A need to stand united!

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-04-2007
A need to stand united!
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Wed, 05-23-2007 - 1:23am
I KNOW I KNOW - this is a debate board, and therefore welcomes viewpoints from both sides of this never-ending issue. However, I just wanted to say that after reading many posts, absorbing opinions and info, that it seems like at the end of the day, we all really want the same thing. We want our children to be healthy and happy, we'd like to go pee without a boob in anyone's mouth, LOL, and possibly for a teeny bit more help with issues outside of feeding.
So, I think, that we really need to put on a united front as mothers, not just as breast feeders or bottle feeders. {I personally chose to breastfeed my 2 kids and will do the same to my next, due in January}, but that does not mean that I can't understand the exasperation and frustration that sometimes accompanies being a walking supermarket! Is it worth it? Yes, I feel it is. It's not always easy, but HELL, this is motherhood we're talking about; it isn't supposed to be! But at the end of the day, even after weaning my children and switching to formula, my ideals and hopes for them were identical.
Just wanted to allow for a small breather, and put a voice to some of the compassion and empathy that I feel for both sides of this issue, regardless of my personal preference.
Best of luck to ALL!
Tabitha, (24)
Winnipeg, MB. Canada.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 03-25-2003
Tue, 05-29-2007 - 11:56am

I know you probably don't have all the answers and there may not be any solid answers, but I have to wonder, what caused the sudden and profound drop in supply in the first place? I noticed a drop with my son at about the same age - noticed by not being able to send him enough bottles of EBM. The factors though, were the fact that I had recently went back to work (5.5 months) and I had taken a week long business trip out of the country. I pumped all that time (milk spoiled so I couldn't use it after) but babies aren't as efficient as a pump. I didn't try much - oatmeal - before I started supplementing with formula. There's dozens of things I could have tried but didn't.

Did she always nurse from the breast when she was with her son? Was she pumping during times that she could have been nursing? I know I was - lunchtime. It would have made more sense to nurse DS at lunch than it did for me to hang out at my desk at work and pump at lunch and send formula to make up the difference. Not only would it have been a better substance for that meal, it would have worked to help restore my supply rather than add to the burden.

"Now I am not sure how much you know about depression...but it doesn't happen overnight. She didn't just wake up one morning in a severe depression...it happened slowly...unfortunely her husband did not notice what was happening...(he isn't the most supportive guy in the world) She did have follow-up visits with her doctor and she told him everything was fine.."

And this is the SAME timeframe that you are claiming that she lost out with her daughter. Don't you think your statement is a tad bit exaggerated then? If she was still thinking everything is fine, how exactly did she miss out with her daughter? Aside from her work, that is. But then, that wouldn't be attributed to breastfeeding either.

"After about 2 months of being on the medicine...she basically had a nervous breakdown at work..which was the breaking point for her.."

Isn't it possible that work was the catalyst, not the medication or the breastfeeding? Going back to work with a young baby can be very hard. Alot of moms deal with alot of buried guilt over it. How old was your niece when she went back to work?

And, didn't you say that she had to go on antidepressents after she stopped the reglan? Perhaps the depression just coincided with the medication which also has a side effect of depression??

Cathie

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-15-2007
Tue, 05-29-2007 - 12:20pm

And this is the SAME timeframe that you are claiming that she lost out with her daughter. Don't you think your statement is a tad bit exaggerated then? If she was still thinking everything is fine, how exactly did she miss out with her daughter? Aside from her work, that is. But then, that wouldn't be attributed to breastfeeding either.

"After about 2 months of being on the medicine...she basically had a nervous breakdown at work..which was the breaking point for her.."

Isn't it possible that work was the catalyst, not the medication or the breastfeeding? Going back to work with a young baby can be very hard. Alot of moms deal with alot of buried guilt over it. How old was your niece when she went back to work?

And, didn't you say that she had to go on antidepressents after she stopped the reglan? Perhaps the depression just coincided with the medication which also has a side effect of depression??

She went back to work when her daughter was 12 weeks old when she went back to work...so not she was not feeling guilty about going back to work...she had been back at work for quite sometime and had been doing fine with it.

She miss out on time with her daughter during the worst part of her depression which is after she stopped taking the medicine. If she couldn't even take care of herself...how would you expect that she would be able to take care of a baby??

The reason that we believe the medicine cause this...is because she was perfectly fine before taking it...and we have no prior history of depression in our family

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-25-2003
Tue, 05-29-2007 - 12:47pm

Curious that her milk supply dropped so proufoundly at 7 months then, if she had been pumping since 3 months.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not trying to prove that what you are saying about your sister's experience is wrong. I'm wondering what ELSE might have been at play here. Breastfeeding was obviously important to your sister.

However, I don't believe for one minute that your conclusion that BREASTFEEDING wasn't worth it is accurate; something obviously wasn't worth it - but it seems to me that breastfeeding is the scapegoat in this scenario.

Since depression can creep up on you, isn't it possible that the low milk supply was really the FIRST symptom of depression and the medication just compounded the already existing situation?

Cathie

iVillage Member
Registered: 03-25-2003
Tue, 05-29-2007 - 1:01pm

"She was on the reglan for about two months."

I just googled reglan and found this: http://www.breastfeeding.org/articles/reglan.html

It does mention severe depression as a RARE side effect. But it also says this:

***Reglan®(Metoclopramide) is usually taken as a 10 mg tablet orally, three or four times a day for a week, then tapered off over the next week.

Cost for 30 tablets is approximately $33 for the brand name Reglan® and $12-15 for the generic brand which is just as effective.
Milk supply usually increases within 2-4 days of starting the medication and pumping 6-8 times per 24 hours.
It is essential that the milk be emptied frequently from your breasts, even at night.***

Maybe she suffered such a severe side effect is because she was on the medication 4X longer than usual? Does anyone have any experience with reglan to know if it's more usual to use reglan in the short term (2 weeks to boost supply) rather than to maintain supply over the long term?

Cathie

iVillage Member
Registered: 05-15-2007
Tue, 05-29-2007 - 1:26pm
Unless you were there to see what my sister went through first hand...then you really don't have a clue wether it was worth it for her to breastfeed or not. Maybe for you it would have been...but that doesn't make it true for everyone...just because it is your opinion. As for how long she took the medicine...I don't know anything about that..I am assuming that it was discussed with her doctor. Bottom line though...breastfeeding isn't always worth it...there are times for some people that it isn't
iVillage Member
Registered: 12-12-2006
Tue, 05-29-2007 - 1:32pm

"I think of it this way... I love gardening. I spent several hours this week planting bushes and trees, it took a lot of work, but I enjoyed every minute of it. Was it "hard"? I don't think so. Time consuming maybe. Physically challenging, definitely. But I don't think I would call it "hard", because to me it implies that it is unpleasant and something I would prefer to avoid. "

Well said. I guess that's where the debate evolved from. I don't equate 'hard' with 'unpleasant'. Maybe it's just me. lol.

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iVillage Member
Registered: 12-12-2006
Tue, 05-29-2007 - 1:36pm

"Where I think our opinions deviate on this is that calling something hard automatically makes it somehow "bad" or something we'd rather not do. Like saying something is hard means it's somehow something to be avoided, something negative, something that makes us unhappy. That is SO far from the truth, at least for me. When I say being a mother is hard, it's because I believe it is - it's hard work, as hard as any kind of work out there, and possibly the hardest job in the world. As someone said, "The toughest job you'll ever love." You can love doing something that is hard work. There's true value in hard work, IMO. "

My sentiments exactly!!!

"Also just wanted to add, I just told my DH what I was typing, and what this thread was about, and he's cracking up. As he put it, "If a man went on there and said being a mother was easy, he'd be strung up and horsewhipped in a nanosecond." LOL, maybe so."

ITA with your dh...many a talk show has been aired for that very purpose, lol

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iVillage Member
Registered: 12-12-2006
Tue, 05-29-2007 - 1:40pm

"And conversely, when I hear people say that motherhood is inherantly "hard", **without qualification** & with only the notion of default martrydom, I think that a) they do not have children, b) they have children, but perhaps lack the resources to adequately care for them, or c) they find the nature of mothering to be unpleasant, restrictive, and/or less valued than other potential pursuits/accomplishments."

Why does 'hard' automatically mean 'unpleasant' or something to be avoided? Haven't you ever enjoyed doing something that required a lot of you? If not, I feel sorry for you....

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iVillage Member
Registered: 10-04-2006
Tue, 05-29-2007 - 1:41pm

This is an interesting link about Reglan, with people posting their experiences. Sounds like an awful drug.

http://www.askapatient.com/viewrating.asp?drug=17854&name=REGLAN

As far as the length of time she was on it, in this link a woman was on it for the same purpose - to increase supply - for only 6 days, and she lists her reaction as severe anxiety and depression as well. So, perhaps it comes down to individual chemistry, but it seems this drug can cause some serious problems, even when used for shorter durations.

iVillage Member
Registered: 12-12-2006
Tue, 05-29-2007 - 1:49pm

""Freedom" for me came with the birth of my long awaited, much planned, and very much desired son, and again with ds2. My friend may have thought that I had "everything" (whatever that means to any individual), but the one thing that I *needed*, more than I ever desired or needed anything else, was the one thing that was discovered just a couple days later, 8dpo. Holy smokes, it was faint, and I had to stare at it, but it was too soon to be an evaporation line. Freedom! Like the experience of mothering, it's a matter of perspective."

I guess I just never fully understood that.... I always was of the ilk that my happiness was *my* responsibility, not my dh's, not my kids'.....I always figured if I have kids, great, if not, that's great too. I knew I could find contentment either way. Like you say, it's a matter of perspective. I know I was a 'complete person' before marriage and kids, and that hasn't changed. I never put my life's happiness on a contingency plan, and I certainly never laid so heavy a load on someone who wasn't even born yet. Ironically enough, I cannot imagine living life without her now that she's here. I guess whether we pine away for our unborn children or not, we fall just as head-over-heels in love either way :)

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