Bush: Suspended From Flying

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-24-2004
Bush: Suspended From Flying
16
Thu, 09-09-2004 - 10:47am
Very, very interesting........

Memos Show Bush Suspended From Flying

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&e=3&u=/ap/20040909/ap_on_go_pr_wh/bush_national_guard_33



By PETE YOST, Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON - Newly unearthed memos state George W. Bush was suspended from flying for the Texas Air National Guard during the Vietnam war because he failed to meet Guard standards and failed to take his annual flight physical as required.



The suspension came as Bush was trying to arrange a transfer to non-flying status with a unit in Alabama so he could work on a political campaign there.


A memo written a year later referred to one military official "pushing to sugar coat" Bush's evaluation.


"On this date I ordered that 1st Lt. Bush be suspended from flight status due to failure to perform to USAF/TexANG standards and failure to meet annual physical examination ... as ordered," says an Aug. 1, 1972 memo by Lt. Col. Jerry Killian, who is now dead.


The same memo notes that Bush was trying to transfer to non-flying status out of state and recommends that the Texas unit fill his flying slot "with a more seasoned pilot from the list of qualified Vietnam pilots that have rotated."


The Vietnam-era documents add details to the bare-bones explanation of Bush's aides over the years that he was suspended simply because he decided to skip his flight physical.


The White House said in February that it had released all records of Bush's service, but one of Killian's memos stated it was "for record" and another directing Bush to take the physical exam stated that it was "for 1st Lt. George W. Bush."


"I can't explain why that wouldn't be in his record, but they were found in Jerry Killian's personal records," White House communications director Dan Bartlett told CBS's "60 Minutes II," which first obtained the memos.


Bartlett said Bush's superiors granted permission to train in Alabama in a non-flying status and that "many of the documents you have here affirm just that."


A memo dated May 19, 1972, five days after Bush was supposed to have completed his physical, summarizes a telephone discussion with Bush about how he "can get out of coming to drill from now through November." It says Bush was "told he could do ET for three months or transfer." ET referred to equivalent training, a procedure for meeting training requirements without attending regularly scheduled drills.


The same memo says "we talked abut him getting his flight physical situation fixed" and quotes Bush as saying he would "do that in Alabama if he stays in a flight status." It also says, I advised him of our investment in him and his commitment."


Democratic Party chairman Terry McAuliffe said, "George W. Bush's cover story on his National Guard service is rapidly unraveling. ... George W. Bush needs to answer why he regularly mislead the American people about his time in the Guard and who applied political pressure on his behalf to have his performance reviews 'sugarcoated'"


Bartlett told CBS, "As it says in your own documents, President Bush (news - web sites) talked to the commanders about the fact that he'd be transferring to a unit ... in Alabama that didn't fly that plane," the F-102, the type Bush was trained in.


Using only last names, one of the newly disclosed documents points to sharp disagreement among Bush's superiors in Texas over how to evaluate his performance for the period from mid-1972 through mid-1973.


"Staudt has obviously pressured Hodges more about Bush," Killian wrote on Aug. 18, 1973. "I'm having trouble running interference and doing my job — Harris gave me a message today from Grp regarding Bush's OETR and Staudt is pushing to sugar coat it. Bush wasn't here during rating period and I don't have any comments from 187th in Alabama. I will not rate." Grp refers to a military unit and OETR stands for officer efficiency training report.


The memo concludes: "Harris took the call from Grp today. I'll backdate but won't rate. Harris agrees."


At the time, Walter B. Staudt was commander of the Texas National Guard; Lt. Col. Bobby Hodges was one of Bush's superiors in Texas who two years earlier had rated Bush an outstanding young pilot; and Lt. Col. William D. Harris Jr. was another superior of Bush's.





Records released this year when Bush's military service re-emerged as a campaign issue contain no evidence that he showed up for duty at all for five months in mid-1972 and document only a few occasions later that year.

Asked about Killian's statement in a memo about the military's investment in Bush, Bartlett told CBS: "For anybody to try to interpret or presume they know what somebody who is now dead was thinking in any of these memos, I think is very difficult to do

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iVillage Member
Registered: 07-04-2003
Thu, 09-09-2004 - 10:59am
The 17 pages of documents released on Tuesday night show that Bush flew 336 hours in a fighter jet, most recently in April 1972, and ranked 22nd out of 53 pilots when he finished flight training at Moody Air Force Base in Georgia in 1969.

The White House has said Bush transferred to the Alabama Guard, missed some duty and made it up later, and skipped a required physical exam that cost him his pilot's license BECAUSE HIS TYPE OF JET WAS UNAVAILABLE IN ALABAMA, it said.

The newly released documents were not in President Bush's files, so that's why they weren't released when the rest of his records were. These documents are from Jerry Killian's records.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-24-2004
Thu, 09-09-2004 - 11:04am
Yes I read that, but the question is now why were they in Killian's record and not Bush's?

"I can't explain why that wouldn't be in his record, but they were found in Jerry Killian's personal records," White House communications director Dan Bartlett told CBS's "60 Minutes II," which first obtained the memos."

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-31-2003
Thu, 09-09-2004 - 11:38am
<>>

Hmm....May through November...six and a half months....how long does it take for any trace of drugs to flush out of your system?

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-13-2003
Thu, 09-09-2004 - 12:43pm
Awwww, tough luck again -- proof of forged Killian memos:


UPDATE: Thanks to all the readers who have written regarding this post. Several have pointed out that the Executive line of IBM typewriters did have proportionally spaced fonts, although no reader has found the font used in the memos to be a familiar one or thought that the an IBM Executive was likely to have been used by the National Guard in the early 1970's. Reader Monty Walls has also cited the IBM Selectric Composer. However, reader Eric Courtney adds this wrinkle: The "Memo To File" of August 18, 1973 also used specialized typesetting characters not used on typewriters. These include the superscript "th" in 187th, and consistent ’ (right single quote) used instead of a typewriter's generic ' (apostrophe). These are the sorts of things that typesetters did manually until the advent of smart correction in things like Microsoft Word. UPDATE 2: Reader John Risko adds: I was a clerk/typist for the US Navy at the Naval Underwater Systems Center (NUSC) in Newport RI for my summer job in 1971 when I was in college. I note the following with regard to the Killian memos:

1) Tom Mortensen is absolutely correct. Variable type was used only for special printing jobs, like official pamphlets. These documents are forgeries, and not even good ones. Someone could have at least found an old pre-Selectric IBM (introduced around 1962). Actually, I believe we were using IBM Model C's at the time, which was the precursor to the Selectric.

2) I also used a Variype machine in 1971. I fooled around with it in my spare time. It was incredibly difficult to set up and use. It was also extremely hard to correct mistakes on the machine. Most small letters used two spaces. Capital letters generally used three spaces. I think letters like "i" may have used one space. Anyway, you can see that this type of machine was piloted by an expert, and it would NEVER be used for a routine memo. A Lt. Colonel would not be able to identify a Varitype machine, let alone use it.

3) US Navy paper at the time was not 8 1/2 x 11. It was 8 x 10 1/2. I believe this was the same throughout the military, but someone will have to check on that. This should show up in the Xeroxing, which should have lines running along the sides of the Xerox copy.

4) I am amused by the way "147 th Ftr.Intrcp Gp." appears in the August 1, 1972 document. It may have been written that way in non-forged documents, but as somone who worked for ComCruDesLant, I know the military liked to bunch things together. I find "147 th" suspicious looking. 147th looks better to me, but the problem with Microsoft Word is that it keeps turning the "th" tiny if it is connected to a number like 147. And finally......

5) MORE DEFINITIVE PROOF OF FORGERY: I had neglected even to look at the August 18, 1973 memo to file. This forger was a fool. This fake document actually does have the tiny "th" in "187th" and there is simply no way this could have occurred in 1973. There are no keys on any typewriter in common use in 1973 which could produce a tiny "th." The forger got careless after creating the August 1, 1972 document and slipped up big-time.

In summary, the variable type reveals the Killian memos to be crude forgeries, the tiny "th" confirms it in the 8/18/73 memo, and I offer my other points as icing on the cake.

iVillage Member
Registered: 08-20-2004
Thu, 09-09-2004 - 3:18pm
Why do you need to fly when your daddy is bankrolling you?
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-24-2004
Thu, 09-09-2004 - 8:45pm
All I can say is give me a link..... but here is one for you!

Questions Raised About Bush Guard Service


http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&e=1&u=/ap/20040910/ap_on_go_pr_wh/bush_national_guard

21 minutes ago Add White House - AP to My Yahoo!



By TERENCE HUNT, AP White House Correspondent

WASHINGTON - New documents unearthed in the midst of the presidential campaign fill in some blanks but raise other questions about the sometimes mysterious and spotty story of President Bush (news - web sites)'s military service during Vietnam when he won a coveted spot in the Texas Air National Guard and avoided the war.



Reviving issues that have shadowed his political career, the documents show Bush ignored a direct order from a superior officer and lost his status as a Texas Air National Guard pilot more than three decades ago because he failed to meet military performance standards and undergo a required physical examination.


The disclosures marked the second time in days the White House had to backtrack from assertions that all of Bush's records had been released. It also raised the specter that Bush sought favors from higher-ups and that the commander of the Texas Air National Guard wanted to "sugar coat" Bush's record after he was suspended from flying.


Less than two months before the election, the documents turned the spotlight on Bush after weeks of political attacks questioning John Kerry (news - web sites)'s military service in Vietnam. Overshadowing issues such as jobs and the economy, that controversy raised doubts about Kerry and hurt him in the polls.


Kerry, campaigning in Iowa, refused to talk Thursday about the new Bush documents. "That's for the White House to answer," he said in an Associated Press interview. Presidential spokesman Scott McClellan said, "I think you absolutely are seeing a coordinated attack by John Kerry and his surrogates on the president."


Yet, it was the White House — not Kerry's campaign — that distributed four memos from 1972 and 1973 from Lt. Col. Jerry Killian, now deceased, who was the commander of the 111th Fighter Interceptor Squadron in Houston where Bush served. The White House obtained the memos from CBS News, which said it was convinced of their authenticity, and the White House did not question their accuracy. There was no explanation why the Pentagon (news - web sites) was unable to find the documents on its own.


The key questions about Bush's service are whether or where he trained in late 1972 and early 1973, why he skipped the required medical exam, and whether he was investigated or punished for skipping the exam and six months' worth of training in 1972.


Bush has adamantly denied that any strings were pulled to get him into the guard. Yet, former Texas House Speaker Ben Barnes, a Democrat who now supports Kerry, has stepped forward to say he helped Bush and the sons of other wealthy families get into the guard so they could avoid serving in Vietnam.


Bush completed basic training in August, 1968, and by early 1970 was assigned as a pilot of F-102 interceptors in the 111th Squadron at Ellington Air Force Base. Killian, the squadron commander, ordered Bush in May, 1972, to undergo his annual physical, the new memos show.


Later in May, Killian said in his memo that he'd had conversations with Bush "of how Bush can get out of coming to drill from now through November" because Bush wanted to go to Alabama to work on a political campaign.


Killian wrote that they talked about Bush getting his flight physical and that Bush said he would do it in Alabama if he remained in flight status. But he said Bush said he "may not have the time." The memo said Bush was "talking to someone upstairs" about the Alabama transfer.


The same memo also made clear that Killian was concerned about the fact that the military had spent a substantial amount of money training Bush to fly.


"I advised him of our investment in him and his commitment," he wrote in the memo.


On Aug. 1, 1972, Killian ordered that Bush "be suspended from flight status due to failure to perform to (United States Air Force/Texas Air National Guard) standards and failure to meet annual physical examination (flight) as ordered."


Killian said he wanted a formal inquiry into the circumstances surrounding the flight suspension. No records have surfaced that one was ever conducted.


A year later, in August, 1973, Killian wrote a memo that said SUBJECT: CYA.


He said that Walter B. Staudt, the Texas Air National Guard commander, was pressuring one of Bush's superiors who two years earlier had rated Bush an outstanding pilot. Killian said, "I'm having trouble running interference and doing my job." Killian said that Staudt "is pushing to sugar coat" Bush's rating. "Bush wasn't here during rating period and I don't have any feedback from 187th in Alabama. I will not rate."





Democratic Party chairman Terry McAuliffe said, "George W. Bush's cover story on his National Guard service is rapidly unraveling. ... George W. Bush needs to answer why he regularly misled the American people about his time in the Guard and who applied political pressure on his behalf to have his performance reviews 'sugarcoated'"

White House communications director Dan Bartlett said Bush did not take the physical because he was not going to be in a flying capacity in Alabama. "Those who are trying to read the mind of a person dead 20 years are stretching at best. The president at every turn did what he was told to do."

____

On the Web:

http://wid.ap.org/documents/bush/040908xfer.pdf

iVillage Member
Registered: 08-05-2004
Thu, 09-09-2004 - 8:48pm
I'm just curious: does anybody know how Bush got to be a LT? Also, wouldn't he be programed to fly all types of air crafts in case there was an amergency at a base and didn't have a specific type he was used to and they were low on men or something? XOXO.
iVillage Member
Registered: 02-23-2004
Thu, 09-09-2004 - 9:12pm
Here are three from Drudge:

http://www.cnsnews.com//ViewPolitics.asp?Page=\Politics\archive\200409\POL20040909d.html

http://weeklystandard.com/Utilities/printer_preview.asp?idArticle=4596&R=9FCD2F192

http://abcnews.go.com/wire/Politics/ap20040909_1710.html

Peter Jennings also reported on ABC News tonight that the documents may not be authentic, that they are written in a modern WP typeface and format and so are suspect.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-24-2004
Thu, 09-09-2004 - 9:31pm
Hmm.. well I guess until it is proven that they are fake I will take them as authentic. It worked for Bush and WMD's....
iVillage Member
Registered: 02-23-2004
Thu, 09-09-2004 - 9:53pm


You do that. Personally, as I have done all along (and continue to do on some points) with the SBVT's allegations, I will withold judgement until there is at least a general consensus on the veracity of the reports, or even a worldwide consensus as there was in the case of the WMD's...

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