terrorists". If that were true he'd have called Kerry a terrorist. Your speaking like a loose cannon here. If I remember correctly it was those against the war using the label "terrorist" to describe our own. Not Bush.

I didn't assume anything either...you put it out there as if Bush is somehow incompetent as a President and doesn't have anything to show except two wars. Read between the lines.

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