RACOON EYES!!!!

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-26-2006
RACOON EYES!!!!
10
Wed, 07-26-2006 - 8:21pm
My oldest daughter is 13- soon to be 14- and insists on wearing THICK BLACK Eyeliner. I have had people tell me it's just a phase and she'll grow out of it etc. It's just getting to me and she just looks trashy and I can't just let it go anymore. I've tried at first to ask gently that she should tone it down a little, SO she started making it darker and thicker. So I've gone the other route and told her that I'd throw it all away if she doesn't lighten it up a bit. She always seems to find a way to get more, either gets into my makeup or my Mary Kay inventory. By the way, I wear very little.. It's a battle every day and I now will refuse to go anywhere with her when she looks like that. She has BEAUTIFUL green/hazel eyes and the black just makes them fade away and you don't see them anymore. NONE of her friends wear make-up so I don't understand why she insists on wearing so much. Her friends have said things to her about it too.
HELP PLEASE!!!!
iVillage Member
Registered: 06-15-2004
Wed, 07-26-2006 - 9:25pm

It sounds like a power struggle. You say no, she goes for more. I bet if it didn't bother you, then she wouldn't be so adament about wearing more. I know you say you can't take it anymore, but if you think of all the other things she could be doing- drinking, smoking, stealing- it's not so bad. Pick your battles, because bigger ones might come along soon.

With that being said then, see if you can set her up with an older cousin, aunt, etc. Someone that she looks up to, and someone you (AND your DD!) thinks has a good sense of style. Let her put make up on your DD, or show your DD how to bring out her best features. Don't tell your DD "I hate all that black make up! X is going to show you how to do it right!" because that will just enforce the power issue, but make it more subtle, by having them go out to a movie, or get manicures and have a girly day, so that doing make up seems natural, and just tell the older person about how you want her to show your dd to wear more flattering make up, not your DD.

I also know about a store at our mall has days when they'll do people's make up and tell them about what looks good on them. like a class. It's geared toward 12-14 year olds. You could see if there's something like that around you.

Good Luck!



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iVillage Member
Registered: 10-16-1999
Wed, 07-26-2006 - 10:07pm

Good response payasa!


I know it's really, really hard, but try to avoid power struggles over things that really won't matter much in 5 years.

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-26-2006
Wed, 07-26-2006 - 10:44pm
I know this is a power struggle and I did let it go for about 8 months before I started to say anything. I figured it was an experimenting thing since I had just started up with a MK biz (very limited-not a hardcore sales lady) and the makeup was available. It just got to be a little much over time. She does have a lot of other freedoms that her friends dont have, We (her father and I) are quite a bit younger than most of her friends' parents and we listen to the same music like similar fashion, I trust her judgement on the computer etc., so I felt that she could at least be respectful of this one request. We don't battle about much else (knock on wood )My youngest daughter is where most of my battling occurs :)
She's also a Black Belt in Taekwando and in a leadership position, she's been told that it is inappropriate/disrespectful to wear that much makeup to class. After looking the way she did at the belt ceremony on Monday I think she's going to get "in trouble" tonight during the leadership class.
Thank you for the suggestion about the girly night, most of my family live on the same street and i think EVERYONE has already said something to her about her makeup jobs so I'll have to dig deep to find a "neutral" person :) Several places at the mall here do the teen makeup thing.. I'll keep trying that route.
The other thing is that she does a beautiful job of applying the makup, IF she were going on a photo shoot or on the runway :) she'll be very talented in the future if she decides to persue that direction,, its just not working for an everyday look.
Thank you for responding so quickly I really appreciate the input. I definitly will be back for other issues.
gloria
iVillage Member
Registered: 07-26-2006
Wed, 07-26-2006 - 11:23pm
Thanks..I explained a few things in my last post as well but to add a few more..
My first job is being a hairstylist... SO my kids have all had their hair colored since they about age 6.. my youngest daughter who is 9 we just put hot pink streaks in the top.
The oldest has 6 peircings in one ear and 4 in the other.. she wants one in her nose and at this point I don't even care about that. The makeup thing is I just don't want her to look trashy and have a bad rep since she's going into high school, and I know how boys can be..
So I'll back off the makeup.. cuz I do know there will be bigger things to worry about.
thanks all!!
glo
Avatar for momtb4
iVillage Member
Registered: 03-27-2003
Thu, 07-27-2006 - 2:17am

o, I so seriously would just mimick her behavior and then act like it's totally normal. I'd cake that make up on so thick, go with full racoon eyes and the whole deal, then just act like it was normal to look like this! Maybe she'd get a better picture that way?

I went to school with a girl who did the whole racoon eyes thing. She was probably really nice, but very few people bothered to get to know her. Most people thought she was a complete slut. One of the teachers drew a picture of a few of the girls, she was really talented that way. The one she drew of this girl, she switched from a thin marker to a super wide marker to do her eyes. Everyone laughed, but this girl seemed to think that was ok anyway.

sorry I wish I had better advice for you. I'm dreading the make up stage with my dd

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-26-2006
Thu, 07-27-2006 - 3:42am

OMG!!! i would LOVE to do that!! I have no friends or places to do that with cuz I'm a "daycare mom" and have no life..her friends think I'm ok but she hates me...

......On the moms perspective- I gave birth "naturally" -no drugs (unfortunately) with all 3 of my kids and don't have anyone to share that with as of yet. I don't think I'm "better " cuz I didn't get drugs.. but the damn drs. werent fast enought!!! :)

iVillage Member
Registered: 08-17-2005
Thu, 07-27-2006 - 12:18pm

Your dd sounds very much like mine. My dd14 is very talented artistically, and used to draw quite a bit. She has expressed interest in being a make up artist, in fact. When she got into the "girl thing" it seemed as though she made her face her canvas, so to speak! Of course I was less than thrilled with this, for a while she tried to racoon eye look as well, and I'm happy to report she's past that stage now. I think your dd is just experimenting with a look. You have the distinct advantage that her peers are discouraging her, and it sounds like most everyone around her is too. That gives you the opportunity to back off on this issue.

Because your dd has cut before, I would keep an eye out for other signs of depression - my dd also started to wear alot of black - black nail polish, clothing, etc. It was interesting to see that as she emerged from her depression she began picking brighter colors. She still wears black, but it's not ALL black anymore. She also has about four piercings per ear and dyes her hair regularly - again, for a year it was black (her hair is naturally dark brown but she needed it darker!) now she's just bleached the bottom half and then added temporary pink dye. I can ask you, because you're an expert: how often is it safe to dye your hair? I worry about all those chemicals. I choose not to make an issue out of the hair coloring with all that we've been through. I have nixed any further piercings (her navel) until she's 16.

Funny that you should say she cut because she was mad at you - my dd also cut because of anger, and I would venture to say most of it was directed at me - an easy target. Alot of teenage girls have power issues with mom as they begin to separate. It was a very painful year for me, as we were always so close when she was little, she is my only girl! Her therapist has helped her to find better ways of dealing with stress, and she still goes to group therapy with other girls her age once a week.

The one thing that disturbed me was reading that she was told by her martial arts teacher that the make up is disrespectful and inappropriate. I can see inappropriate, but disrespectful? I just would hate to see your dd pull away from this very healthy activity because of a stupid thing like this. Believe me, I so wish my dd was involved in any kind of activity. Whatever you do, try and keep her involved in that. Talk to her teacher or whatever. Good luck.

iVillage Member
Registered: 07-26-2006
Thu, 07-27-2006 - 1:24pm

The girls do sound alike :) My dd can draw anything just like her dad. He can paint like that Bob Ross guy that use to be on PBS.... he always said "there are no mistakes, just happy little accidents" LOVED that guy.
With the TKD instructor's comment- she had been told to lighten up on the makeup since she was in a leadership position working with the younger kids and the older kids are supposed to be models for the younger ones etc. And they felt that a 13 yo shouldn't wear the amount she does. Since she chose to continue to wear it after be asked to lighten it up, that's when it became "disrespectful". Hope that makes sense.
Cutting- my dd has a "friend" (that's a totally new post haha) who's parents are extremely hard on her and expect perfection from this poor little girl. She feels totally inadequate and like things aren't ever good enough for her parents. She cuts herself and is always talking about dying so I actually really worry about her. Like I said.. this one could take on a life of its own. When I found out about my dd cutting herself I know I didn't handle it well but she told me that she had already stopped. She had apparently cut herself really bad and she got really scared. Now she has a HUGE, thick nasty scar across her arm and since it's hot now and she's wearing short sleeved shirts she gets embarrassed everytime someone asked what happened. Now I'm probably rambling but my parents do foster care and one of the girls (she's been out of the house for 6 years) and she was/is a HORRIBLE cutter.. her arms and legs are soooo scarred up it looks like she's been severely burned. But I told her (dd) that if she continued to cut she'd look like this girl and she'd never be able to be a model/actress that she aspires to be, with her arms all scarred up.. Not the best response but I didn't know how else to deal with it and she told me that she wouldn't go to a therapist, and if I made her go she wouldn't talk. FUN!!! She said that she wasn't going to do that anymore. Let's hope so.
Hair coloring.... Well, in my opinion it depends on what kind of color you are using. If it's a semi-permanent you can recolor about every 6-8 weeks. Bleach- color ONLY THE NEW GROWTH.. if you color over bleach and then try to bleach it again, it may melt off, that's always attractive :) I've told several of my clients (dd as well) that if they want to go darker after being "blonde" that they make sure it's what they want because I wont lighten it again until it grows out. Most of the bright colors (purple, pink, blue etc.) will fade quickly depending on the brand of color used. Some professional brands will hold longer. Just like some of the newer "bleach" isn't exactly bleach.. Rambling again :) If you have a specific thing in mind you can email me and I can give you a better answer. :)
I better get something accomplished for the day :) Talk to ya later and Thanks again.

glo

iVillage Member
Registered: 08-03-2004
Thu, 07-27-2006 - 4:37pm

My DD is also very creative. A talented drawer and also very into photography, videos and photoshop. I mention this because she takes video and art classes at school and all the kids seem to wear this similiar style of clothing. They are all punk/gothic and wear the thick eyeliner, even the boys, and black everything else. Converse shoes written all over with sharpies. Piercings and tatoos. DD has 7 piercings in her ears and her navel pierced. She would have a tatoo if we let her but she has to wait til she is 18 for that. They are into writing their own poetry and lyrics and they are all in bands and tend to be over dramatic and very emotional and EMO. Are we seeing any similiarities here??

I never got on DD about all the eyeliner and all the black clothing because I too felt like there were bigger problems ahead and boy where there ever!! I always felt that these kids were just expressing themselves and being an artist myself and having gone through art school I was totally supportive of freedom of self expression. However, I have seen a connection with this gothic phase and depression and cutting or attempted suicide. Several of DD's friends cut and 2 of them have been committed for attempted suicide. DD started to get very depressed and started to experiment with cutting. I got a call from the school because she went to a teacher for help and told him that she wanted to kill herself. We got her into therapy right away which helped a great deal. The therapist said that statistically there is no reason to think that gothic/punk people hurt themselves more than preppy or ghetto style kids. That cutting is huge and it's on the rise with kids in general. He felt that all the dark poetry was actually a good outlet for her. To me they sounded like suicide notes. That was a tough year - she was 14.

DD is now 16 and she has emerged from this dark phase - took 3 years. It was a little at a time but she no longer wears all that caked on eyeliner and when she looks back at pictures she thinks she looked awful. She also dyed her hair black and has been waiting over a year and a half for it to completely grow out. She was having a fit because when she went to prom her hair was 2 different colors but her hair is naturally dark brown so it really didn't look that bad. She still wears her sharpied up converse shoes and some black but her hair no longer hangs in her face and you can see her eyes and she looks healthy and happy.

I wouldn't stress too much on the eyeliner or clothing as much as I would on her attitude or dramtic changes in her personality. But you have already dealt with the cutting so you already knew that. Just know that you are not alone!!

iVillage Member
Registered: 11-28-1999
Fri, 07-28-2006 - 10:58am

My 16 DSD also goes for the black eyeliner. She suddenly started wearing makeup about 1.5 yrs. ago. It was funny, because the first time she had worn this, we were on our way out to a halloween party that our friend has every year--it's not a costume party though, it's a pumpkin decorating party. her DF started to say something, but I stopped him. You know, fathers can't seem to deal w/ their DD's growing up. I said she is old enough to wear makeup, back off and amazingly, he did. However, she has red hair (her best feature, which she hates cause it's curly and she wants straight) and pale skin so the black eyeliner really didn't look good. I went out and bought her brown mascara and eyeliner cause I thought it really wouldn't look as harsh.

Also, she wears clothes that I just think are horrible. Every day, it's jeans and black T-shirts. I don't care about the jeans, it's that w/ her coloring, black is just not flattering. It's not really a goth look either. Her 16 y.o boy cousin is really into goth and he wears the really wide pants w/ the zippers, etc. She doesn't like that look. She is heavy so maybe she thinks black makes her look slimmer. I don't make a big deal about it although once in a while I might suggest she buy another color, but it doesn't work. If there is a special occasion, we will make her dress up about twice a year.

She has also been wearing her hair in a pony tail because she doesn't like the curls, but she pulls it so tight in the front and puts gel on it so it will look straight on top of her head. We have told her that by pulling it so tight, she might get a bald spot in the front (now there's a great look for a woman) but she still does it. Lately, she has been taking the pony tail and rolling it up. I don't even know how you would describe it, it's not really a bun. I can imagine that when she's older and sees her pictures she will hate the way she looks now. As my grandmother used to say, it's just a phase, she'll grow out of it.

Meanwhile my 17 yo DD is just the opposite, has long straight hair (it's actually a little wavy if she leaves it alone, but she will straighten it) and dresses in really cute clothes and is thin, so maybe some of it is my DSD's reaction to her, like she wants to be the total opposite.