Busy work

iVillage Member
Registered: 02-19-2008
Busy work
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Sun, 12-07-2008 - 1:31pm

I understand our President Elect wishes to rebuild highways, bridges, schools, broadband, and other stuff.

Which sounds nice.

However the Eisenhower Highway system is already built. Most who want broadband have it. Most kids have a public school, which were generally available to all over a century ago.

Shouldn't a wise future looking leader seek to find things for us to do which create new capabilities for our country? Isn't rebuilding what we already have, not adding much to our infrastructure, economic or cultural capability?

If the argument is our roads, broadband, schools and what not are in such a disastrous state of repair that only a complete rebuild will prevent schools from collapsing on children ... then shouldn't we remove the current management structures which have created this mess?

Shouldn't we federalize the school system as an example. How about federalizing all highways? You know to assure stuff gets done right. I understand the NYC MTA is in trouble, how about we just federalize all mass transit. I mean it's not like there has ever been any mismanagement at Amtrak!

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iVillage Member
Registered: 11-20-2008
In reply to: postreply
Sun, 12-07-2008 - 1:45pm

"Most who want broadband already have it"

That is not actually the case, many rural areas do not have access to broadband. Where I live there is very limited broadband access outside of the largest towns, the smaller towns still have to have dial up - most use satellite for television as they are not served by cable TV either.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 10-25-2006
In reply to: postreply
Sun, 12-07-2008 - 1:49pm

No way! The government has never spent one penny wisely, except for all those billions spent on wars.

I think we should give all the tax revenue to the Wall Street CEOs to create some more fancy debt instruments. That will get money to the corporations, create jobes and get this economy rolling again. Then we can pretend we're wealthy and live at least a few more centuries on funny money!

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iVillage Member
Registered: 02-19-2008
In reply to: postreply
Sun, 12-07-2008 - 1:49pm

http://www.hughesnet.com for anyone who can view the southern sky.

Many wireless providers offer 3G data access for $59 a month which is a version of broadband. The advantage is high speed access to internet just about anywhere in the U.S.

http://www.wireless.att.com/cell-phone-service/cell-phones/pc-cards.jsp




Edited 12/7/2008 1:53 pm ET by postreply
iVillage Member
Registered: 08-13-2008
In reply to: postreply
Sun, 12-07-2008 - 1:55pm

Highways and the components of highways have limited shelf life. Time and weather and traffic has its way with these systems.


In the northeast, winter raises hell with our roads, which in this state are built to a minimum depth of four feet in order to get under the frost line of maximum winter exposure. In other words, building a highway here means either excavating to that depth and filling upon it to at least four feet, or filling four feet above current grade.


These are exacting constructions, with specific materials used in layers.


We have to carve off the decks of bridges every 20 years or so and lay down new concrete, redo joints, and then repave.


Those bridges near the coast suffer from both cold and salt erosion from the sea. As an example, in the hurricane of 1938, some houses *in Vermont* were 'sandblasted' with ocean salt. Check that out on a map.


For roadbeds, they need paving once every six or seven years, usually a scraping of the topmost layer and then repaving. Every


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iVillage Member
Registered: 02-19-2008
In reply to: postreply
Sun, 12-07-2008 - 2:13pm

All of your concerns have already been addressed by the National Highway Trust fund, which was established in 1956. I don't think solving a problem which was already solved over 50 years ago is progress.

http://www.nemw.org/HWtrustfund.htm

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iVillage Member
Registered: 11-20-2008
In reply to: postreply
Sun, 12-07-2008 - 2:17pm

You are in error regarding broadband. In many rural areas, unless one wants to pay through the nose for satellite service (which has slow uploads, BTW), there is no broadband service, either via DSL or cable service. It's a situation similar to that of electricity in the 1930's. Most utility companies didn't want to incur the cost of running lines out to far-flung farms (how's that for alliteration!) so the rural electric cooperatives were formed and subsidized. Given the fast and easy access to information which the internet can provide, those who don't have broadband are operating on a far-from-level playing field. And it seems to me that telecoms and cable companies have indulged in divvying up territories and then price-fixing. I live within Albuquerque city limits but would have to pay over $50 a month to have high-speed internet through customer-unfriendly Comcast. Qwest mails me inserts within my phone bill, touting their fiber-optic system or their low-for-life rates. Whoopty dooh dah. There are no DSL lines to my neighborhood.

Also cracks me up about the Eisenhower system! It's as old as the Eisenhower administration--half a century. Do you REALLY think that there is no deterioration over time?! That said, I'd like to see us move away from the inefficiency of personal transit to other alternatives both between cities and within them. Why not look into updating the railroads?

I am going to repeat something I've said before. It's not the size or ideological nature of government which factors into efficiency or incompetence (See: "Heckuva job, Brownie"). It's the people who are leading, the people who occupying the jobs. Their performance matters most.


edited to correct a misspelling.


Edited 12/7/2008 2:21 pm ET by altered08ego
iVillage Member
Registered: 08-13-2008
In reply to: postreply
Sun, 12-07-2008 - 2:22pm

Not really... these are ongoing issues that require real time funding. I93 was built to handle traffic a third of what it is now, thus the need for widening - it is a dangerous stretch of interstate.


When funding is scarce, we must prioritise projects, and as a result the NE states have a significant number of bridges on defficient lists.


In an environment where we need to get people working, this is an excellent place to begin. My understanding is Obama is looking for projects ready to go - these projects, delayed around the country due to lack of funding - are ready to go.


It makes little sense to ignore these things in favour of new things that will also deteriorate at some point. We need to show we can maintain and build forward, not let fall apart and build something else.


Build upon what we have, adding the new for the future. Do not ignore what is already here.

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Full length fiction: worlds undone

"You have no power over my body..." ~ Anne Hutchinson

iVillage Member
Registered: 02-19-2008
In reply to: postreply
Sun, 12-07-2008 - 2:28pm

There is no need for a wired solution for broadband as an example. The cost per mile of copper cable is about $200,000 according to most sites I look at.

In low population density areas it doesn't make sense to run copper. It does make sense to have wireless access.

As to concerns about Comcast. I'm a Comcast user and couldn't be happier with the great service and fast speed at a reasonable cost. Do you really expect the government to lower Comcast HSI prices?

You may be interested in the following - http://www.usatoday.com/tech/wireless/2008-05-30-internet-free-fcc_N.htm

As for the National Highway Trust fund, which has been building and maintaining highways for over 50 years. If you don't believe it works, then perhaps you don't believe the federal government can solve the problem of creating and maintaining highways. After over 50 years, if it you still think it doesn't work, it probably never will.

Diverting highway trust funds to subsidize mass transit has been to the detriment of highway maintenance. I wonder if President elect Obama will stop this misuse of federal funds.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 02-19-2008
In reply to: postreply
Sun, 12-07-2008 - 2:33pm

It takes MANY MANY years for a highway improvement to be started. Usually there are site surveys, environmental assessments, traffic studies, meetings with government officials, both elected and those who run agencies. Eventually the public and courts have significant inputs.

After a MANY years, a proposed upgrade may be sent out for bids. This can result in additional delay and other litigation. Often state DOT's are in charge, and have corrupt agendas. Eventually a road may be built.

In my state, there is a road improvement which was scheduled to be started in the late 1960's, that is about 1/4 the way done and is stuck. To the best of my understanding it will be stuck waiting for funds for some time. After about 1/3 of the project is complete, there is no agreement due to litigation to continue the upgrade.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 08-13-2008
In reply to: postreply
Sun, 12-07-2008 - 2:33pm

Transportation is not an exclusive proposition - it is an inclusive one that works across roads, railroads, water, and air.


Of course it makes sense to use monies for mass transit. It makes sense to maintain roads, and all of the above - they all serve good purpose, but we must also take care to do these things wisely, with minimal impact.

Full length fiction: http://llhaesa.org/ (pronounced la.hay.ess.sa)



Full length fiction: worlds undone

"You have no power over my body..." ~ Anne Hutchinson

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