how far away from school do you live? I'd go with natural consequences on this one--if he oversleeps, he walks or bikes to school and takes the tardy, or else misses school entirely and takes the absence. He has to make up the missed school work. Why should you (or his dad) have to drive him? If he knows he'll still get taken to school if/when he oversleeps, where's the incentive for him to get up? I'd also move his bedtime back, since he can't seem to get moving in the morning.
As for a punishment this weekend, I agree with you that it's not really fair to implement a punishment if he didn't know what the consequences would be beforehand. However, this is the ideal time to set up a contract with him for the future--whether it's loss of privilege, paying for the gas it takes to schlep him to school late, paying you for the time you took off from your day (or DH's day) to take him to school, him going to bed earlier, or whatever.
I don't know if that's helpful or not. I guess I'm blessed with boys who have always gotten up on the first call. However, just in case the day arrives when they don't, we already have in place the rule--if you don't get up the first time you are called, you go to bed half an hour earlier that night.
I would give my boys 3 wake-up calls. I figure the 1st one or two count as a snooze button. LOL If I ever had to go for #4, then the lights would come on, the covers would come off, and the threat of cold water descending on them would commence. I don't recall now if I ever actually had to use the cold water treatment...
I bought every alarm clock known to man, ones whose buzzers were loud enough to wake the dead, but neither boy *ever* heard them. Amazingly, what they DO hear (besides my lovely voice in the morning) is the itty-bitty alarm on their cell phones!!! Of all things.... Ds20 is on his own now and apparently wakes up on time for work, classes, etc. Ds16, well, I give him his 1st wake-up call at 7:10, and usually again at 7:20 and he comes on awake. In his defense, if for some reason I have to leave early to go to work, I will be a little more "forceful" when I give his 1st wake-up call and he usually gets on up (so I do *baby* him a bit with that 1st wake up call).
Now, all that being said, there *were* just the 3 of us, so it was pretty easy to baby them a tad because I wasn't scrambling trying to get other kids up at at 'em and dealing with babies, etc. As far as natural consequences go, I would think at some point in time there would be some *major* consequences from the school if he hits too many tardies. I would check to see what those are before I would resort to that. I think it might be better to come up with some sort of wake-up program/consequences for him. You might even let him in on the planning of the new rules and consequences.
There should be consequences at school for the unexcused tardies-I dont know your schools policy but you should not be signing him in or saying he overslept. If there arent consequences, maybe you could speak with the school about creating some? I think a detention or Saturday school might change his mind real quick
That said, is there any reason for him not to take the usual way to school? Bus? Walking? Is he being bullied?
Is he not getting homework done and dreading going?
I would eliminate all those possibilities first
2-3 alarms with one across the room can help with a sound sleeper.
I started my kids on alarms VERY young. I taught Montessori and independence is huge so I automatically had them getting up with alarms from like age 4!!! Seems kind of young to me now(they were babies for heavens sake)but it seems to have paid off. And maybe the recollections I have of my mom struggling to get my brother up played into it as well. I felt the family stress as Im sure the rest of your kids are.
The other option is the carrot instead of the stick. Give him a spreadsheet and if he gets up with the alarm 4 out of 5 days, he can ..........stay up later Sunday night, pick the dinner dish Monday, something little and doable as a motivator
The problem with all this "punishment" is that it assumes that the child has control over his biological clock. It assumes that the child is "will fully" not getting up in time. You said yourself that this is a good kid. He is not doing this because he likes to get people angry at him. He doesn't wake up on his own not necessarily because he is lazy or whatever.
Teenagers have a different "clock" than adults. Their brains are only fully awake till latter on in the day. In other words, they are not generally "morning people". Punishing someone because of their "biology" makes no sense. All it will accomplish will have a kid "sleep walking" during the day. Teens,especially growing ones, need rest.
I would first audit his room for "sleep" quality and I would also get him check for undiagnosed allergies. Is his mattress firm enough? Is the room ventilated properly? Does he have an allergy to dust mites? Is the room too dark or too light at night? Is his room too noisy? Does his home have too many distractions that keep his mind "active". When he does get up, does he feel like he has gotten enough sleep? Is his allowed to sleep in on the weekends to make up his "sleep deficit"?
In the evening, does he drink pop or other sources of caffeine? Does he has some down time between activities & homework and bed,time he can just turn his brain off.
With my own kids, when their allergies are "acting" up, both were hard to get up in the morning. They are tired because even when they went to bed at a good time, they didn't get enough "quality" sleep time.
I agree that "natural consequences" is the best route - what's the feedback at school if he's late or tardy? If you *do* need to drive him (like it's too far for him to walk), then IMHO you can do it in a way that doesn't put you out too much (like after the twins wake up, or when I can find a sitter to watch them).
Also, I had to LOL at the poster who suggested the bucket of water approach! No yelling, no threatening, just a simple 'wake up or I'll wake you up in a dramatic way!' I love it!
I think that as most kids, he will get it when it becomes too inconvenient for him not to get it.
First, I'd make certain there are no health factors involved such as caffeine soft drinks late at night or medications.
Second, I'd make sure his room is conducive to sleep. If there is a TV, computer, or entertainment system, remove it. I'd also make sure he turns his cell phone in at the end of the evening. These are not "punishments"; these are specific and natural cause and effect actions to take care of a problem that if is he is unwilling to address, you have to. If his room is too "busy" late at night, make it plain. It's inconveniencing you, not him. Frankly, I don't think punishment such as grounding and taking away his weekend social time is a very good idea. Keep whatever action you take relevant to the problem.
Third, I would explain beforehand that there will be no more late morning chauffeur service to school. If he can't get up in time for the bus, he can sit at home and study as a school replacement. He will say he has no homework. You can shrug. You should call the school to let them know where he is, but not address this as an excused absence. In our district this will initiate a saturday school. No TV or fun and games at home. This is school time, remember? Also, no socializing, sports or extracurriculars when school gets out at the end of the day. Again, not punishment, but cause and effect. My rationale is that if your not feeling well enough to do school, you need to stay in for the day.
I had this problem with my then eighth grader. It took two times for him to get it. I think the first time he overslept was to "prove" to me that taking the TV out of his room made no difference. If that isn't a perfect example of classic teenage logic, I don't know what is.. :-)
Personally I don't allow my son (also 13) to sleep in. He is woken up and it's expected that he gets up and out of bed immediatly. There is no slowly waking up or going back to sleep. Those simply are not options here. We don't allow it to happen.
Connor is woken at 5:45 am by his alarm clock. His father will go into his room 5 mins later and he'd best be up and moving before then. If he's still in bed, then his alarm clock will be set for 5 mins earlier the next morning and his father will stand over him while he gets up and starts his morning routine. (It's not fun to be 13 years old and have your dad stand over you and tell you what to do step by step like when you were four. Lets just say that this is a rare occurance and the last time dh needed to do that was well over a year ago).
It is expected that by 6:10 he will have gotten dressed, shaved and made his bed by that time. He then has to do his morning chores. (feeding pets and taking out trash). We eat a hot breakfast everyday as a family. It is expected that he be on time for breakfast. Dh leaves at 6:45 to take him to school. If he's not ready on time, then he needs to walk himself the two and a half miles to school.
Our high school has a tardy policy. If you are unexcuessed late once, you can't participate in any afterschool or extra curricular activites that day. If you are late twice it's a week, if you are late three times you loose the privelge for the entire semester (there are two semesters Aug-Jan and Jan-June). We will not ask the school to excuse him from a tardy because he chose not to get up or be responsible with his time. Nor will we bail him out with a ride to school.
He's free to ride the school bus to school. The cost is $50 per semester and the bus leaves at 6:30 which means getting up even earlier than he already does. Getting rides from us and an extra 15 mins in the morning is a privelege not a right.
First thing I want to say is if this has been happening last year, the time to make the contract and set the rules should have been when it became a frequent problem.
If he is not sleeping "properly", it doesn't matter how long he lies in bed.
Allergies don't always make you have a runny nose or a headache. That is when you have a seasonal or "mild" reaction (although to the person it might not seem mild). There is a syndrome called "Allergy-induce AD". The person is "washed out"; can not sleep; not-attentive.. If you have more than one "allergy", the combined effect can mask the traditional allergy reactions. We found that with both my kids.
With my oldest, we had no idea she had a dust mite problem. She was,like your son, not a good sleeper. I had to constantly drag her out of bed. She was finally diagnosed with asthma-induced by dust mite allergy and exercise. Her allergy was "bothering" her lungs not her nasal passages but not to the level that she was having a "full blown" asthma attack. We ended up taking out,from her room, all stuff animals. We got a new mattress and brought covers for her bed and her pillows (which are washed often in very hot water). It made a world of difference.
My youngest has a list of allergies, including mold, cat & grass & a few other "environmental" allergies. He also has a problem with milk. He had none of the "classic" appearance of a child with those allergies. He took several months while we "stabilized" him (and the house..I had to get rid of all my house plants and the cat) that he started to react like you would expect.
You don't have to take him to the doctor. Take out from his room anything that can be a "mold" producer or a collector of dust mites. Clean his room extremely well. Wash his linen in extremely hot water. Buy him a new pillow. Vacuum his mattress (or get one those companies that deal with allergy reductions to do it). Buy an "allergy cover" for his bed and pillow and see if it helps
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how far away from school do you live? I'd go with natural consequences on this one--if he oversleeps, he walks or bikes to school and takes the tardy, or else misses school entirely and takes the absence. He has to make up the missed school work. Why should you (or his dad) have to drive him? If he knows he'll still get taken to school if/when he oversleeps, where's the incentive for him to get up? I'd also move his bedtime back, since he can't seem to get moving in the morning.
As for a punishment this weekend, I agree with you that it's not really fair to implement a punishment if he didn't know what the consequences would be beforehand. However, this is the ideal time to set up a contract with him for the future--whether it's loss of privilege, paying for the gas it takes to schlep him to school late, paying you for the time you took off from your day (or DH's day) to take him to school, him going to bed earlier, or whatever.
I don't know if that's helpful or not. I guess I'm blessed with boys who have always gotten up on the first call. However, just in case the day arrives when they don't, we already have in place the rule--if you don't get up the first time you are called, you go to bed half an hour earlier that night.
Elizabeth J
I would give my boys 3 wake-up calls. I figure the 1st one or two count as a snooze button. LOL If I ever had to go for #4, then the lights would come on, the covers would come off, and the threat of cold water descending on them would commence. I don't recall now if I ever actually had to use the cold water treatment...
I bought every alarm clock known to man, ones whose buzzers were loud enough to wake the dead, but neither boy *ever* heard them. Amazingly, what they DO hear (besides my lovely voice in the morning) is the itty-bitty alarm on their cell phones!!! Of all things....
Ds20 is on his own now and apparently wakes up on time for work, classes, etc. Ds16, well, I give him his 1st wake-up call at 7:10, and usually again at 7:20 and he comes on awake. In his defense, if for some reason I have to leave early to go to work, I will be a little more "forceful" when I give his 1st wake-up call and he usually gets on up (so I do *baby* him a bit with that 1st wake up call).
Now, all that being said, there *were* just the 3 of us, so it was pretty easy to baby them a tad because I wasn't scrambling trying to get other kids up at at 'em and dealing with babies, etc. As far as natural consequences go, I would think at some point in time there would be some *major* consequences from the school if he hits too many tardies. I would check to see what those are before I would resort to that. I think it might be better to come up with some sort of wake-up program/consequences for him. You might even let him in on the planning of the new rules and consequences.
There should be consequences at school for the unexcused tardies-I dont know your schools policy but you should not be signing him in or saying he overslept. If there arent consequences, maybe you could speak with the school about creating some? I think a detention or Saturday school might change his mind real quick
That said, is there any reason for him not to take the usual way to school? Bus? Walking? Is he being bullied?
Is he not getting homework done and dreading going?
I would eliminate all those possibilities first
2-3 alarms with one across the room can help with a sound sleeper.
I started my kids on alarms VERY young. I taught Montessori and independence is huge so I automatically had them getting up with alarms from like age 4!!! Seems kind of young to me now(they were babies for heavens sake)but it seems to have paid off. And maybe the recollections I have of my mom struggling to get my brother up played into it as well. I felt the family stress as Im sure the rest of your kids are.
The other option is the carrot instead of the stick. Give him a spreadsheet and if he gets up with the alarm 4 out of 5 days, he can ..........stay up later Sunday night, pick the dinner dish Monday, something little and doable as a motivator
The problem with all this "punishment" is that it assumes that the child has control over his biological clock. It assumes that the child is "will fully" not getting up in time. You said yourself that this is a good kid. He is not doing this because he likes to get people angry at him. He doesn't wake up on his own not necessarily because he is lazy or
whatever.
Teenagers have a different "clock" than adults. Their brains are only fully awake till latter on in the day. In other words, they are not generally "morning people". Punishing someone because of their "biology" makes no sense. All it will accomplish will have a kid
"sleep walking" during the day. Teens,especially growing ones, need rest.
I would first audit his room for "sleep" quality and I would also get him check for undiagnosed allergies. Is his mattress firm enough? Is the room ventilated properly? Does he have an allergy to dust mites? Is the room too dark or too light at night? Is his room too noisy? Does his home have too many distractions that keep his mind "active". When he does get up, does he feel like he has gotten enough sleep? Is his allowed to sleep in on the weekends to make up his "sleep deficit"?
In the evening, does he drink pop or other sources of caffeine? Does he has some down time between activities & homework and bed,time he can just turn his brain off.
With my own kids, when their allergies are "acting" up, both were hard to get up in the morning. They are tired because even when they went to bed at a good time, they didn't get enough "quality" sleep time.
I agree that "natural consequences" is the best route - what's the feedback at school if he's late or tardy? If you *do* need to drive him (like it's too far for him to walk), then IMHO you can do it in a way that doesn't put you out too much (like after the twins wake up, or when I can find a sitter to watch them).
Also, I had to LOL at the poster who suggested the bucket of water approach! No yelling, no threatening, just a simple 'wake up or I'll wake you up in a dramatic way!' I love it!
Sue
I think that as most kids, he will get it when it becomes too inconvenient for him not to get it.
First, I'd make certain there are no health factors involved such as caffeine soft drinks late at night or medications.
Second, I'd make sure his room is conducive to sleep. If there is a TV, computer, or entertainment system, remove it. I'd also make sure he turns his cell phone in at the end of the evening. These are not "punishments"; these are specific and natural cause and effect actions to take care of a problem that if is he is unwilling to address, you have to. If his room is too "busy" late at night, make it plain. It's inconveniencing you, not him.
Frankly, I don't think punishment such as grounding and taking away his weekend social time is a very good idea. Keep whatever action you take relevant to the problem.
Third, I would explain beforehand that there will be no more late morning chauffeur service to school. If he can't get up in time for the bus, he can sit at home and study as a school replacement. He will say he has no homework. You can shrug. You should call the school to let them know where he is, but not address this as an excused absence. In our district this will initiate a saturday school. No TV or fun and games at home. This is school time, remember? Also, no socializing, sports or extracurriculars when school gets out at the end of the day. Again, not punishment, but cause and effect. My rationale is that if your not feeling well enough to do school, you need to stay in for the day.
I had this problem with my then eighth grader. It took two times for him to get it. I think the first time he overslept was to "prove" to me that taking the TV out of his room made no difference. If that isn't a perfect example of classic teenage logic, I don't know what is.. :-)
Doesn't that support the argument for an earlier bedtime?
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Personally I don't allow my son (also 13) to sleep in. He is woken up and it's expected that he gets up and out of bed immediatly. There is no slowly waking up or going back to sleep. Those simply are not options here. We don't allow it to happen.
Connor is woken at 5:45 am by his alarm clock. His father will go into his room 5 mins later and he'd best be up and moving before then. If he's still in bed, then his alarm clock will be set for 5 mins earlier the next morning and his father will stand over him while he gets up and starts his morning routine. (It's not fun to be 13 years old and have your dad stand over you and tell you what to do step by step like when you were four. Lets just say that this is a rare occurance and the last time dh needed to do that was well over a year ago).
It is expected that by 6:10 he will have gotten dressed, shaved and made his bed by that time. He then has to do his morning chores. (feeding pets and taking out trash). We eat a hot breakfast everyday as a family. It is expected that he be on time for breakfast. Dh leaves at 6:45 to take him to school. If he's not ready on time, then he needs to walk himself the two and a half miles to school.
Our high school has a tardy policy. If you are unexcuessed late once, you can't participate in any afterschool or extra curricular activites that day. If you are late twice it's a week, if you are late three times you loose the privelge for the entire semester (there are two semesters Aug-Jan and Jan-June). We will not ask the school to excuse him from a tardy because he chose not to get up or be responsible with his time. Nor will we bail him out with a ride to school.
He's free to ride the school bus to school. The cost is $50 per semester and the bus leaves at 6:30 which means getting up even earlier than he already does. Getting rides from us and an extra 15 mins in the morning is a privelege not a right.
stacy
First thing I want to say is if this has been happening last year, the time to make the contract and set the rules should have been when it became a frequent problem.
Not necessarily..
If he is not sleeping "properly", it doesn't matter how long he lies in bed.
Allergies don't always make you have a runny nose or a headache. That is when you have a seasonal or "mild" reaction (although to the person it might not seem mild). There is a syndrome called "Allergy-induce AD". The person is "washed out"; can not sleep; not-attentive.. If you have more than one "allergy", the combined effect can mask the traditional allergy reactions. We found that with both my kids.
With my oldest, we had no idea she had a dust mite problem. She was,like your son, not a good sleeper. I had to constantly drag her out of bed. She was finally diagnosed with asthma-induced by dust mite allergy and exercise. Her allergy was "bothering" her lungs not her nasal passages but not to the level that she was having a "full blown" asthma attack. We ended up taking out,from her room, all stuff animals. We got a new mattress and brought covers for her bed and her pillows (which are washed often in very hot water). It made a world of difference.
My youngest has a list of allergies, including mold, cat & grass & a few other "environmental" allergies. He also has a problem with milk. He had none of the "classic" appearance of a child with those allergies. He took several months while we "stabilized" him (and the house..I had to get rid of all my house plants and the cat) that he started to react like you would expect.
You don't have to take him to the doctor. Take out from his room anything that can be a "mold" producer or a collector of dust mites. Clean his room extremely well. Wash his linen in extremely hot water. Buy him a new pillow. Vacuum his mattress (or get one those companies that deal with allergy reductions to do it). Buy an "allergy cover" for his bed and pillow and see if it helps
Pages