Debate tonight
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Debate tonight
| Thu, 09-30-2004 - 10:54pm |
So, what did everybody think? This debate was my first (missed last yr's) and I enjoyed it. I liked how they were both respectful to each other and professional. No sighing, making facial expressions, slouching etc. I can't wait for the vp debates. :) XOXO.

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Ok, I agree that there's a difference. I support both. Bush cutting benefits for veterans is a separate issue that I'm not familiar with so can't comment on. Although I will say that I'm interested to hear what you know about it since my husband is a veteran of the first Gulf War.
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Although we are on different sides of this I can totally respect your stance.
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Ok, the ADD crack is kind of harsh. One thing that I find interesting is that Fox News was reporting the other day that although we have no proof that Bin Laden is dead, we also have no proof that he is alive. Apparently there is a lot of speculation about the time of the recording of the audio "messages" that we have gotten that are supposedly from him. Just something to think about...
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I'm not belittling the loss of 13.000 lives, but there have been over a MILLION Iraqis reported missing since BEFORE Saddam was taken out of office.
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I agree that we can't free everyone. I think that before 9/11 we spent too much time trying to save everyone else and that we needed to look more at our problems at home, but that has changed now. Oil has nothing to do with this. We can go to lots of other countries for oil.
They are just regurgitating Drudge & Co.
The truth is China has asked the US many times to enter bi-lateral nuclear talks with North Korea. China itself has had bi-lateral talks with North Korea.
They have a saying in Tennessee, I know it's in Texas I think it's in Tennessee
"You can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear".
Doesn't mean Bush's fans won't try to spin his disappointing debate performance.
For your reading enjoyment, here are some comments posted last night on freerepublic.
(Or are they biased liberals too?)
This is a sad thing. I am panicking....Bush is not doing well at all."
"I agree. The President is taking this very personally and it's affecting his delivery."
"You're not alone....and this topic is the President's strength.
I have a heart heavy with dread and disappointment."
"Bush is trying to remember points covered in debate prep instead of sitting back and talking as he does on the campaign trail.
Bush is not smooth, is too defensive, and is allowing major openings to pass.
This is not going well for Bush, I'm afraid."
"Well we just lost the election.
The President looks like a wimp and responding very poorly. Kerry is confidant and hitting all his points. Kerry sounds convincing.
I think kerry will convince the fence sitters and add the fraud to the mix we will lose.
And I though GWB was going win by a landslide.
What the hell happened to the President.
I just hope that my expectations were so high that any performance by GWB would be poor and any performance by kerry would be good.
I am not very happy right now."
"Kerry is looking really good.....very articulate, many facts back and forth.
BUsh is just saying the same talking points.
THIS IS A DISASTER!
I am just about ready to shut it off....Kerry is going to shoot up in the polls like crazy next week.....it is going to be horrible."
"Kerry just gave a zinger to Bush on the enemy attacking us.
Kerry is winning by FAR.
Disastrous."
"Bush needs more facts, I am very ardent Bush supporter, but Kerry has facts, Bush is not hammering Kerry on things he has said and done in the past. He keeps talking about the messages. Bush needs to get on game or he will lose ground in the polls after tonight."
"Bush is phumphering and sticking too much to catch phrases and cliches.
He is definitely not winning this debate."
"Bush needs to stop hunching over... When shown from behind, as they're doing often, he looks awful, insecure... He needs to be erect.
Man, I don't know how so many of you see this 180 from me. I think that for those who don't know the truth (of Skerry's lies), he's going to convince many that HE's more qualified
His comment ..."Of course I know SBL attacked us. I know that"... What??? ARRRGGGHHH. He's doing AWFUL!!! Wake up folks, and be honest with yourselves."
"Didn't he practice at all?! Geez....he has no facts and figures...Iraq is a huge success, but the American public needs him to clearly tell us...he ain't doing it.
PRAY FOR HIM"
"Bush seems a bit intimidated. Bush still has time, but if he doesn't turn this around, then Kerry's going to benefit quite a bit from this debate. "
"Easy, amigo....if Bush is getting his ass kicked - because he for some reason is NOT rebutting Kerry's lies - he's getting his ass kicked. There's no denying it.
So far, Bush's performance deserves complaints....and if you think I'm a Kerry supporter, have a look at my posting history, Newbie!"
"THIS IS HORRIBLE!!!!!!!!!!!
We may have lost the election tonight. "
"W- keep the sarcasm out of your voice- it sounds condescending."
"You know, my husband is really making me depressed. He is saying Bush is losing this debate"
"I don't think W is doing well at all. I know he's not a smooth talker, but he's way on the defensive and that's because Leher isn't asking anything tough for Kerry to have to defend."
"I totally agree. If Bush says "it's hard work..there's a lot of good people out there working hard...." I'm going to scream.
"He is definitely not winning this debate.
I'm afraid you're right. Bush is trying to remember talking points instead of sitting back, relaxing, and just pointing out all the stuff he knows.
Kerry is very good. He's got command of the facts. Bush is speaking in general platitudes.
I don't like this. Bush is doing just about as poorly as he possibly could do."
"I agree. I had to shut it off for fear of rubbing my face in the floor in frustration. Bush used a 30 second rebuttal to say the same thing he said four times already. Word for word. And even stuttered and stumbled while saying it.
ARGH, here goes the polls up for Kerry. I love Bush, but I don't think he's done well with this. People have gotten bored and moved on to CSI reruns or something on cable by now."
"W has the facts and the message, Kerry has the rhetorical slicks. The mushy middles don't care to process facts. They go for looks. We'll be down in the polls over the next couple days.
I wish that the President's stage presence had been better tonight. He lost some ground, IMO."
"Damn...I thought it was just me. I live in Austin, TX and have seen W in large & small gatherings, and he is SO stiff tonight (over coached?) and Kerry is smarming charm all over the stage, and probably the undecideds.
Content-wise..W is the man..but his usual natural ease, appeals to common sense, and subtle humor just AIN'T there tonight!!! What happened?"
"I think I'm going to be sick. This is not good.
I'm afraid we may get 4 years of a panderer in chief. And I don't mean President Bush."
"Mr Bush is definitely on the defensive. I really hoped it would go better. I was disappointed he did not somehow link Iraq with the 9/11/01 attacks at al qaeda.
Again though, Dick Morris was wrong! He said Bush would cream Kerry in the debates. I wish Dick had been right this time."
"I feel sick in my stomach. I think Kerry is winning hands down. I hate to say it, but its what I feel."
"Listening on radio....The President doesn't sound so hot. Sen. Kerry sounds authorative....even though everything he's talking about is all 2nd guessing."
"I don't think I have ever seen such a lopsided debate. Bush has lost his footing if he ever had it.
Bush sounds like a high school cheerleader speaking against a seasoned veteran.
It is most regrettable."
"Agree. President Bush must stand straighter. He is leaning on the podium which is not a commanding position for any debate. Keep praying everyone...that is the best we can give President Bush."
"Did you hear when Kerry caught Bush in the Saddam did not attack us on 9/11 moment?
What was Bush's response....."of course I know OBL attacked us."
THAT was his response? THAT!!!!!!!!!!
THAT WAS INCREDIBLY WEAK. THAT ONE LINE HAS COST US MANY VOTES TONIGHT."
"I agree, unfortunately. I'm watching on CSpan with the split screen, and GWB looks too fidgety and frustrated. "
"Been watching for an hour.
Bush is like Reagen in that first debate. He sounds beleaguered, and his plaintive tone is unpresidential.
He is on the defensive, and is the LOSER in the debate. He invokes the extra reburral when he has lost the point, and doesn't know enough to let it go when he has little more to say.
I went in thinking Bush would be the powerful victor. but Kerry owns Bush in this debate.
I hope no intelligent undecided voters are watching!"
Any confusion on this issue is due to Bush's misinformation.
Here's a couple of links that show China has met bilaterally with North Korea and is completely open to multilateral talks with bilateral talks on the side, as proposed by Kerry.
This is contrary to what Bush tried to sell in the debate last night.
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July 2003
China and North Korea held ''in-depth'' talks over the weekend on the nuclear dispute between Pyongyang and Washington during a Chinese envoy's visit to Pyongyang, the North's official Korean Central News Agency (KCNA) reported Tuesday.
Chinese Vice Foreign Minister Dai Bingguo held talks Saturday with North Korean First Vice Foreign Minister Kang Sok Ju and ''both sides had an in-depth exchange of views on the nuclear issue between DPRK (North Korea) and the U.S. and international issues of mutual concern,'' said KCNA, monitored in Beijing.
Kong said he had not heard of an attempt by Dai, as reported in the foreign media, to persuade North Korea to join future talks about its nuclear weapons program in a multilateral framework with separate bilateral meetings on the sidelines.
Kong said China, North Korea's main ally and biggest aid donor, is open to the participation of any party in such future talks.
He also called for the continuation of the dialogue process brokered by Beijing in April that brought senior U.S. and North Korean officials together for the first time in half a year.
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0WDQ/is_2003_July_22/ai_105676006
May 2004
"Their positions look even tougher now than a few days ago," a diplomatic source told Russia's ITAR-TASS news agency.
Even so, the US and North Korean delegations "prepared to meet bilaterally" on the sidelines of working-level discussions that also involved China, South Korea, Japan and Russia, Japan's Kyodo news agency said. ...
http://www.findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_kmafp/is_200405/ai_kepm467092
Miffy - Co-CL For The Politics Today Board
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