Help... to tell the truth or not ....and wait.

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-09-2003
Help... to tell the truth or not ....and wait.
7
Mon, 11-04-2013 - 10:17am

Hello all- again.

It's been a couple of years since i have been here. I am back. And need help again.  

Background - My dd is 19 and in sophomore year of college. Her first year was not good having many anxiety issues. She has a learning disability and really is about 1 year behind the pack- mentally/socially – but excellent academically. 

 We had not had a good sophomore- junior year of HS as she latched on to an controlling boyfriend that i could not get her away from and of course I became the enemy and she became sexually active.   After 2 years of this - they finally broke up and i thought i was finally out of the woods. Not so.  But the damage was done, and we had trust issues and other mother /daughter issues after living a Romeo /Juliet type of existence.

Enter boyfriend #2.... I thought he was a doll, (like i did with the first one too), and he is a doll... and maybe that's the problem. She knew him from HS and on the outside he seems "perfect" – smart, intelligent, cute, kind and she is in love with him, and he makes her happy and he is VERY respectful of us, her parents  ... sounds good?  (I was almost in love too!)

Here's the problem: I just found out that many of the things he has been telling us.. which seemed interesting or farfetched, may actually be lies. She met him in her senior year in HS, and all of her friends thinks he is charming and wonderful!!!!  Which we though too... until things started to unravel. Thy have been dating for 2 years now

First problem.. He is muslim.. not a problem for us,,,, but of course for his parents so since the beginning he has told us, his parents don’t know, and would not understand his relationship with our daughter, so we went along with trying to understand this issue, since it did also happen for both my husband and myself as well, when we were younger and wanted to date outside our faith.  We are not terribly religious and this really does not bother us. BUT... while we would drop him off down the block from his home, where he said he lived... IS NOT his actual Home - we just found out.  He claims his parents do not want him out after dark, and needed to be home by dark , so respectfully we would get him home all summer long... before dark.. my daughter nicknamed him - her vampire!  He told us, that his parents believe bad things happen after dark... but when he is college - there is no such restriction?

This all started to get weird after he told my daughter - HE had stage 4 lung cancer and stage 2 leukemia - back in July.. right before my dd’s birthday - lost a whole weekend crying over this boy and my daughters' love for him... We have truly come to love him - even though we knew he would probably break off with her eventually - (even thought she does not see or believe this). He told my dd he has 4 years to live… and he has known for 6 months already.

He told us he has cancer.. yet each week he would tell us that the study he is in, will be starting "next month"  (supposedly it started in Sept.) He has supposedly left college for "treatment" but his answers about treatment are very "read from a script" or do not make sense...... " they are treating the leukemia, because the lung cancer is not an issue right now"??????  WHAT!!!?  He claims he is ok with the radiation, and has not side affects but the drs will not let him attend college until he is better. Therefore he is taking a break from college, but visiting my daughter at her college whenever he "can",. I told several of my friends an coworkers who know this boy, and us.. and all say.. there is something not right, and all of this does NOT ring true.  When i press my daughter.. all she says is - you know what i know.. as he tells us all info... and he never looks or acts sick.

A month ago he visited my daughter at college and she asked us to  -  we drove him home and just before we dropped him off at the end of his "block" and while talking about his new permit... i asked to see his funny picture which he kept talking about... (but i wanted to see his address....  the address on the DMV permits was NOT Seneca Rd., like he said.. it showed Flanders Ave #2....WHAT!    SO we dropped him off in the spot he wanted.. and waited.. to see if he went down to Seneca. Guess what. first he was watching our car - so we had to move.. and his watching us let us know... he was up to something.  After turning around the car to go in the other direction.. we saw him going away from Seneca and going in the direction of Flanders!!

A few days later while he was visiting at my daughter's school.... my husband checked the mailboxes that are outside the building on Flanders  - and found out his name is on one of the mailboxes! His own mailbox?  Along with 2 other boxes with the same last name.

He claims his mother works in an ER in her Pakistani/Muslim Garb - and only treats women... and the hospital allows this - since she can't treat men (??)  And when I looked up his mom’s name, as she is supposed to be a dr with a NY license…nothing comes up on the NY Registry. She does not exist.

I asked him the Dr with whom is is getting treatment at the hospital.. that name does not come up either. Anything I try to verify.. I cannot.. and I cannot speak to his parents either.. IT is a win-win for him. Nothing to validate.

He has told us that his father, not only owns the Seneca house.. but others as well… and we believed him. Just last week I found 2 websites that will tell you the owner of a house… and according to them..His father is NOT the owner of the house on Seneca, nor on Flanders!  But he just recently told my dd that his Uncle owns the Flanders building.

So.. now my stomach is in knots… why is he lying and do I tell my daughter. And how much do I tell her. And will she believe us.

I have even told him – he must tell his best friend just in case he really gets sick, so my dd has a contact to know info.. but he claims he will… each time we speak.. he will, he just hasn’t yet.

The permit is the easiest thing,, as we can tell her that we saw this and it does  not make sense. BUT he can say he gets his mail at the uncles… and she will believe it…  (I want to see him actually walk in or out for further proof)

Every time this boy comes to my house to see her or visits for the weekend my daughters school – which is now getting to be almost every weekend since he is not at his school … I am getting sick and concerned. She now stays with her girlfriend who lives off campus – just so she can have him stay for the weekend.

I do not know what to say of IF I should say anything at all.. as she is 19 and will only kill the messenger if they have bad news.  I remember telling  girlfriends when I was younger that her boyfriend was cheating /lying/ etc and she hated me..and stayed with him anyway.. until they were ready to see the truth.. but by them.. I was the outcast.

This is my daughter…not a friend -  do I tell her that my husband and I saw the permit a month ago .. or not.   Do I tell her he may be lying about other things .. or not.   Do I have my husband tell her.. so that I am not part of this??  She may trust my husband more….  And then.. when to tell… do we wait for thanksgiving when she is home?  Or just do it when we see her next. Or wait till after xmas… so we do not ruin this for her…….

She is still putting school first.. and doing well, as far as I know.   I know her world will crash if she does believe us…. Or she will be against us again

I have also thought of having a friend ask for his permit in front of her to show her this info… and then discuss.

OR do we just fess up and tell her how concerned we are that he is lying –not just to his parents but to all of us too…

Part of me says it’s her life.. stay out.. BUT I believe he is a liar… and she is innocent and does not question anything.

Or do I stay devious and try to not be a target?  What to do??

One more thing.  A friend has mentioned that he may be involved with a muslim group or some jihad.. which may trump school.. If he has no reason to live - so i am VERY concerned... or stupidly buying into a stereotype.

So I don’t know how concerned to be… or not to be.

HELP!

 

 

 

 

 

 

...

I

 

 

 

 

Avatar for elc11
Community Leader
Registered: 06-16-1998
Mon, 11-04-2013 - 5:55pm

I would probably discuss the inconsistencies with her, but trying to do it in a way that doesn't seem to attack him, and in a way that she doesn't feel like you're telling her "what to do" or that she should break up with him. When my dd was a teen I had better results if I planted the seed of an idea in her mind and let her arrive at a conclusion. If she felt like she was being told what to do she would try to disregard what I said. Hopefully your dd is more mature and less contrarian than that, but since she has a history of being defensive regarding her bf I agree that you need to approach this carefully. If you think that she will be more open to the conversation with Dad then have him talk to her.

If you really are concerned about the possibility of him being involved in some extremist group or somehow trying to scam her or draw her into something unsavory, then maybe you could have a professional background search done on him. I have no idea what this entails or how you go about it.

There is the possibility that no matter what you say or do your dd will stay attached to this guy, and then you have to hope for the best. Good luck!

iVillage Member
Registered: 08-08-2009

Welcome back and gentle hugs to you, Montana.

Well, I think you hit the nail when you said ”she loves him” and as we all know love can make people blind to the obvious.

The folks I have known with lung cancer get their chests cracked open by a surgeon who removes large portions of the lung and then the person gets poisoned with chemo and radiation to the point of death in an effort to kill the remainder of the cancer cells. As the old joke goes, “If the cancer doesn’t kill you, the cure will.” Likewise with leukemia treatments and bone marrow transplants, with the exception that they poison you first to kill all your bone marrow, and then try to save you with the new bone marrow from a donor. With both situations, the person shows the bad effects of treatment; things like baldness, extreme weight loss, pale skin, looking like death warmed over, and you are so sick and weak from the treatments that you’re unable to do anything other than lay in bed and rest and feeing like crap the whole time. If you haven’t seen the person in a while and have not heard about their illness, you think, but hope you don’t verbalize, something like, “OMG, you look terrable, what is wrong with you?” And they don’t go on dates or travel to the GFs in that condition. Their usually busy hanging over a barf bag or toilet.

(One of the funny aspects of bone marrow transplants is that when they test the DNA of the brood of a man or a woman who got bone marrow from the opposite sex, their blood DNA from then on is that of the opposite sex gender. Yes a male has blood that tests female and a female has blood that tests male. However, I don’t think that makes them transgendered. LOL Seriously, it must be a tremendous rush of good feelings to give a chance of life to another person by giving them a little bone marrow. I hope I get the opportunity someday to be a donor! I’m on the donor list, as are the rest of the family. Everybody should be.  Check with your local blood bank for more information.)

Speaking of what I would do, which may or may not be the correct thing to do, I would find a time to have a chat with DD, at a time when Hubby and I could have a long CALM conversation without interruptions and discuss the lack of credibility of this situation. And one of the hallmarks of any relationship that contemplates marriage as the end result is complete honesty between the couple contemplating that. THIS IS NO SMALL ISSUE.

My concern as a parent would be that he is just using her and really his intentions are not the same as hers. I would ask her, what kind of relationship can you have with a guy who doesn’t want his family to know about you?

I also agree with what Elc11 said above.

Blending a little bit of Dr. Laura with a little bit of Judge Judy, I would suggest that “you don’t want your daughter making babies” with an unstable guy (from Dr. Laura) and “don’t skimp on the amount of money you’re spending on your daughter’s birth control, buy the most potent available, least you have to deal with this guy for the rest of your life (from Judge Judy).” Seriously, you probably don’t want this guy around, so make sure he isn’t the father of your grandchild by making sure she is on birth control. Think in terms of the Nextplannon implant or an IUD, which are more difficult for a teen to screw up on.

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-09-2003
Tue, 11-05-2013 - 7:33am

Thank you both Elc11 and Kimmybabe!

My heart is in such a fragile state with this.

Until each piece of information he gave us was checked... I too believed him and loved him!!!

He is really good for my daughter and compared to last guy... gold!

 

I am not sure why a 19 year old NEEDS to lie to a boyfriend/girlfriend.. and it really does make me uneasy when everything i check is not real..or not true... but I believe HE thinks there is no way for us or anyone  to check on any of this info..to validate or not. Also once we tell her.. She will believe we are "stalkers" (as she calls people getting info on the sly)

I do understand that there are parents (mine) who would not accept someone from another faith... so i got that. and i respected his decision to love my daughter and I thought be honest with us.  But dishonesty to us... and the lies that keep getting deeper with each regard it getting very uncomfortable. PS  -   Each morning i wake thinking ...should i tell her or not.

My husband is stupid..or just being a fool -  and did not see his daughter doing things before (not my daughter syndrom) even thought i found out she was having sex from a text from her ex gladly stating he was glad she was not pregnant !!   He only believed for sure whenl we found her & her last boyfriend in our house...in her room... then he finally believed,.  but since then... 2 years ago..I RAN to the gyno and got her on pills.... Now she is on Nuevo Ring... and she does NOT want to get pregant either.

As i am the detective... (always has been - truth and logic are important to me) my husband is the cop. (only if there is a legal /illegal issue does he get riled up... otherwise- there can always be an explanation.- to him)

I do not know how she will feel and really scared that we will crash her world.  i am at a standstill as  i am thinking of 5 scenarious and each has merits and drawbacks i am sure... 

1)  should i have someone outside the family/ a friend.. let her know how "concerned and worried" her parents are that some of the information he is giving is FAKE/Not true// possibly a lie??

2) Have Dad talk to her without me...   (but then i don't know what kind of job dad does)

3) Have Dad do the talking but me be there to listen /support and just make sure what happens

4) Have a meeting with her and her therapist... who is also freaking out, as she does not like this sitution one bit, and has met the boy and also believes he is lying about the cancer which first started all of this questioning and not believeing of him - in the first place. She said that every question she asks him is either given a text book answer.. OR he diverts and talks about something else. and she feels that the situation is not good for my daughter... but is having trouble trying to talk to my daughter because she is also afraid my daughter may stop her therepy if she does not want to hear things as she is in a codependent relationship!!!! (When my dd was on bc pills... he would call her/text her to make sure she did it..... due to her LD  and memory difficulties)  

5- Talk to a friend whose daughter is friends with my dd (her daughter knows the situation but she- the parent does not) .. and feed info that way... for her friend to give her some of this info... on her level...

I also have a friend who used to be a real cop/detective.. and ask if he could find out info?? 

OR  Should i wait to get more proof of where he lives for sure?  (and maybe let my daughter prove it to herself)

Which scenario would you think best .. for a best possible outcome - or a really not good situation??

And YES... she LOVES him...which also breaks my heart... because as i said.. i did TOO... before all of this.

 

Interesting piece of info... your mention of marraige relationship. I would have been proud to call him son-in law.. IF that is the path they chose.  BEFORE all of these lies. BUT my daughter has told me many times... She would NOT have converted to Muslim.. and she does not even LIKE the muslim religion, as it makes no sense to her...  She believed they would "work it out" like many other interfaith couples...  and i thought they would "break up" way before that happened... due to his religious nature and his parents.

Comments Welcome and Appreciated.

 

 

iVillage Member
Registered: 04-16-2009
Tue, 11-05-2013 - 12:34pm

Can not comment on the cancer story but can give you some background on Islam.

If his parents are observant, your daughter would not be considered acceptable as a daughter-in-law to his parents and family EVER by the very fact that she had dated before and has spent weekends with their son. This is more than an "inter-faith" relationship. It is a clash of cultures and Pakistan culture is especially strict.

I seriously doubt this is a case of a young man involved in jahad. If he was, he would NEVER be involved with a non-Islamic girl and behave as he is. If you are concerned, question him about his beliefs. His extreme views would be very clear.

In strict Islamic cultures (differs from country to country), women are NOT allowed to be in the company of men they are not related to. So, his mother may be working in an ER but not as a doctor (getting a foreign licence approved is not easy) but as a "nurse", "translator" ect.. She may be also working under her own name. (Talking one's husband's last name is a British/American tradition not followed in many other countries). Or he may be "adding flavor" to his background.

However, the point is she dresses as a modest Muslem woman as dictated by her Pakistian culture. She would expect that her son would behave as an honorable Muslem man, which he is not.

Observant islamic young people do not date prior to marriage; even the young men.  They are suppose to be pure prior to marriage. He would not want his family and community seeing him leaving your car because he may be asked questions he may not want to answer. He also does not have to worry about phone calls at home etc.

Plus, he may have the same first and last name as his father. That is why his name is on the mail box.

As for the cancer, it is very possible that he has leukemia plus a secondary lung cancer. There is a disease called chronic lymphocytic leukemia which people can live for years with (with and without treatment). They are at increased risk of developing secondary cancer, such as lung cancer. He could very well getting "targeted" radiation (and hence no hair loss) and medication to reduce the secondary tumors. It depends on his treatment plan (and wheither he has been treated before)..

Since I am not a doctor, I don't know but I do agree that his "cancer" news sounds strange.He may be using it as an excuse to keep your daughter tied to him; he may sense that she is starting to drift away.

Whatever the case, it is your daughter and her decisions you should be focussing on.

Your daughter seeing a therapist is a good idea. With or without the cancer, it is time for your daughter to move on. This young man will most probable not make a formal committment to your daughter. To do so, he will have to break with his family and his culture and it sounds like he is not going to do that.

What I told my kids (re: dating) is NEVER get involved with anyone who has strong religious or cultural beliefs (any beliefs including Christianity) unless they are able to join them in those beliefs and/or they  have to "change" themselves to be acceptable.  It may sound so romantic and exciting but, in the end, the  differences can be an unsurmountable.

Do not date anyone they would not want to bring home to meet the family and anyone who does not bring them home to meet their family.

Good luck

iVillage Member
Registered: 01-09-2003
Tue, 11-05-2013 - 2:13pm

Thank you for your reply Mom_Iteadrinker!

Yes, I understand what you are saying... but you also know the saying " the heart wants what the heart wants"

that is my daughter... and him

To see them together is so cute... they are in love. and he will do anything (in his powers) to see her and be with her. and she with him.

Yes, He told me his mother is regligious and observant and wears saris that she makes from cloth from Pakistan. His father he says is more modern... BUT they have the Quaran playing on a radio .. all day long. And he is a very kind, gentle person.. and don't believe that he is involved in anything radical... but neither did the woman married to one of the boston marathon bombers..

Yes, i understand.. and he told me.. he is NOT supposed to be dating and NOT supposed to be with any woman except for cousins and family members or in Friends homes when they family is together. 

He told us his fathers name.. different first name.. same last name..  He claims his mothers last name is his fathers first name.. according to Pakistani tradition. But he did say she was a Dr. -  especially when she did not show up to HS events like PROM.. which he was my daughters date and I asked about meeting her... Her busy schedule at the hospital was what he told us. while i pinned his corsage on him ...

Yes, I agree about people of different faiths.. but it happened to me.. and her dad converted to my religion..

She understands from experience.. it can work.. and she has told me - and him.. she is NOT going to be the convertee.. AND he is telling her how religious and observant he is.. (fasting for Ramadan... but still visiting our home during lunch or dinner without eating.. made ME uncomforable.. but not my daughter or him.. ) she sees this.. but as young people in love... so what?

yes.. i am trying to focus on my daughter.. and while i am bothered by the differences.. i am MOST bothered by the LIES.

And whether this cancer is real or not... I am embarrased to have told people at work to pray for him...as they know how much he means to us.  

AND i was told that muslims.. are allowed to lie .. to non muslims.. as they do not see this as a conflict.

AND he is keeping this from his family.. which my daughter does know.. but she does not care...

they are both 19.. and in love.. and together on weekends.. and that is their world.. for now.

After knowing him for 2 years.. i am most dissapointed by the lies.. but i know if he lies to his parents.. he will lie to anyone.. I have mentioned this (nicely) to my daughter.. who assured us months ago before we had any proof of any lies.. that he always was honest with her... and that's who counts...   (true.. many kids lie to parents.. but not to their loved one)

 

P.S.. I have told my daughter LOTS of Information about Dating, marragie, SEX etc... and i also have found out.. not only with my daughter.. but with my friends as well.. You CAN teach teach & Teach... and it's up to them.. if they listen or NOT...

She is a horse.. that is not drinking the water - i have provided............... I truly can not help that.. and am crazed by this fact.

BUT there is nothing i really can do.. she is an adult..

My dilemma is how to tell her.. what he is telling us are lies.. with the proof that i have so far.. and whether she will just dismiss the information.. or not.

Please .. say a prayer for her.. She really is a very sweet loving girl..

And my heart.

 

Avatar for elc11
Community Leader
Registered: 06-16-1998
Tue, 11-05-2013 - 3:29pm

My ds had a Muslim friend, this was his best friend in HS. He was observant to some degree, for instance fasted during Ramadan. He started dating a non-Muslim girl and kept it from his parents. My ds has mostly lost touch with him but I think that he is still with that girl (for about 10 years now) and still has not told his parents, and both of them are 30 years old! What surprises me is that the woman will tolerate being kept in the shadows for so long.

That may be one line of discussion with your dd---how does she feel about never being able to be in the open about their relationship, and never being able to marry him? 

None of her friends have any suspicions or skepticism about him? 

iVillage Member
Registered: 04-16-2009

She is only 19. At 19, everything is possible and no one can tell them anything. All I can advise is that you continue to support her as you are doing, making sure that she keeps her education as a high priority.

Your daughter probably knows that he is lying or at the least sees the inconsistencies in his story. "Love" is  unfortunately blind.

For your own peace of mind, you can have him investigated but never tell your daughter what you did or found out. Her therapist might be able to help you with how to handle any information you found. I know.. kinda sneaky.. but...

I would continue to "question" this young man, especially about the inconsistencies in his story. But do it in a way that is not "confrontational". Give him rope to hang himself or at least get him to talk as much as possible. 

Good luck..