Right obtained for all

iVillage Member
Registered: 02-04-2008
Right obtained for all
137
Mon, 02-25-2008 - 8:08am

Some you may know, but others may be unaware that the first charges of made against abusive parents were made under the guise of 'animal cruelty'.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 06-17-2007
Wed, 02-27-2008 - 8:22pm

"The commitment of every crime is ELECTIVE - so sure they had the OPTION to commit a crime and abort."

A crime according to whom and what? Until the second half of the 19th century, it was not a crime in this country to have an abortion.

Crime (according to dictionary.com)- an action or an instance of negligence that is deemed injurious to the public welfare or morals or to the interests of the state *and that is legally prohibited.* (emphasis mine)

If your society doesn't have a code of law (and it doesn't until Hammurabi), then you don't have crime. You can have something that is socially unacceptable; you can have a practice that people genuinely don't like; you can even have actions that will earn you death in your society, but you can't have a crime until you have laws to break.

Even then, evidence is sorely lacking that abortion was considered a socially unacceptable practice until the Middle Ages at the very earliest. And even when you get to that point, abortion in the first trimester was considered okay.

So no, it was not a choice for them to commit a crime because abortion was not a crime. Plain and simple.




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iVillage Member
Registered: 04-10-2003
Wed, 02-27-2008 - 8:32pm

<

It seemed to work. >>

That's really eerie Lianna-- that's almost word-for-word what we tell our own kids. Reduced sentences for honest admissions- and I always take the time t tell them what the consequences WOULD HAVE BEEN had they not been upfront and honest. Good to know it yields good results!


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iVillage Member
Registered: 06-17-2007
Wed, 02-27-2008 - 8:32pm

"However, in this discussion we are talking of parental consent."

Actually, we've discussed a variety of topics in this thread.

"Did I say that abortions should not be performed on minors PERIOD??? Nope, sure didn't."

No, but I didn't say you did. Don't put words in my mouth. You did say (and I'll show you below) that a parent who consents to an abortion for their child is abusing their child.

"I am talking about requiring consent for abortion - which infers that one can consent to an abortion, right?"

Yes, but let's see what you think of the parents who do provide consent for abortion. Here you go:

"I believe that any parent that would have their child abort - kill another human being - without medical cause - is abusing their child emotionally, mentally and socially."

So, since physical and emotional abuse of a child is illegal in this country, you believe that parents who consent to (or mandate) an abortion for their pregnant minor child are committing a crime. So, you don't technically say that elective abortions should not be performed on minors, but you say that minors shouldn't be able to make that decision and that the ones who grant consent to do it ought to be prosecuted for it.

Unless, of course you don't think that parents who abuse their children should be prosecuted, but that would be an entirely different issue.




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iVillage Member
Registered: 08-31-2004
Thu, 02-28-2008 - 4:58am

< I always take the time t tell them what the consequences WOULD HAVE BEEN had they not been upfront and honest.>


Oooh, that's a good idea too. I think my parents did that once or twice but I'm not sure it was standard fare.



So far so good, anyway :o)


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baby siggy
iVillage Member
Registered: 06-17-2007
Thu, 02-28-2008 - 12:16pm

My parents had a different tactic for lying. My brother and I were terrible liars, and so guilty about it that we'd always admit to it in an hour or so. So they told me this when I was about eight years old: never tell us a lie because we will always know you're lying, and we'll laugh at you. I very rarely lied to my parents, and was far more likely to just conceal information instead.

My sister, on the other hand, was a very talented liar. She lied about lots of things. She still prides herself on it, but she doesn't realize that living with her for years and years and knowing her so well means that we all know her cues. In fact, when she's telling me a story about her best friend (someone I knew in high school who also lies a lot), I can tell whose lie is whose. Her friend's lies are fantastic and difficult to believe, but my sister adds little pieces here and there to make it seem more believable. She's quite skilled at it, but I know she does it so I can see it coming from a mile away.

So I guess my parents' tactic was to make it clear that we'd never get away with it so we might as well not bother. I think it worked most of the time.




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iVillage Member
Registered: 02-04-2008
Sun, 03-02-2008 - 10:39pm

The majority of adolesents are not in crisis.

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-07-2007
Mon, 03-03-2008 - 6:34am

Actually the problem lies here:


"Most girls are not in a situation in which they have any reason to fear their parents.

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"You're cute. I like you."

"What you se

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