I can't think of too many laws I consider stupid. Now perhaps we have a law that doesn't allow you to tether your horse to a hitching post downtown, but that's really not an issue for us. Sometimes I speed but I know if I get caught its my responsibility. My DD knows that people pay the price for breaking the law. I will never condone smoking, it is illegal to buy cigarettes and when she is an adult she can undertake the appropriate measures to change it if she thinks its so horrible. Laws are there for a purpose, I'm not saying you can't question it, that you can't work to change it (there are legal channels to do that) but I will never condone blatent braking of the law. (Guess I should never say never, but generally speaking.)
we have had interesting discussions regarding rules and laws. Dd knows you have to follow the rules even if you don't agree with it. I have expressed my opinions at some of the silly rules at her school to the office and school district. I also volunteered for political groups in the past and she has seen me ask for signatures on petitions, write congressmen, etc... She knows how to express your concern.
same with Jackie, she has seen me fight rules before. But whats sad for her is she wanted me to read her visitation rules to her. So I did since she asked, I also told her it was not her responsibility to follow or enforce these rules. However, she asked why I had to follow the rules and why her "father" did not have to because he has broken this one and that one. But he does not get into trouble. That was a hard one to answer. But I explained it the best I could..
When I was growing up (nearly half a century ago), one of the strongest tenets of our society was the concept that in a "free" country, we have complete freedom to choose our actions as long as our actions are not directly harmful to another person. While this actually makes things pretty complex, it sounds simple enough. Our teachers (in public school) used to help us work through this concept, teaching us to decide what is just and basically fair to the majority of people. Today, that tenet is virtually absent from our lawmaking and law enforcement practices. We seem to go along with a new tenet, which is the concept that adults cannot decide for themselves or for their children what is just, fair, right/wrong. Society has to enter our households increasingly to ensure that we get it all "right." We have initiated extreme forms of abuse of individual rights in the name of "zero tolerance." Well, as for me, I'm for TOLERANCE with a capital "T" (all caps, in fact).
So...I bought my dd a copy of Henry David Thoreau's "Civil Disobedience." And the message I want my children to move ahead into adulthood with is that laws are made by people, and people make mistakes even when they have the best of intentions. Laws change and some laws should be changed. If we quit questioning our laws, we lose our free society. We become blind followers instead of thinking citizens. We can be led astray by blind leaders, or worse, we can be coerced or bullied under a corrupt regime. Can't happen here? Well, not if we maintain our ability to ask questions, demand accountability, encourage debate.
Personally I'm teaching my son to both think for himself and follow the law no matter what. He can have an opinion reguarding a law that he thinks is unfair, and if he chooses so we will support his efforts in getting ordinances changed if he wishes to. However, we expect him... no matter how he may feel reguarding a law or ordinance, to follow the law as it's written. We also expect that he will respect the law enough not to push ordinances to their limit just to prove a point.
Well, here's an interesting yet controversial one in our family right now. DH and I were born and raised in Texas and the handling of guns was as commonplace as walking down the road to the mailbox. My dad did and still does own a gun/archery range that is private but also used by the local police dept. for handgun certification classes. My 16 yr old son has spent plenty of time around there, and guns as well as gun safety is second nature for him.
Flash forward to NOW...on his 16th birthday he wanted to use his money to purchase a pellet gun because he was old enough to walk into the store and buy it himself. He was SO proud. We live in a developing neighborhood way on the outskirts of town and there's a huge field at the end of our street that faces out into the countryside. He and his friend went out there and starting obviously shooting at paper targets propped up on cardboard boxes. They were firing away from the homes and were way out in the field anyway.
Imagine our suprise to see two police cars with lights on come zipping over there within about ten minutes! DH ran out there to run interference and the cops were very nice but DID exit their cars with their weapons drawn! Seems someone had called em because of 'armed teens' in the neighborhood! Luckily DH was able to explain what was going on, the boys still didn't even know what was going on because they were so far away from the neighborhood and facing away.
It seems that while Texas has very lax gun laws, here in DENVER,COLORADO they see teens with guns quite differently (Remember Columbine and the other, more recent school shootings?). The cops explained all of this, after seeing the boys and their paper targets and relaxing a bit. My son was MAD so it led to some explanations about how states have different laws and that its our responsiblity to learn and to abide by them.
We ALL thought it was stupid, but in this day and time I guess you can't be too naive. Try buying beer on a sunday when you'd lived in 7 states in 13 years...wow are THOSE laws different everywhere! LOL!
There are rules, and then there are laws. While smoking may be against the law under 18, I don't stress the law on that, I stress the health of it. Same with drugs and drinking.
But then there are crazy laws. I don't know about you all, but NY scares the crap out of me with how they are so quick to take away personal responsibility. There are a bunch of laws coming out of there lately that assume the average joe can't make their own decisions.
Rules to me are suggestions. For instance there are rules at school. When we sign the contract we are agreeing to these rules, even if they don't make a ton of sense.
Then there is something called "policy". That's used a lot to throw people off of realizing no company creates a law, and "policy" is not a rule and not a law.
I'm raising independent thinkers who won't just be placated with "because that's how it's always been done".
I've tried to raise Evan to obey rules and laws but follow proper channels if you disagree with them. His school banned Heeley's (why I'm not sure but whatever...) and it really bothered him so I had him write down why he thought they should be able to wear them and address possible objections. He took it to the office. He and his friends passed around a petition and gave it to the office. Still no luck. He asked to speak to the principal about it and they wouldn't let him. At that point I told him it was probably best to drop it because he was in enough hot water about his behavior.
Here's another situation... Our seatbelt/car seat law says you have to be 8 years old and weigh 80 lbs. in order to ride without a booster. Evan is 10 years old, weighs 62 lbs., and is about 4 feet 6 inches tall (he's a pip squeak). His head, knees, and feet are all in what the experts consider safe positions (feet touch the floor, knees extend past the edge of the seat, seat belt comes across the shoulder not the neck, etc.). Do I make him ride in a booster? Following the law I should but he's in a safe position and he's 10 years old. He ALWAYS wears his seatbelt, even in situations when others around him (adults and kids) do not.
When I was a teenager, we were lighting fireworks in our yard (not the flying find but twirling tanks, sparklers, etc.) one 4th of July and the police came by and told us they were illegal and we had to stop (I guess the local ordinance said you can't shoot off anything that moves) so my mom made them go get a copy of the ordinance and we shot off the rest of our stash while they were gone! Hee hee! The best part for me was she was a school principal at the time and has always been VERY straight laced. It was fund to see another side of her...
There are laws & rules that I think are dumb and don't necessarily agree with, but hte bottom line is they are the law/rules and we abide by the rules!
That is what I teach my kids--you may not like the law/rule, you may think it is dumb and you may be right--but in the end of the day a rule is a rule and you follow them!
Kind of like the whole school issue I just faced with my teen---I thought the rule was dumb, but as DD heard me tell the vice principal when I spoke to her---we follow the rules and if it is a rule then it is a rule and I will respect that!
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I can't think of too many laws I consider stupid. Now perhaps we have a law that doesn't allow you to tether your horse to a hitching post downtown, but that's really not an issue for us. Sometimes I speed but I know if I get caught its my responsibility. My DD knows that people pay the price for breaking the law. I will never condone smoking, it is illegal to buy cigarettes and when she is an adult she can undertake the appropriate measures to change it if she thinks its so horrible. Laws are there for a purpose, I'm not saying you can't question it, that you can't work to change it (there are legal channels to do that) but I will never condone blatent braking of the law. (Guess I should never say never, but generally speaking.)
I'm working to teach my kids both to think for themselves AND to work within the law.
Ramona Mom to 2 great kids and wife to one wonderful hubby since 1990!
When I was growing up (nearly half a century ago), one of the strongest tenets of our society was the concept that in a "free" country, we have complete freedom to choose our actions as long as our actions are not directly harmful to another person. While this actually makes things pretty complex, it sounds simple enough. Our teachers (in public school) used to help us work through this concept, teaching us to decide what is just and basically fair to the majority of people. Today, that tenet is virtually absent from our lawmaking and law enforcement practices. We seem to go along with a new tenet, which is the concept that adults cannot decide for themselves or for their children what is just, fair, right/wrong. Society has to enter our households increasingly to ensure that we get it all "right." We have initiated extreme forms of abuse of individual rights in the name of "zero tolerance." Well, as for me, I'm for TOLERANCE with a capital "T" (all caps, in fact).
So...I bought my dd a copy of Henry David Thoreau's "Civil Disobedience." And the message I want my children to move ahead into adulthood with is that laws are made by people, and people make mistakes even when they have the best of intentions. Laws change and some laws should be changed. If we quit questioning our laws, we lose our free society. We become blind followers instead of thinking citizens. We can be led astray by blind leaders, or worse, we can be coerced or bullied under a corrupt regime. Can't happen here? Well, not if we maintain our ability to ask questions, demand accountability, encourage debate.
Personally I'm teaching my son to both think for himself and follow the law no matter what. He can have an opinion reguarding a law that he thinks is unfair, and if he chooses so we will support his efforts in getting ordinances changed if he wishes to. However, we expect him... no matter how he may feel reguarding a law or ordinance, to follow the law as it's written. We also expect that he will respect the law enough not to push ordinances to their limit just to prove a point.
stacy
Well, here's an interesting yet controversial one in our family right now. DH and I were born and raised in Texas and the handling of guns was as commonplace as walking down the road to the mailbox. My dad did and still does own a gun/archery range that is private but also used by the local police dept. for handgun certification classes. My 16 yr old son has spent plenty of time around there, and guns as well as gun safety is second nature for him.
Flash forward to NOW...on his 16th birthday he wanted to use his money to purchase a pellet gun because he was old enough to walk into the store and buy it himself. He was SO proud. We live in a developing neighborhood way on the outskirts of town and there's a huge field at the end of our street that faces out into the countryside. He and his friend went out there and starting obviously shooting at paper targets propped up on cardboard boxes. They were firing away from the homes and were way out in the field anyway.
Imagine our suprise to see two police cars with lights on come zipping over there within about ten minutes! DH ran out there to run interference and the cops were very nice but DID exit their cars with their weapons drawn! Seems someone had called em because of 'armed teens' in the neighborhood! Luckily DH was able to explain what was going on, the boys still didn't even know what was going on because they were so far away from the neighborhood and facing away.
It seems that while Texas has very lax gun laws, here in DENVER,COLORADO they see teens with guns quite differently (Remember Columbine and the other, more recent school shootings?). The cops explained all of this, after seeing the boys and their paper targets and relaxing a bit. My son was MAD so it led to some explanations about how states have different laws and that its our responsiblity to learn and to abide by them.
We ALL thought it was stupid, but in this day and time I guess you can't be too naive. Try buying beer on a sunday when you'd lived in 7 states in 13 years...wow are THOSE laws different everywhere! LOL!
Denise
There are rules, and then there are laws. While smoking may be against the law under 18, I don't stress the law on that, I stress the health of it. Same with drugs and drinking.
But then there are crazy laws. I don't know about you all, but NY scares the crap out of me with how they are so quick to take away personal responsibility. There are a bunch of laws coming out of there lately that assume the average joe can't make their own decisions.
Rules to me are suggestions. For instance there are rules at school. When we sign the contract we are agreeing to these rules, even if they don't make a ton of sense.
Then there is something called "policy". That's used a lot to throw people off of realizing no company creates a law, and "policy" is not a rule and not a law.
I'm raising independent thinkers who won't just be placated with "because that's how it's always been done".
I've tried to raise Evan to obey rules and laws but follow proper channels if you disagree with them. His school banned Heeley's (why I'm not sure but whatever...) and it really bothered him so I had him write down why he thought they should be able to wear them and address possible objections. He took it to the office. He and his friends passed around a petition and gave it to the office. Still no luck. He asked to speak to the principal about it and they wouldn't let him. At that point I told him it was probably best to drop it because he was in enough hot water about his behavior.
Here's another situation... Our seatbelt/car seat law says you have to be 8 years old and weigh 80 lbs. in order to ride without a booster. Evan is 10 years old, weighs 62 lbs., and is about 4 feet 6 inches tall (he's a pip squeak). His head, knees, and feet are all in what the experts consider safe positions (feet touch the floor, knees extend past the edge of the seat, seat belt comes across the shoulder not the neck, etc.). Do I make him ride in a booster? Following the law I should but he's in a safe position and he's 10 years old. He ALWAYS wears his seatbelt, even in situations when others around him (adults and kids) do not.
When I was a teenager, we were lighting fireworks in our yard (not the flying find but twirling tanks, sparklers, etc.) one 4th of July and the police came by and told us they were illegal and we had to stop (I guess the local ordinance said you can't shoot off anything that moves) so my mom made them go get a copy of the ordinance and we shot off the rest of our stash while they were gone! Hee hee! The best part for me was she was a school principal at the time and has always been VERY straight laced. It was fund to see another side of her...
There are laws & rules that I think are dumb and don't necessarily agree with, but hte bottom line is they are the law/rules and we abide by the rules!
That is what I teach my kids--you may not like the law/rule, you may think it is dumb and you may be right--but in the end of the day a rule is a rule and you follow them!
Kind of like the whole school issue I just faced with my teen---I thought the rule was dumb, but as DD heard me tell the vice principal when I spoke to her---we follow the rules and if it is a rule then it is a rule and I will respect that!
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