HOPE & CHANGE:. . .Obama Style???

iVillage Member
Registered: 04-04-2001
HOPE & CHANGE:. . .Obama Style???
99
Mon, 07-26-2010 - 2:53pm

From The Sunday Telegraph:



Axe falls on NHS services
NHS bosses have drawn up secret plans for sweeping cuts to services, with restrictions on the most basic treatments for the sick and injured.


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iVillage Member
Registered: 04-04-2001
Tue, 08-17-2010 - 4:38pm

So, it begins. . .From the UK Telegraph:



US breast cancer drug decision 'marks start of death panels'
America's health watchdog is considering revoking its approval of the drug Avastin for use on women with advanced breast cancer, leading to accusations that it will mark the start of 'death panel' drug rationing.


iVillage Member
Registered: 05-14-2010
Thu, 08-19-2010 - 11:10am

I do think the case of childhood ALL is much different than that of an 85 yo with diabetes, high blood pressure, CHF and COPD who is stuck in a nursing home and either bedridden or wheelchair-bound; and then gets sent to the hospital for a $50,0000 "splurge" in the last week of life.

Still missing the point. This is not a problem with health care reform or delivery. These stories only occur because of the pressure applied by unreasonable or guilty families. We've ignored mom for months or years but now she's dying, "Do everything for mom." The doctors, nurses, administrators and even housekeepers may know the care is futile. BUT when mom's family says she's a strong woman, very healthy, worth the effort they are just wrong and unreasonable. They are also irrational and threaten the system directly and indirectly with lawsuits, defensive medicine practices as well as simply draining the life out of the system. Providers get worn out and depressed in such futile care and are even driven from the system. It is not really the providers fault. They are pressured to provide. Its unacceptable to die in the USA.

Dont mistake this for an agreement with government directed rationing. This will happen with your EBM (evidence based medicine) guidelines which are incredibly flawed. It will also happen because of financial constraints (imposed). BTW dont expect government health care to provide Cadillac service at the price of a Smart car. Free = you get what you pay for.

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-25-2006
Thu, 08-19-2010 - 12:35pm

I know the providers are not necessarily to blame and that sometimes it's the families demanding care for their loved ones.

Rationing is okay, and inevitable. That's why it happens now, with our current health care system. To pretend it is a phenomenon that occurs only with gov't-provided health care/insurance is wrong. If everyone would talk straight and clearly state their goals, whether it is to annihilate the federal government, to take all they can get and to hell with everyone else, or to redistribute the wealth from the rich to the poor (my preference), we might actually be able to elect representatives that would serve the majority of voters AND bring health care costs under control.

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http://www.pnhp.org/news/2009/october/meet_the_new_health_.php

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DQTBYQlQ7yM

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-15-2010
Thu, 08-19-2010 - 12:35pm

Huh? No relevance.

Sorry. You should not be permitted to leave your paid off house to your relatives on the one-hand yet demand treatments that might prolong your already spent live by a few months at a cost to the taxpayers of tens of thousands of dollars.

At some point common sense must prevail. News flash! Everybody dies. If you want to use extreme measures for minimum returns--it should be at your own expense or the expense of your family--not someone elses.

>>Luck is what you call it when preparation meets opportunity<<
iVillage Member
Registered: 05-14-2010
Thu, 08-19-2010 - 12:44pm
Another problem is the entitlement mentality that you or someone stated in the example of their mother getting a test only because it was paid for by someone else. I am that someone else. This holds true for all entitlement programs. Welfare, SSI, healthcare, medicare etc. It's human nature. It's hard for people to see that this isn't really something for nothing.
iVillage Member
Registered: 07-19-2010
Thu, 08-19-2010 - 2:02pm
Excellent post. Well said!
iVillage Member
Registered: 10-25-2006
Thu, 08-19-2010 - 4:45pm

Yes. It really is a problem when this society wants to help the elderly, the infirm and the poor.

I can't rid my mind of the "feed the poor", "share with strangers" and "take care of those who need help" gospels I've heard since childhood. It's hard for me to understand why so many American people see that as a problem. Have they all become atheists?

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http://www.pnhp.org/news/2009/october/meet_the_new_health_.php

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DQTBYQlQ7yM

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-15-2010
Thu, 08-19-2010 - 5:01pm

I was taught those things too. Except it was taught as a personal responsibility. I wasn't taught that it's right or good to demand that others do what I think is right but that it was their right to make decisions for themselves.

You see those others who I'm able to take from via my government may have other things they'd like to use their own earnings for....like maybe they're rather help real starving people in some part of the world and not somebody who you'd like them to help here that may be far less needy.

But that's neither here nor there and doesn't speak the entitlement attitude mentioned in the post you were responding to.

People will always take what they get when someone else is paying for it. Hence the story about my mother and her "sleep study". No way would she have ever signed up for that if it was on her own dime! I remember a similar story regarding my MIL who had a little cut on her finger and rather than go to a walk-in clinic to have it looked at (she was on vacation so had no regular doctor in the area) she instead chose to go to the nearest Emergency Room! We told her that was not appropriate as emergency rooms were for emergencies and that it would COST a whole lot more for her to be seen there but she said "Why would I care? My medicare covers it." Then she complained ad nauseum because her emergency room "visit" took 3 hours.

Now had you told her it was going to cost her "out of pocket" an extra $20 to do the emergency room things--she would have demanded to go to the walk-in clinc.

I've seen similar scenarios played out over and over again with a whole variety of people I know who have insurance of one sort or the others. They do things quite differently when they're not being directly affected in their pocketbooks.

People need to be incentivized to make smart choices. If they wouldn't spend their own money on something then why should they be permitted to waste someone else's money that way?


>>Luck is what you call it when preparation meets opportunity<<
iVillage Member
Registered: 05-14-2010
Fri, 08-20-2010 - 1:50am
Great response
iVillage Member
Registered: 08-19-2010
Fri, 08-20-2010 - 2:44am
Those "gospels" called for charity...not a "redistribution of wealth."

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