Militant formula feeder v. Militant BFer

iVillage Member
Registered: 06-17-2006
Militant formula feeder v. Militant BFer
515
Sun, 04-01-2007 - 10:04pm

I have always lurked here because I find the breast/bottle debate interesting. I had an interesting experience at a baby shower today and thought I'd bring it here.

I exclusively BF my 3 month old son. It has not been easy or natural until the past few weeks. He had jaundice, bad doctors, we've both had thrush on and off for 2 months, dairy allergies, etc. I spent a lot of time while I was pregnant educating myself about the benefits of breastfeeding, common mistakes that new mother's make, why doctors are often incorrect when it comes to BFing...

Anyways, I was the only BFing mother at the shower today. I left my son with my mom (sleeping) and the host knew that I would have to leave as soon as he woke up (he doesn't take a bottle). I was ridiculed and made fun of by the women at the shower. They thought it was cute, I didn't. Comments were made such as, you just have that baby attached to your boob, huh? He's going to be so spoiled..what a moma's boy, blah, blah. Another mother told me that she wouldn't breastfeed because then the baby only sees you as food (ummm..what about the comfort and bonding part?!)

When the pregnant woman at the shower told me that she was interested in BFing and asked if I had any advice, etc. the other women went on and on with mistruths about BFing (how they didn't have enough milk, the baby was allergic to their milk...) I tried to divert the conversation, but I was outnumbered, so I told her to call me and we could talk then.

This is not the first experience like this that I've had. I am constantly encountering people with these attitudes. If they aren't perpetuating mistruths, they are saying things like, "boy weren't you lucky to be able to BF.." I wasn't lucky, I had a very hard time. I was PROACTIVE because he is my CHILD and I want him to have the best start possible. I don't expect a pat on the back, but don't undermine my devotion to my son.

I guess this is my issue/question: Why do I hear so much about militant breastfeeders when FF moms are just as bad? Why do I become portrayed as militant when I'm simply trying to educate a new mom about the wonderful aspects of BFing? Honestly, I don't really care what people do with their own kids, but I do think that it is important to educate new moms about the benefits of BFing.

hhh


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iVillage Member
Registered: 04-05-2003
Tue, 04-10-2007 - 10:54am

"I wouldn't DARE post that it really isn't healthy to add cereal to a bottle at this age or that maybe it would be a good idea to question old practices and even *gasp* our doctors...I would automatically have my head ripped off by some mom saying that she knows what's best, even though it is PROVEN that cereal in a bottle is unhealthy and dangerous."

I have a 5 month old, but I do post about cereal and about bfing issues (like, "I just dried up overnight and I am so devastated I have to switch to formula!" ). I word it very light and just stick to facts and links to things like AAP policy and kellymom. I haven't been flamed yet! I have to do it, I can't let the big pile of stinking bad info just sit there LOL!

Debbie

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iVillage Member
Registered: 07-08-2001
Tue, 04-10-2007 - 11:30am

<<(more than some, less than all)>>


LOL! So we have a new disclaimer, hmm?


The standard disclaimer, for those newbies who may not know this, is "Some women cannot breastfeed, and this debate is about those who CHOOSE not to but otherwise can." We can call this one SD#1, and the "More than some, less than all" can be SD#2.


iVillage Member
Registered: 07-11-2006
Tue, 04-10-2007 - 11:38am

OT: What you are describing is sometimes called the straw man argument.

>>Interesting debate style you have there. Take something someone said, rephrase it so it's ridiculous and not at all what what originally said, and then refute THAT. <<

Wikipedia:
<>

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-25-2003
Tue, 04-10-2007 - 11:48am

"OT: What you are describing is sometimes called the straw man argument."


Yes, that's the one!


Cathie

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-04-2006
Tue, 04-10-2007 - 12:09pm

<"Exactly, and until BFing loses it's taboo status and women who are simply discussing their feeding decisions amongst their peers are not automatically portrayed as psychotic breastfeeding obsessed crazies (or maybe not even that extreme, but just weird), how are things going to change? As long as bad information is being handed out everywhere, it's going to continue.">

Again, where I live, there is no taboo status as far as BFing is concerned, nor is their automatic portrayal of breastfeeders as psychotic obsessed crazies or even just plain weird. Bad information can be found on pretty much any topic, and infant feeding isn't immune to that, but I personally haven't found it to be a pervasive problem in my area. Certainly didn't effect me, nor the moms I know, many of whom BF for a year or more.

<"I wouldn't DARE post that it really isn't healthy to add cereal to a bottle at this age or that maybe it would be a good idea to question old practices and even *gasp* our doctors...I would automatically have my head ripped off by some mom saying that she knows what's best, even though it is PROVEN that cereal in a bottle is unhealthy and dangerous.">

Well, not to be rude, but then aren't you a part of the problem that you're lamenting? If you're afraid to post helpful and accurate information on a public board, where no one really KNOWS you, then I would imagine the idea of doing it IRL is out of the question too? I am far from a lactivist, but I do believe there are gentle ways of nudging people toward a more educated decision, with the final decision of course being their's. You don't have to come off like a know-it-all, but just a simple, "my ped says the AAP guidelines on early intro of solids are..., so I'm holding off until 6 months just to be on the safe side" would seem quite appropriate. I've done it and read it on EC boards, and I've consistently found most moms, especially first-timers, are usually quite appreciative, or are planning the same thing. In fact, most of the moms I've encountered on my ECs are really quite educated on most of these topics, but again, it certainly depends on the group of women who happen to come together. Some boards are just full of drama no matter what, which goes back to my original point that this isn't about feeding choice at all, but has way more to do with personality.

<"I didn't start this debate because I think that all FF moms are crazed militants who stalk new mothers and tell them that they better put some cereal in a bottle, or else...I *do* think that a lot of people tend to be more accepting of bad FF advice/discussions of the "yuckiness" of BFing as opposed to discussions related to positive aspects of BFing.">

I never thought you were saying all FF mothers are crazed militants. As for the second part, it's just simply not been my experience. I have never heard anyone speak of the "yuckiness" of breastfeeding, outside of the BFing side pointing it out on this board as something FFing mothers say. Your experience is obviously very different from my own, and I'm just grateful that I haven't had to deal with this stuff IRL.

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-04-2006
Tue, 04-10-2007 - 12:11pm
No need to be jealous. The point is being soundly ignored anyway, LOL.
iVillage Member
Registered: 10-23-2000
Tue, 04-10-2007 - 12:18pm

Because it is rediculous.


I donated my freezer stash of EBM to another mom through


* Milk Share *

iVillage Member
Registered: 10-04-2006
Tue, 04-10-2007 - 12:43pm

<"Because it is rediculous. Because it ISN'T a standard held by the bfers on this board. Because it is schoolyard "yeah, well well...you do it TO!" kind of debating.">

Not sure what the schoolyard part means. "You do it to"? Do what too? My point was that when nursing mothers come on here with their personal stories about the "other side," the BFing contigent seems to just assume that the mother's account of what happened must surely be true, since it's depicting FFing mothers, or anyone whom they deem unsupportive of BFing, in a negative light. So no one questions the validity of the account. But if a FFing mother tells a personal story, it's jumped on and picked apart immediately, searching for a way to render it untrue or somehow invalid. There was actually a thread posted about this a while back. Was it witchpower who asked whether different posters are treated differently, based on their side, or whether they're new or a regular? Can't remember the details now, but I think it's come up before, with people trying to figure out why the board is so heavy on BFers, and why FFers don't stick around.

I guess it's all about perception, but I disagree that my point is ridiculous (obviously, or I wouldn't have made it, LOL!).

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-26-2003
Tue, 04-10-2007 - 12:49pm

Yeah, but a lot of FFing moms are also ones who are totally against anything like child-led weaning, and THAT is where they end up showing up as more "militant"...saying that because it is not something they choose to do it is "wrong" "sexual" "perverted" etc.

That, IMO, is just as bad as a BFer calling a FFing mom a "bad mom", since if you say that it is "perverted and the mom is doing it just for herself" to nurse an older child that is basically calling the mom a perverted sexual predator or whatever.

Fio

iVillage Member
Registered: 12-12-2006
Tue, 04-10-2007 - 12:59pm

You know, I've given your post some thought, and after mulling it over a while something stuck out at me.

Here you are slamming me for making inferences and getting a feel from posters' overall style and tone. Apparently we are only supposed to take posts for their literal, black and white, face value. We are not to consider tone or style and we are not to make *any* inferences. Fine.

How about the vast majority of your posts? See, you have never (to my knowledge) qualified any of your posts with, 'I'm being facetious here...' or, 'All seriousness aside...', or anything that would *explicitly* allow the reader to know that she is about to read a load of sarcastic drivel. But we're not supposed to take *your* posts at their literal, black and white, face value, otherwise line after line of monsterous, nasty comments would have gotten you booted out for TOS violations long ago. We *infer* from your *tone* and *style* that you don't mean the dispicable things you say, rather you are hiding behind sarcasm. That way you never have to really take a stand and back up your opinions, you can just reem the other person for taking you too literally...you were just being sarcastic. They should know this from your tone and style...they should get the 'feel' via the internet.

This all seems very convenient (read hypocritical).

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