He's definately coming undone

Avatar for nutmegspice
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
He's definately coming undone
13
Fri, 09-30-2005 - 7:55pm

Isn't there a completely depressed icon?

Since 18 months old we've been having the hitting problem with Sam (now 6.) It came to a head at about 3 yo (pre AS dx) at daycare. I switched to a home based daycare so I could get through my last semester at college and then he went to a *really* great private preK. The problems continued. We were all very unhappy and I was miserable, thought it was my fault...etc....etc. We have tried everything, even the biomedical approach starting with Feingold and ending with the Specific Carbohydrate Diet; even got him some accupressure treatments. The AS dx really helps explain why and why he's having such a hard time controlling his hurting others, but it's still killing me.

Kindy went really well; I was not expecting him to regress sooooo much in 1st grade. Today someone growled at him during carpet time and he kicked him in the mouth, made him bleed. He pulled off a classmates glasses at recess and threw them because she was being mean to someone else. I sent a note today about the line thing and his teacher gave him a laid-back partner to stand at the front of the line with him and thought he was going to have a pretty good day. He's having these pretty bad hurting incidents at least once a day and I just don't think I can take it. It kills me that he's hurting other people and nothing seems to get through to him. I haven't tried social stories or any kind of visually based method other than library books on feelings....etc. I really don't know what else there is to do to help him. He is really having a horribly hard time these past few weeks and I'm afraid to bring him to school.

I have a call in to the SpEd dept to set up a meeting earlier than the Oct IEP. There is an ASD Kindy/1st grade class that he may be able to go into. He wasn't officially elligible for services when they assigned teachers and I don't think anyone saw this coming at all. He can't even stay focused long enough to get any of his work done. He just starts scripting and stimming in his seat. I still can't believe that it took this long to get anyone to notice; I started asking for help with this 3 years ago and I feel like we've gone nowhere. I just hope a better teacher/student ratio will help him feel less stressed out. I think he's just soooo overwhelmed by the work load, class size and increased demands placed on him that he's gone over the edge.

I too could use a glass of wine or two.

Chrystee

Photobucket www.idlehand

Pages

iVillage Member
Registered: 02-24-2004
Fri, 09-30-2005 - 9:56pm

Chrystee,

Nathan is pretty overwhelmed by 1st grade too. His tendencies have escalated as well. Even though he doesn't resort to physical type responses, he too stims alot and his mind wanders constantly in class. I can't imagine that the school hasn't decided to move his IEP up, or even do something to help Sam out for the time being. From what you've written, it seems as though something should be done soon.

What I did with Nathan, was read him stories that involved feelings.....and then talk with him about the book and what had happened. Can or does Sam have conversations with you? I will also do this "discussion" thing with him, if we see something....like on TV or at the store. I found that with Nathan, constant reminders are necessary. And alot of things just take him longer to learn too. Our conversations are short, he doesn't like to talk about things he's not interested in!! LOL Nathan does "go after" his brother at home though. He doesn't do this at school, he's rule follower. But at home he's more comfortable, and will lash out at his brother if he gets upset.

I hope the standing in line thing works out for him. I know how stressful our little guys can get. Anyway, just wanted to give you some hugs!

Michelle

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-13-2004
Sat, 10-01-2005 - 1:06am

>>I haven't tried social stories or any kind of visually based method other than library books on feelings....etc. I really don't know what else there is to do to help him<<

Chrystee, I can't urge you strongly enough to incorporate visuals when teaching behaviour. Whenever one uses oral prompts with an autistic child, all they hear is "blah, blah, blah, friend, blah, blah, hit, blah". Someone once described it to me like this:

You're in a swanky restaurant and you read the menu. You have a good understanding of what's on offer and are well on the way to making the choice. Then the waiter appears and recites the "specials of the day". He gives you very detailed description of three meals and when he's done, you've got no idea what he's just said. This is what it's like to be autistic.

There are some great books about putting together visuals. One of my favourite authors is Linda A Hodgdon. Have a look at her book "Solving Behaviour Problems in Autism" It's available on Amazon. Another good book is "A Treasure Chest of Behavioural Strategies for Individuals with Autism" by Fouse and Wheeler.

If you need help putting together some visuals, email me through my profile.

Dress Up Games, Doll Makers and Cartoon Dolls @ The Doll Palace
iVillage Member
Registered: 06-25-2003
Sat, 10-01-2005 - 9:31am

(((((((Chrystee))))))),

First of all. it's not your fault, so don't beat yourself up about this.

It sounds like Sam could definitely use more support at school, and that you could use some help, too. In our district, if a child is classified as "autistic" the parents are automatically entitled to 1 hour of parent training with an autism specialist at home each week, (This can be amended upwards, but not downwards, unless the parent expressly requests it) I think it is a NYS rule, not a district one.

As for this special class: Ask to see it in action, and find out why kids are placed there. Is it a class for ASD kids, or for 'behavioural' kids? If the latter, it may NOT be the ideal placement for Sam. They need to address his behavours as ASD issues, not as straight behaviour issues. There is a difference. Also, for this class: What emphasis is paced on academics? How do they appropriately teach kids of different academic levels? Find out if there are any suitable ASD placements locally, either privately or in adjoining districts, so that you are armed with answers if they try to give you the "sorry. we have no other option" story.

GL and HTH

-Paula

-Paula

visit my blog at www.onesickmother.com
iVillage Member
Registered: 11-05-1998
Sat, 10-01-2005 - 11:52am

Chrystee--Have you read "Asperger's Syndrome and Difficult Moments" by Brenda Myles Smith (or maybe it's Smith Myles--I can never remember). It's a good resource for parents (like me) with agressive kids.

If it makes you feel any better, when my Chris was in first grade, he did such things as: hitting people, kicking, choking, kicking a pregnant lady in the belly, stabbing another child with scissors.

With Chris, it was a mixture of aggression and impulsivity. Now, you and I know that every day there is at least one person in our day that we'd like to smack across the face or kick in the you-know-where. But we don't, because we have impulse control. We think evil thoughts in our heads, smile, and go about our day. Lots of AS kids don't have that impulse control. It's "feel it, do it" with them.

What was a lifesaver for Chris was medication. We put him on Risperdal and it helped immensely with his agression and impulsivity. We discovered that behind the "evil child" was a delightful kid who was soooo grateful to have some way to stop himself before he did something he didn't want to do. I know medication is not for everyone, but it was a godsend for us. Once the Risderal calmed him down, we were able to reach through and teach him some coping skills and techniques that he wouldn't have been able to process unmedicated.

I hope this helps a little.

Elizabeth

Avatar for nutmegspice
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Sat, 10-01-2005 - 7:24pm

Thsnks, that is very helpful.

In so many ways Sam is classic AS, but then he has such a hard time with letter recognition and learning to read plus this aggression stuff that I don't know where to turn to get him help. I haven't really heard from many parents with AS kids with such horrible aggression I was starting to feel that the dx was incomplete or incorrect. The learning thing has me puzzles since most AS kids excel academically and Sam clearly does not.

We're definately to the point that we would try meds. We've pretty much exhausted all other options in the last 3 or 4 years, behavior modification, diet....etc with not long term consistent results. We just need to get him in with the right people who understand what's going on.

Just knowing there are others out there who have dealt with this is loads off of my mind!

Thanks

Chrys

Photobucket www.idlehand
iVillage Member
Registered: 10-03-2004
Sat, 10-01-2005 - 10:54pm

Dear Chrys,

This will be my 3rd attempt to write, I've somehow nuked 2 replies, Augh! Welcome to the board, and wow, have a big glass of cyber wine and chocolate, OK. And here's a few ((((HUGS)))).

AS kids often struggle academically. Every single person with autism is completely different from every other, and diagnosis here is just not an exact science. If the AS kid's sensory needs are not being met, they can't focus TO excel academically...

Sounds to me like very few modifications are being made for your son in first grade,and this almost always doesn't work. Is there an autism expert working with you and the school, how has his evaluations etc. been handled, decisions being made about how to handle his mainstreaming? Being sent to the principal's office is ridiculous, completely ineffective, unless it's the only quiet, safe place he can calm down. Without really knowing much, sounds like noone there really understands his difficulties and how to help him.

The aggression is that his body is out of control, the setting without enough modifications is overwhelming to him. He currently CAN'T stop hitting, his body is reacting to what his sensory system perceives as imminent threat. A smaller size classroom would certainly lower his anxiety, next the quality of teaching and mix of other children in that smaller room is just as crucial to his well being as the current too-big size and lack of appropriate mainstream accomodations.

Here's the thing. You can't ask for school districts to do the right thing. This will cost them loads of money, time and effort, and is an ongoing huge amount of work! But if you want him to succeed in mainstream, you will need to insist and hold them to the law, which IS in your favor here, Least Restrictive Environment. Without making the accomodations, you have no idea if the setting can be made to work for him or not!

Maybe medication is a place to start. Anyways, the issue is the anxiety and stress, and how to allievate the overwhelm, no matter what you decide.

Stay in touch, I hope we can be helpful. It is so painful when our children are in real trouble.

yours,

Sara
ilovemalcolm

Avatar for googolplex
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-31-2003
Sun, 10-02-2005 - 1:49am

Chrystee,

I see that the subject of medication has come up, and I'd like to offer my 2 cents on that. There is a book called "Straight Talk About Psychiatric Medications for Kids" by Timothy Wilens, MD, and I consider it to be a "must read" for parents who are considering medication for their kids. I have a child who needs medication, no two ways about it. Sometimes that's just how it is. This book is full of information to help you make an informed decision about medications. The doctor might prescribe something, but you are free to say, for instance, "I'm concerned that this medication can trigger mania" or "I'm concerned about the possible weight gain associated with that medication" or "It looks like this medication is meant to treat symptoms that Sam doesn't have...." You get the picture.

I know how hard it is when our kids do socially unacceptable stuff like hitting. David didn't hit, but he used to run out front and grab the neighbor kids' jump ropes or balls (as they were playing with them) and run around with them then throw them in a bush. He'd do it in a gleeful way, as if it was just so hilarious. I was mortified and confused...and punishing him backfired big time. Of course, I looked like the most ridulously BAD parent ever. All the perfect children would just stare, open-mouthed at us, as if they had never seen such a spectacle, and the perfect parents would avert their eyes so as not to catch whatever demons we obviously had.

So, big hugs, and I hope Sam gets the supports he needs.

Evelyn


Avatar for nutmegspice
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Sun, 10-02-2005 - 8:11pm

Thanks! I'm checking those books out right now at Amazon!

I've been in a bit of denial since the dx in the spring and the new baby coming at the same time! Sam did soo well in Kindergarten that nobody was expecting this!

I'm kicking into serious mom mode right now. If not to get done what needs to get done, to at least keep me busy feeling like I am doing something about it so I don't get depress and stressed out worrying about something I can't entirely control!!!

Thanks a bunch!

Chrys




Edited 10/2/2005 8:17 pm ET ET by nutmegspice
Photobucket www.idlehand
Avatar for nutmegspice
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Sun, 10-02-2005 - 8:20pm

Thanks, good questions about the special class. I'm pretty sure it's an ASD class, but am curious about the academics there. I'm hoping to meet up with everyone this week for an emergency meeting to figure this out.

Thanks!!!

Chrys

Photobucket www.idlehand
Avatar for nutmegspice
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Sun, 10-02-2005 - 8:37pm

<>

Thanks I needed to hear this! Everyone I talk to is surprised that he's AS and has such trouble with reading; that's probably why I am so worried about that and got surprised by the reappearance of his aggression problem.

I got the AS dx from a private eval. this past spring. By the time the school dist. got it it was too late to set up the IEP...etc for this year. We put off setting up the IEP officially because they wanted to reevaluate him for speech and OT ( the last evals were over a year ago.) This is why he has few accomodations right now. It was a different teacher who sent him to the office, his teacher said she never would have done that; the incident happened after recess in line. At our initial meeting these aggression issues weren't such a problem for him and they certainly weren't to this extent last year in KIndy.

I think the increased demands of 1st grade have caused an incredible amount of anxiety and the larger setting is not working for him. He was not getting OT regularly last year (only privately and every other week.) Our very loose sensory diet didn't seem to help prevent aggressive outbursts caused by social stress or overstimulation. That was last year, this past week has been horrible. We used to think that his sensory sensitivities caused the stress and that caused the behavior, but now I think the social situation makes him anxious and nervous and that throws his sensory system off and leads to the behavior. Does that make sense?! We haven't been able to come up with something to prevent certain outbursts. The best way to prevent them is to have a caring adult close by to intervene, so he will need a smaller setting and an aide. Trying to get one should be fun ;)

Thankfully there's a great nonprofit around here that offers assistance with IEPs, visual systems, general advice...etc for ASD kids. I shall be calling tomorrow!!!!

Thanks again

Chrystee

Photobucket www.idlehand

Pages